Two Dogs Attack A 10-year-old Boy In Bellambi

[twodoggies2001]

In an interview with the owner he said that one of the dogs called straight off and that he had to prise open the other dog's jaw.

If I am correct aren't both dogs destined for euthanasia? Even the dog who called off on command?

Already been PTS. Owners volunteered it.

The dogs were purchased after a violent home invasion. That is probably why they were in the front yard.

From what I read into this is that the owners purchased these dogs because of their inclination to attack, therefore anyone entering the property is open to attack. Not a great idea because of what we have all seen happen.

[Amax-1]

I agree 100% with HW's last post. Children make mistakes- they shouldn't have to suffer consequences like this for such an error of judgement.

What do you propose a motorist should face when a child suffers a judgement error and steps out in front of a car?....just saying

The dogs were purchased after a violent home invasion. That is probably why they were in the front yard.

If the dogs did the job properly given that they were in the front yard, they should have been at the gate stopping the child from entering......he must have got in before they alerted on him and attacked?

From what I read into this is that the owners purchased these dogs because of their inclination to attack, therefore anyone entering the property is open to attack. Not a great idea because of what we have all seen happen.

The sad thing with some consultation with dog people, they only needed one good GSD trained to work the fence line where most GSD's advertised for re-homing would be capable with a minimum of training and cost effectiveness but would otherwise be stable pets too. They don't need massive territorial drive to fend off cowards, barking and a bit of attitude in the dog of a known protection breed is all it takes as a strong deterrent to entry. It's a shame the child had to suffer as he did from the wrong choice of dogs.

Edited July 10, 2014 by Amax-1

[twodoggies2001]

I agree 100% with HW's last post. Children make mistakes- they shouldn't have to suffer consequences like this for such an error of judgement.

What do you propose a motorist should face when a child suffers a judgement error and steps out in front of a car?....just saying

Not quite the same. The dogs were most likely bought as protection dogs and were able to access the front yard. Your example is a split second error of judgement.

[Staffyluv]

I have the kids over behind me, jumping my fence almost daily to retrieve toys they toss in the yard..

I have asked them and their parents repeatedly not to let them do it - the way they come over, is near a section of corrugated iron and it is old and sharp..

But again, today I had to ask them to get off my chicken coop and out of the yard.

These guys are around 10 years old but just won't listen and their parents don't seem to give a crap. I explained that I have foster dogs here and maybe one day, they won't be kid friendly - so please don't come in the yard..

Apart from erecting a large fence (which I don't think would stop them anyway - the current fence is 1.5m paling), there is nothing I can do to stop them..

[twodoggies2001]

I have the kids over behind me, jumping my fence almost daily to retrieve toys they toss in the yard..

I have asked them and their parents repeatedly not to let them do it - the way they come over, is near a section of corrugated iron and it is old and sharp..

But again, today I had to ask them to get off my chicken coop and out of the yard.

These guys are around 10 years old but just won't listen and their parents don't seem to give a crap. I explained that I have foster dogs here and maybe one day, they won't be kid friendly - so please don't come in the yard..

Apart from erecting a large fence (which I don't think would stop them anyway - the current fence is 1.5m paling), there is nothing I can do to stop them..

Could you suggest to the family that what they are doing is trespass

[tdierikx]

I'd be suggesting that the Police visit the little turds and explain to them the dangers of entering other people's yards uninvited...

T.

[The Spotted Devil]

I'd be suggesting that the Police visit the little turds and explain to them the dangers of entering other people's yards uninvited...

T.

Yup.

[Staffyluv]

I'd be suggesting that the Police visit the little turds and explain to them the dangers of entering other people's yards uninvited...

T.

I have told them they are trespassing and that I would contact the police if it was kept up ages ago.

Police are not really interested in something so simple - I did ask about it once a couple of years ago and they did say, they are just kids.

They are right but it wouldn't be nice if I did get a foster dog that was protective of the yard and I didn't realise until too late.

[Salukifan]

Amax:

Cosmolo, on 10 July 2014 - 02:49 PM, said:

I agree 100% with HW's last post. Children make mistakes- they shouldn't have to suffer consequences like this for such an error of judgement.

What do you propose a motorist should face when a child suffers a judgement error and steps out in front of a car?....just saying

Can't say I think this is a good analogy but I'll run with it.

If you want to own a high performance vehicle, well and good. Make damn sure its serviced regularly, that its brakes work and that you don't allow people with minimal driving skills behind the wheel.

Don't leave it parked with the keys in the ignition so some young joy rider can steal it and write themselves off.

And if you drive to the speed limit and the road conditions and a child steps in front of your car? You'll never forgive yourself if you harm that child but you can put your hand on your heart and say "I did everything possible to make my car safe".

Edited July 10, 2014 by Haredown Whippets

[Simply Grand]

You own dogs that have committed a sustained attack on a child who did nothing more than walk in the front gate of your property.

The child entered the territory for which the dogs were defending.....the dogs were not targeting attacks on children.

You had to beat them off. It took time to do it. The child has sustained over 20 punctures to chest, arms, legs and buttocks. He had to be evacuated to hospital in Sydney for surgery and is in a serious condition.

Yes, that's normal behaviour for dogs defending territory in unison to stop entry of an unfamiliar person.

This child belongs to one of your neighbours.

Mum and dad could have educated the child not to enter the neighbours yard especially given that the yard was signed. I doubt the neighbours didn't know the dogs were there?

And you think that putting dogs to sleep that you struggled to get off this child was "idiotic"?

The dog's weren't targeting attacks on children, they were defending territory which is what dogs of territorial drive do.

What sort of a future would these dogs have? And what sort of life would you have wondering when the next child might be attacked?

Perhaps the dog owners have been victims of serious assaults or home invasions and territorial driven dogs help them sleep at night.

And I do mean "when" because for these dogs, it wasn't speculation that they could and would maim a child. They'd done it.

Territorial drive doesn't reserve it's self for only children. The dogs may have been quite social away from their territory and be fundamentally good stable dogs.

I adore my dogs. But if they'd done this, they'd not see another day.

Parents need to educate children that dogs can defend territory and not to enter enclosures containing dogs without the dog owner's presence.

If you have not socialised your dog not to see children as such a threat to property that they will be maimed and if you wish to own dogs whose drives and temperament will see them do this then you have a responsiblity to contain them in a manner that does not see them do this. The consequences for the dogs and their victims are dire.

As a community, we need to understand that kids are not adults, they don't think as adults and the consequences of behaviour may not be considered before action. Hands up everyone who as kids did everything their parents ever told them? Not many hands are there.

And I'm sorry but I do not consider the sort of dog that will commit this kind of attack as merely "defending territory". If you have a dog that sees a 10 year old child as such a serious threat, then lock it the hell away from your front door. Most dogs do not maim intruders as a first response. 20 puncture wounds is one hell of an opening "warning".

Exactly HW, especially the bolded bit.

Regardless of the legalities, regardless of fault, regardless of the intended purpose of the dog (even of it was to be an actual guard dog) there is no way that this was a justifiable or desirable response from a stable dog. If a dog does not have a stable temperament as a base AND has DEMONSTRATED that it will react with aggression if pushed (as opposed to warn/avoid/shut down) then it's a dangerous dog.

Amax you talk about stable temperament and good nerve all the time, surely you can see that whichever dog it was that couldn't be called off is an example of the opposite.

ETA just noticed that you commented that they could be good, stable dogs in other circumstances. IMO it's either a good, stable dog in all circumstances or it's not stable. If the dog does not react in a predictable and appropriate manner when pushed how is stable?

Sad that the other dog got caught up in it (if it is fact that it called straight off)

Edited July 10, 2014 by Simply Grand

[Sabbath]

I'm not at all heartless but I can't feel so bad for the child that the dogs, while in their own yard, being dogs, should be destroyed. It's just not right. It's reactionary and pointless. Keep out of people's yards. Easy. I don't care if it's a child. You can't argue the death of a dog over the injury of a child. If the dogs were at large or almost in any other circumstance I could understand.

I know a few of you like to get all aggressive and then indignant when called on it, but this wouldn't have happened if the kid didn't enter the yard. Not the fault of either dog. It's really quite simple. Unfortunate, even sad but avoidable.

Rather than laws being in place to favour intruders and trespassers, I'd like to see it favour personal responsibility and common sense. Yes even for a 10 year old.

[megan_]

Even if the gate was unlocked?

I believe that the whole " the law favours intruders" is largely a myth. The owner elected to have the dogs PTS in this instance.

Edited July 10, 2014 by megan_

[Serket]

It's very sad for the dogs and obviously for the child as well, I hope he recovers quickly

I worry all the time that my yard is not secure enough, both gates are locked from the inside with combination padlocks and fences are secure....but the one day in 3 years that we forgot to put the padlock back on the gate after gardening on the weekend, an idiot courier decided to deliver a package into the backyard rather than leave it at the front. My dog is more likely to lick someone to death rather than attack, but I worry most about her being let out. I was so angry with the courier, who strangely cut the label off the package so I couldn't easily identify the company (I know who it is and have since complained), but it does show how important it is to keep gates locked. I couldn't believe they came into my yard because as gentle as my dog is she certainly doesn't sound it when strangers come to the house. I never leave home now without double checking the gates.

[Sabbath]

Even if the gate was unlocked?

I believe that the whole " the law favours intruders" is largely a myth. The owner elected to have the dogs PTS in this instance.

Yeah I agree that there is a load of rubbish about intruders suing for dog bites, injuries and so on. What I can't agree with is that an owner is responsible for the actions of trespassers. I can understand an owner feeling like the offering of the dog for destruction is almost an apology. Not one I'd be making.

[megan_]

But someone walking into an unlocked front yard isn't an intruder - the law says you must provide safe passage to your front door.

[Sabbath]

But someone walking into an unlocked front yard isn't an intruder - the law says you must provide safe passage to your front door.

Maybe that's what I disagree with. I'm not sure that it works as a law when things like this happen. I'm not saying I advocate aggressive dog behaviour or anything silly but I don't like the idea that if someone enters my yard that I am responsible for their actions.

[cavNrott]

I agree 100% with HW's last post. Children make mistakes- they shouldn't have to suffer consequences like this for such an error of judgement.

Of course children have to suffer the consequences of their actions/mistakes that is the natural order of things. How else would we learn? In this case the consequences were very harsh indeed but I bet that child will never again climb a fence to gain access to someones property.

The dog owners also are also suffering the consequences of their actions. I'll also wager they will never again allow their dogs access to the front of their property where strangers also have access.

The dogs also suffered the consequences of their actions. They're dead.

All humans and animals suffer the consequences of their actions, either immediately or eventually. If we're smart, we learn from those consequences. The prisons are full of people suffering the consequences of their actions.

Has it been established whether or not the 10yo boy's brother was in fact inside this property?

efs

Edited July 10, 2014 by cavNrott

[Salukifan]

I'm not at all heartless but I can't feel so bad for the child that the dogs, while in their own yard, being dogs, should be destroyed. It's just not right. It's reactionary and pointless. Keep out of people's yards. Easy. I don't care if it's a child. You can't argue the death of a dog over the injury of a child. If the dogs were at large or almost in any other circumstance I could understand.

I know a few of you like to get all aggressive and then indignant when called on it, but this wouldn't have happened if the kid didn't enter the yard. Not the fault of either dog. It's really quite simple. Unfortunate, even sad but avoidable.

Rather than laws being in place to favour intruders and trespassers, I'd like to see it favour personal responsibility and common sense. Yes even for a 10 year old.

Many dog owners are horrified when their dogs aggress. I don't know what these dogs owners thought their dogs were capable of but my guess is that it wasn't this. Seeing your dogs attack a child, would be an absolutely horrific experience. i think more than a few dog owners would PTS their dogs if they maimed a child.

[Sabbath]

I'm not at all heartless but I can't feel so bad for the child that the dogs, while in their own yard, being dogs, should be destroyed. It's just not right. It's reactionary and pointless. Keep out of people's yards. Easy. I don't care if it's a child. You can't argue the death of a dog over the injury of a child. If the dogs were at large or almost in any other circumstance I could understand.

I know a few of you like to get all aggressive and then indignant when called on it, but this wouldn't have happened if the kid didn't enter the yard. Not the fault of either dog. It's really quite simple. Unfortunate, even sad but avoidable.

Rather than laws being in place to favour intruders and trespassers, I'd like to see it favour personal responsibility and common sense. Yes even for a 10 year old.

Many dog owners are horrified when their dogs aggress. I don't know what these dogs owners thought their dogs were capable of but my guess is that it wasn't this. Seeing your dogs attack a child, would be an absolutely horrific experience. i think more than a few dog owners would PTS their dogs if they maimed a child.

I understand. I think I'd be mortified if my dog was to ever do something like that. I just don't agree with emotion ruling when logic would make a fairer assessment. If my dog attacked anyone while in my presence without provocation I would have a hard time justifying keeping him. A stranger enters without invitation? Different story.

[Her Majesty Dogmad]

I wonder if the little boy had met the dogs previously and thought he'd be safe to enter the yard as he knew them or something?

I think it would be hard to stomach keeping your dog alive, no matter how much you loved it, if you witnessed it attacking a child (or anyone) so viciously and having to beat it off.

I was talking to someone last week who was trying to rehome one of her two dogs. The dog she was planning on keeping was a dog that had ripped into her other dog causing it to require surgical treatment, same dog had killed 3 of her cats and generally left her and her friends a bit scared whenever it was around - growling at them when it was in the house etc. It weighed 50 kilos she told me.

I said it was plain dangerous, an accident waiting to happen and she should euthanase it. She was indecisive, felt she couldn't do that. It's people like this - who don't do the right thing - that put everyone at risk.