Please Help? I Am Worried Sick? Is My Border Collie Ok?

[Neigh55]

A good breeder won't let the pups go until they're at least 12 weeks - but in QLD at least there's no legislation on it.

8 weeks for any medium to large breed is quite fine and there is no issue with it. We cannot let them go before 8 weeks of age. 8 weeks is actually a good age. It is in between two fear periods and gives time for the pup to settle into a routine before the next fear period starts. Owners just have to be careful about taking their pups out in public until at least the second course of vaccinations at 12 weeks.

Some small or toy breeds there may be a need to hold them longer due to size/weight.

I guess if you're sure the person you're giving the pup to has half an idea about owning a dog/puppy then 8 weeks would be fine - but it's clear there's people out there that wouldn't have any idea about exposure before the 12 week shots, so it's safer for the breeder to hold onto them until that at least :)

Things, I'm sorry, but I can't let this one go. It's quite misleading information, especially for any pups other than very small breeds. When you read the literature about bonding with new owners, socialisation - i.e. getting used to the world outside the original family, the generally accepted ideal time for the rehoming is between 7 and 10-11 weeks - as Mystiqview says, between fear periods. The reason 8 weeks has been set into purebred registries Code of Ethics and State legislation is that with the older type vaccines, it was the age at which there was a fair chance that pup's first vaccination would have taken effect.

To the OP - like Piper, I didn't comment on the age as it was a done deal, and the pup looked to have landed in good caring hands.

Thankyou for the kind comment - he will be very well taken care of :)

[Neigh55]

I guess if you're sure the person you're giving the pup to has half an idea about owning a dog/puppy then 8 weeks would be fine - but it's clear there's people out there that wouldn't have any idea about exposure before the 12 week shots, so it's safer for the breeder to hold onto them until that at least :)

My breeder no longer keeps puppies until 12 weeks unless they are being exported.

But she knows the families inside out.

Not sure many othr breeders retain them that long anymore.

:)

Yes - I think your right. Unfortunately he came to me at a young age, but I will put in the work to make up for it :)

[Rebanne]

A good breeder won't let the pups go until they're at least 12 weeks - but in QLD at least there's no legislation on it.

um no, toy breeds maybe but larger pups are more then ready to go to new homes at 8 weeks

[Things]

Guess my friend must be old hat, she swears by 12 weeks. Breeder preference I suppose :)

[Tassie]

I completely understand the concern about him being so young, but it has been longer than a week and the breeder is NOT going to take him back. He will be 8 weeks in 4 days. Every Sunday a place near me has dog training. I can assure everyone, as SOON Bobby has had his second vaccinations, taking him to the dog training place is my FIRST priority. In fact, I am prepared to take him to agility classes every second weekend, as well as taking him to farms and large areas so he can have a proper run around. I have lots of dogs living near me and I will definitely go the extra mile to socialise him as much as possible. I know that my situation is not ideal, but this puppy will be showered with so much love and care, as well as exercise and mental stimulation. I am very confident I will raise a beautiful dog. Please no more comments about taking him back to the breeder. It is just not a possible option. But apart from that, thankyou all for the positive comments. I was in a bad state and you have no idea how much help this has been :)

If you can find a good (i.e. not just free for all) puppy pre-school near you, it is possible to start classes in safe environments before the puppy has had the second vaccination. (They are usually held at vet surgeries - but be sure it is a well-run one.)

Please be aware that you hopefully won't be taking Bobby to agility training before he is quite a bit older and has had some general training - many clubs require dog/handler teams to have done a few months of obedience training, and while you can do quite a bit of foundation and ground training in preparation for agility, most people delay any serious agility training on jumps etc. until after the pup's growth plates have closed - likely about 12-14 months in a Border Collie.

Having said that, there is heaps of great foundation training that you can start now which will be good for all kinds of sports . I second/third the recommendation to have a look at kikopup's YouTube Channel (Emily Larlham) for some great ideas.

It's worth mentioning too that not all Border Collies really enjoy the close company of random unknown dogs. A lot of them prefer their close trusted group of friends, and can have a large personal space in relation to other dogs. This is not necessarily a bad thing - it's just the way they are. IMHO, it's most important to ensure that your Border Collie is closely bonded to you, and is comfortable with all sorts of people.

[Rebanne]

Yes - I think your right. Unfortunately he came to me at a young age, but I will put in the work to make up for it :)

only thing I would do differently is feed the little guy 4 times a day for another couple of weeks. A meal could be as simple as a raw chicken wing.

[luvsdogs]

When I was a child, decades ago, we always got our puppies & kittens at 6 weeks. Even in '93 when I got my 1st BC from a breeder friend, she was only 5 weeks & 5 days old. And in 2000 my son brought home a pup from a BYB workmate at the same age. I think the rules about 8 weeks came in somewhere in between. They were both wonderful dogs to live with but even though my BC went to obedience & agility training 5 times a week she was a little snappy with some dogs. I had to always be aware what she was doing. My present BC was just on 12 weeks when I got her.

I would be more concerned that this pup's parents had been cleared for CL, TNS & CEA.

Also it's not a good idea to over exercise a pup under 12 months of age because of possible damage to growing joints & bones. Exercising the brain as stated above is the way to go.

You can join this site for free & get free downloadable books on puppies too.

www.dogstardaily.com

[Dave73]

I think Bobby has landed in a loving caring home where he will be looked after very very well. Neigh55 you will be fine and so will Bobby.

[luvsdogs]

Forgot to add, photos of your little pup are a must, especially as he's a BC. :D

I also echo kikopup, she's amazing & coming to Sydney in Oct/Nov for a conference.

[Salukifan]

Nothing to add except go easy on the tugging - its hard on a growing spine.

Ditto for exercise - nothing like agility or running with you or beside a bike until he is 12 months of age at least.

Good obedience training will shape his focus on you and occupy his mind - a good start to dog sports no matter which direction you go.

Im guessing you probably didn't get a starter sheet with feeding guidance? What are you feeding him?

One more thing, if agility is what you want to do, hold off on desexing until he's at least 12 months old too - he'll have better bone density amongst other things.

[Mystiqview]

Following on from the above. Being male, hold off desexing him until he's at least 12 months of age. After 18 months. Boys need their testicles for more than just reproduction. Teach him good toilet training manners and he can be just as clean to live with as a female.

Many unwanted behaviours are not necessarily because they are entire. But because they were not taught any better. Some here will disagree with later desexing, but at least look into it, especially if you are wanting to do agility. There is research showing males that were desexed before maturity, grew differently, changing the angles of their bones and some studies have shown an increase in hip displacia in males that were desexed early.

You will be fine. There are a lot of things you can teach your pup from your armchair and won't harm his growth and give him mental stimulation. Grab Dr Katrina and the Wonderdog's "Tricks and Training". Some great little tricks and things you can teach him.

[Neigh55]

When I was a child, decades ago, we always got our puppies & kittens at 6 weeks. Even in '93 when I got my 1st BC from a breeder friend, she was only 5 weeks & 5 days old. And in 2000 my son brought home a pup from a BYB workmate at the same age. I think the rules about 8 weeks came in somewhere in between. They were both wonderful dogs to live with but even though my BC went to obedience & agility training 5 times a week she was a little snappy with some dogs. I had to always be aware what she was doing. My present BC was just on 12 weeks when I got her.

I would be more concerned that this pup's parents had been cleared for CL, TNS & CEA.

Also it's not a good idea to over exercise a pup under 12 months of age because of possible damage to growing joints & bones. Exercising the brain as stated above is the way to go.

You can join this site for free & get free downloadable books on puppies too.

www.dogstardaily.com

Thankyou very much for this - I will try to socialise him as soon as possible :)

[Pretty Miss Emma]

Whereabout is Vic are you Neigh? Just thinking that maybe we can help narrow down a decent puppy preschool for you and possibly good training close to your area.

My BC boy had long days alone when he first came home, but he was set up well for it - lots of food in puzzles to keep him busy. Once I got home from work he was with me, did things with me and slept in his crate in my room. He has grown up to be a really well adjusted boy (although we are currently going through some sooking when he knows where I am and can't be with me!!). To be honest I don't walk my 2 anywhere near as much as I would like to, summer may change that. But there is a lot of mental work for them. We do dog dancing weekly, obedience every day (in short bursts) and we go herding once a month at least. I also take them most places with me and they have a more active social life with their friends than I do!! As I think Tassie said be prepared that they often don't like the company of random other dogs. My 2 adore their friends, they make new friends, but really they have little interest in socialising with random dogs and they don't like meeting dogs on lead in the street.

Come visit the BC thread in the breed sub-forum and get some more BC specific info there!!

[Neigh55]

I think Bobby has landed in a loving caring home where he will be looked after very very well. Neigh55 you will be fine and so will Bobby.

Thankyou very, very much. It's comments like these that really help :)

[Neigh55]

Nothing to add except go easy on the tugging - its hard on a growing spine.

Ditto for exercise - nothing like agility or running with you or beside a bike until he is 12 months of age at least.

Good obedience training will shape his focus on you and occupy his mind - a good start to dog sports no matter which direction you go.

Im guessing you probably didn't get a starter sheet with feeding guidance? What are you feeding him?

One more thing, if agility is what you want to do, hold off on desexing until he's at least 12 months old too - he'll have better bone density amongst other things.

Thankyou for the tips about the exercise - I will definitely take it easy until he is a bit older.

At the moment I am feeding him Supercoat Puppy with Real Meat.

http://www.vetnpetdirect.com.au/supercoat-puppy-with-real-meat?gclid=CNnagvqQ1r8CFZCSvQodr24Aig&gdftrk=gdfV25674_a_7c2113_a_7c7895_a_7c86214#.U8zi0fmSwXw

[Neigh55]

Following on from the above. Being male, hold off desexing him until he's at least 12 months of age. After 18 months. Boys need their testicles for more than just reproduction. Teach him good toilet training manners and he can be just as clean to live with as a female.

Many unwanted behaviours are not necessarily because they are entire. But because they were not taught any better. Some here will disagree with later desexing, but at least look into it, especially if you are wanting to do agility. There is research showing males that were desexed before maturity, grew differently, changing the angles of their bones and some studies have shown an increase in hip displacia in males that were desexed early.

You will be fine. There are a lot of things you can teach your pup from your armchair and won't harm his growth and give him mental stimulation. Grab Dr Katrina and the Wonderdog's "Tricks and Training". Some great little tricks and things you can teach him.

Thankyou for the note about desexing - That is something I will definitely want to do for Bobby's health and well-being :)

[VizslaMomma]

Yes - I think your right. Unfortunately he came to me at a young age, but I will put in the work to make up for it :)

I think both you and the new puppy are going to be very happy.

You are making such a good effort to do everything OK.

Been great to read the the thread.

Good Luck.

[Neigh55]

Whereabout is Vic are you Neigh? Just thinking that maybe we can help narrow down a decent puppy preschool for you and possibly good training close to your area.

My BC boy had long days alone when he first came home, but he was set up well for it - lots of food in puzzles to keep him busy. Once I got home from work he was with me, did things with me and slept in his crate in my room. He has grown up to be a really well adjusted boy (although we are currently going through some sooking when he knows where I am and can't be with me!!). To be honest I don't walk my 2 anywhere near as much as I would like to, summer may change that. But there is a lot of mental work for them. We do dog dancing weekly, obedience every day (in short bursts) and we go herding once a month at least. I also take them most places with me and they have a more active social life with their friends than I do!! As I think Tassie said be prepared that they often don't like the company of random other dogs. My 2 adore their friends, they make new friends, but really they have little interest in socialising with random dogs and they don't like meeting dogs on lead in the street.

Come visit the BC thread in the breed sub-forum and get some more BC specific info there!!

I live in Sunbury currently, but I will try to move closer to my daughter in 6 months or so (Mornington, Rosebud area). It will be a struggle to find a rental that allows pets but I am more than prepared to go the extra mile to get a nice, secure backyard. That is my highest priority. Like you, I will try to take him to new places as much as possible. As for the friend subject, there are a few people around me that would love to socialise THEIR dogs more, even a doggy catch up perhaps? :) Thankyou for the reply :)

[Neigh55]

Yes - I think your right. Unfortunately he came to me at a young age, but I will put in the work to make up for it :)

I think both you and the new puppy are going to be very happy.

You are making such a good effort to do everything OK.

Been great to read the the thread.

Good Luck.

Thankyou very much for taking the time out to read this - This forum was such a great idea and I have talked to some brilliant, kind people. Have a great night

[Pretty Miss Emma]

Puppy pre-school... Go to Jean's Puppy Pre-school in Niddrie. It's not too far and she is a trainer (not just a vet nurse who has been asked to run a puppy class), she will be able to offer good advice and runs a well structured puppy class that provides good safe socialisation for the puppies as well as teaching the owners some good basic obedience and puppy problem solving information. My 2 went to her and it suited us really well, also I know of about 8 other puppies that have been there and it has been great for them. Google it and you will find details.

In terms of an obedience school, have a look at Sunbury obedience but I would also suggest going to have a look at Keilor Obedience Dog Training Club (which runs in Airport West/Niddrie), there are also others in the area they are just the ones I know about. go and watch a class and speak to committee instructors before signing up, you need to be happy to what you are signing up to!