Puppy With Sensitive Stomach

[San&paul]

Hi,

I got my pure bred Cavalier at 6 weeks, ( he's now 10 weeks) the breeder had him on royal canin puppy can & kibble so I followed that, but not even a week later he started bleeding from his bowels & he is always biting his leg like he's crazy itchy. The vet gave him medicine to settle his inflamed tummy & wormed him & said it was common for puppy's & not to worry too much. He was put on a bland diet of chicken & rice until his tummy & runny stools settled down. That was fine, then when I went to reintroduce the can food & kibble, the bleeding started again & he didn't want to eat it much after having chicken. I think the kibble was scratching up his tummy. I took him off it again & it stopped.

So I'm now up to making my own food for him cause I think he might have some sort of sensitivity or allergy maybe?? I don't know if I'm doing the right thing, Ive NEVER owned a pup before & it's really overwhelming!!! I'm trying my best, doing research but I don't have anyone to really bounce off. I'm making him a meatloaf with mince & steamed veggies in it like pumpkin, sweet potatoe, carrots & zucchini, a handful of rolled oats & egg to bind it & then i cook it in oven & I slice it up to portion sizes. I also make chicken hearts with rice, carrots, sweet potatoe & zucchini. He hasn't had any bleeding & loves both of them for now but I need advice am I on the right track? & what else can I make him? The bleeding is all gone & stools are normal, the only thing is he is still biting his leg like he's itchy & I don't know if that's normal, all I know is that he is irritated at night a lot & it makes for a lot of restless sleep for him & myself. I'm getting up through the night doing toiling about 4 times between 8.30pm -7am as he won't sleep through yet & if he wasn't so irritable maybe he would. So please feel free to help me I would be grateful.

Edited August 2, 2014 by San&paul

[Salukifan]

The diet you are feeding has no real calcium in it. He needs a diet balanced in calcium and phosphorus to grow strong bones.

Kibble will not "scratch" a dog's stomach because it is not solid after digestion. If you don't want to feed kibble, you could try chicken necks or wings.

The biting of his leg may be a neurological issue, and not diet related.

I suggest you talk these issues through with your pup's vet. Has he been wormed recently?

Toileting 4 times in 10 hours doesn't sound unusual for a 10 week old pup.

Edited August 2, 2014 by Haredown Whippets

[cavNrott]

You're doing a very good job for a first time dog owner. Well Done. Many experienced dog owners wouldn't go to the trouble to get their dog well as you are doing. If you could access some bone meal it would provide the pup with much needed calcium and phosphorus. You would probably be able to get this at a feed store. You could try the pup with a chicken neck. My Cavaliers were having chicken necks at 8 weeks of age and loving them.

There's no need to feed kibble if your pup is not doing well on it. People may be able to suggest a kibble that is a bit kinder to your puppy. I suggest a better quality puppy kibble such as Canidae if you want to feed the pup some kibble. See if you can access a sample from one of the large pet stores. It's fairly expensive so you don't really want to buy a bag to start with.

About the leg biting. It is not normal. Something is going on there and this is probably what is disturbing the pup's (and yours) sleep at night. Take the puppy back to the vet and explain that this leg biting is a real problem. It's irritating and uncomfortable for the poor little puppy.

If your vet is not able to figure out what's going on there then ask for a referral to a specialist vet. The sooner you get this sorted, the better.

Normally I would suggest asking the breeder for help and asking him/her if any other pups in the litter have the leg biting problem. However I'm guessing the puppy didn't come from a registered breeder because they don't let their pups leave the litter at 6 weeks of age. Unfortunately I doubt the breeder of your pup will be of any assistance so the vet is the way to go.

Please let us know how you get on and keep us updated on your puppy.

[Gretel]

Well said cavNrott.

[Loving my Oldies]

Excellent advice from cavNrott. I'd be adding one more thing: find another general vet.

[Bilbo Baggins]

Well said cavNrott.

I have mulled over this thread since last night and I feel cavNrott has said what I wanted to say in a nicer way.

San&paul all the best with your puppy.

[Ranga]

Good advice from cavNrott :) Constant biting of the leg is something which should be investigated. Is it the same leg the pup bites at?

Also, crushed egg shells are a good source of calcium :) I wash them out and dry them, then crush them in a coffee grinder (or you can use a mortar and pestle).

[goldcav]

San&paul, you are doing a great job with your new puppy and you have already received some great advice from others. Good, natural food is the way to go as all the artificial preservatives, flavours and colours which are in processed (dry and canned) dog foods can cause bad reactions and even if they don't, are not really good for dogs.

Adding crushed egg shells or bone meal to your mixture is a good idea or, as an alternative, you could use chicken frame (or carcass) mince as the crushed bones in this mince are also a good, natural supply of calcium. I would suggest adding green, leafy vegetables (like spinach)to your mix and also parsley and watercress (if you can get it) both of which can help with allergies and itchiness.

Once your puppy has really settled with his new diet and is healthy and active, it would be even better if you stop cooking his food as raw, natural food is even better than cooked, but when/if you decide to do this, change him over gradually.

All my Cavaliers (over many years) have never had any processed food. Their main diet is raw chicken mince with crushed veg/fruit mix and raw chicken necks and they get extras added several times a week, like raw egg yolks, natural yoghurt and fish (mackerel, salmon, sardines or tuna). They are all happy, healthy and active with shiny coats and bright eyes.

Your puppy's problem of biting his back leg could be caused by pain (e.g. depending where he is biting, he could be having trouble with his patella) or it could be irritation from an allergy or bad reaction to something internal (food or medication) or something external (e.g. grass, shampoo, the material in his bedding or something he is coming into contact with). If it is an external contact problem he will probably be making it worse by biting it and you may find it will help him if you can get some anti-itchy ointment or cream to put on it. (Egoderm ointment which is available from a chemist is one which usually works well). As previously suggested, if your vet can't get to the bottom of the problem you may need a second opinion.

Good luck.

[cavNrott]

I can't see any reference to this troublesome leg being the hind leg. San&paul will you please clarify which leg is causing the trouble. Is it a front or a hind leg?

My Cavs are fed a balanced raw diet, well 99% of their diet is raw but I see nothing wrong with giving the occasional meal of cooked food, especially using quality ingredients as this pup is being fed. The rare cooked meal they have does not upset my dogs digestive system.

The cooked diet San&paul is feeding is very similar to the diet I fed my Rottie when she developed cancer and could no longer, for various reasons, have a raw diet. I used organic chicken and organic vegies, the same vegies as this puppy is being fed. I fed no grains though.

San&paul if you could come back and give us an update you will probably receive replies from a few more good Cavalier breeders and owners who may not have yet seen your questions.

[VizslaMomma]

Need a LIKE button for all the response.

[julesluvscavs]

Need a LIKE button for all the response.

Same here :)

I just hope that San&paul comes back and reads all these helpful replies and lets us know how their puppy is getting on :)

Edited August 4, 2014 by Jules❤3Cavs

[persephone]

Nothing much else to say, san & paul - :)

you might enjoy reading this - lots of ideas !

CLICK HERE

and

Click here

Click HERE for a somewhat technical, but thorough and useful guide to dog behaviour , how their bodies /senses work . Understanding some of this helps explain why pups/dogs are doing things like growling/ chewing/ scent marking .....etc

[VizslaMomma]

Need a LIKE button for all the response.

Same here :)

I just hope that San&paul comes back and reads all these helpful replies and lets us know how their puppy is getting on :)

AND has photos!!!!

squuuuueeeeee

[San&paul]

Hi,

I got my pure bred Cavalier at 6 weeks, ( he's now 10 weeks) the breeder had him on royal canin puppy can & kibble so I followed that, but not even a week later he started bleeding from his bowels & he is always biting his leg like he's crazy itchy. The vet gave him medicine to settle his inflamed tummy & wormed him & said it was common for puppy's & not to worry too much. He was put on a bland diet of chicken & rice until his tummy & runny stools settled down. That was fine, then when I went to reintroduce the can food & kibble, the bleeding started again & he didn't want to eat it much after having chicken. I think the kibble was scratching up his tummy. I took him off it again & it stopped.

So I'm now up to making my own food for him cause I think he might have some sort of sensitivity or allergy maybe?? I don't know if I'm doing the right thing, Ive NEVER owned a pup before & it's really overwhelming!!! I'm trying my best, doing research but I don't have anyone to really bounce off. I'm making him a meatloaf with mince & steamed veggies in it like pumpkin, sweet potatoe, carrots & zucchini, a handful of rolled oats & egg to bind it & then i cook it in oven & I slice it up to portion sizes. I also make chicken hearts with rice, carrots, sweet potatoe & zucchini. He hasn't had any bleeding & loves both of them for now but I need advice am I on the right track? & what else can I make him? The bleeding is all gone & stools are normal, the only thing is he is still biting his leg like he's itchy & I don't know if that's normal, all I know is that he is irritated at night a lot & it makes for a lot of restless sleep for him & myself. I'm getting up through the night doing toiling about 4 times between 8.30pm -7am as he won't sleep through yet & if he wasn't so irritable maybe he would. So please feel free to help me I would be grateful.

[San&paul]

Hi guys

Thank you for your positive support!! It's wonderful to hear back from so many beautiful people.

There's so many responses I need to reply to. Im not sure where to start, so I'll start with the breeder, she is a registered breeder & even though I wasn't ready for him, she insisted. I never had anything prepared. I had to rush out & buy food & a bed & it was so hard because he really was like a new born baby. He's 10 weeks now & he still doesn't sleep through the night, so I'm pretty exhausted . Her response to him bleeding from his bowels the second time was " your a clean freak & it's making him sick" .? I told her that is rubbish & I steam mop my floor & use no chemicals. I think she was worried it could cost her money.

In response to another question about the food- so can I just mix his mince meat raw with his veges, when do you reckon I should start him on that? I actually didn't know he could eat raw mince meat, I'm so Nieve lol but I am learning & u guys are great, guiding me.

Response To his leg- it's always the same the leg, inside back left leg. It's not flees, he's clean so I'm not sure what it is but there is a pattern, 4am ish he wakes & starts chewing it.

[Gretel]

Glad you came back to let us know how he's going.

Your breeder may be registered but they are not reputable Puppies must not be sold before 8 weeks of age.

It's fine for him to have raw mince. Have you had him back to the vet about the leg chewing? Since it's always the same I'm suspecting it could be pain.

Edited August 5, 2014 by Gretel

[luvsdogs]

I feed my guys mostly a raw diet, even my son's 4 month old kitten loves it & will even eat a chicken leg. From what I've read about raw diets it's not recommended to feed mince, it's better to cut the meat up in chunks, something pup can chew & it's good for teeth. It's also said that mince meat has more surface area for bacteria to grow. He doesn't really need veggies but if you still want to feed them they are better crushed & raw.

My first Japanese Spitz had a funny tummy for the first year or so I had him. Not good having to wash a dirty white butt every day. Had to be so careful what I fed him, He was also on chicken & rice for a week when I got him. He's now mostly settled with a raw meaty bone diet & occasional grain free kibble.

Puppies are very tiring when young. But in no time at all things will settle down. How are other things going like toilet training? where does he sleep? etc. Have you taken him to the vet/new vet again about his leg?

He's very cute by the way, need more pics. Did you tell us his name?

[cavNrott]

Hi guys

Thank you for your positive support!! It's wonderful to hear back from so many beautiful people.

There's so many responses I need to reply to. Im not sure where to start, so I'll start with the breeder, she is a registered breeder & even though I wasn't ready for him, she insisted. I never had anything prepared. I had to rush out & buy food & a bed & it was so hard because he really was like a new born baby. He's 10 weeks now & he still doesn't sleep through the night, so I'm pretty exhausted . Her response to him bleeding from his bowels the second time was " your a clean freak & it's making him sick" .? I told her that is rubbish & I steam mop my floor & use no chemicals. I think she was worried it could cost her money.

In response to another question about the food- so can I just mix his mince meat raw with his veges, when do you reckon I should start him on that? I actually didn't know he could eat raw mince meat, I'm so Nieve lol but I am learning & u guys are great, guiding me.

Response To his leg- it's always the same the leg, inside back left leg. It's not flees, he's clean so I'm not sure what it is but there is a pattern, 4am ish he wakes & starts chewing it.

Unfortunately the breeder you got your puppy from gives registered breeders a bad name. We need less breeders like her.

I suspect there was blood in this pup's feces before she insisted you take him underage. I can't help but wonder if this and the leg biting is why she insisted you take him early. Maybe this scummy breeder was aware she had a pup with a couple of issues and wanted to rehome him before he cost her money in vet fees. The puppy is lucky he ended up with you and not someone who wasn't cluey enough to ask questions.

10 weeks is very young to expect a puppy to sleep through the night. You should expect to get up at least once to take him out. With luck he should sleep through by the time he's 12 weeks old. You'd be doing yourself and your puppy a favour if you invest in a crate. He can sleep in his crate right beside your bed so you hear him when he becomes restless and needs to be taken outside.

A crate for each dog in my house is an essential. I feed pups in their crates from day one so they learn to love their crates. My Cavaliers are seniors now and they still run into their crates and wait when they see me preparing their meals. The crate doors haven't been closed for years but they go in there for a nap or if I have visitors with rowdy children in tow. My Cavs sleep on my bed at night but this arrangement is not for everyone.

The breeders of my Cavs fed dry food. I gradually introduced them to a raw diet starting from the day they came home. If I were you I would gradually reduce the cooked food and replace some of each meal with raw meat and vegies. Mix a raw egg, shell and all with the vegies in your blender. If you're using minced meat buy good quality minced beef and also look at minced lamb, chicken and turkey. You can start feeding raw chicken necks now. The calcium from the crushed egg shell and the chicken necks provides your pup with calcium. You can prepare the food in bulk and freeze in meal size containers.

About the leg that's driving the puppy nuts. The vet needs to investigate this. Maybe pain is causing him to lick the leg. A patella issue perhaps? Whatever it is needs investigation. Don't let the vet fob you off by saying something like 'he'll grow out of it'. It's happening for a reason and you want to know the cause now.

Please keep us posted on your progress.

[brightstar123]

As everyone else has said, this pup needs a proper veterinary workup. Blood in faeces should be investigated, even if it does resolve with change of diet. Likewise the biting at the leg. Any decent vet would not pass this off as something he'll grow out of. Be very careful of the calcium content in your homemade diet, I would try an alternative high quality brand of commercial food that you can supplement his homemade diet with while he is growing. Both too much and too little calcium/vit D can be dangerous. Also be careful with raw eggs and pups, as raw eggs can be a common source of salmonella and young animals are less able to cope with a high bacterial load than adults.

[temperamentfirst]

A lot of cav breeders don't let their pups go until 10 weeks - your breeder has not done the right thing by you or the pup.

I second the suggestion that you find another vet - perhaps if you tell us where you live we can suggest some good vets for you.

You are doing a great job - and best of all you have asked for help when you were unsure :-)