Why Are Smart People So Dumb?

[schnauzer]

They "want" to believe what the pet shop tells them - that they are from a good "breeder".

This is Katie, a bitch we rescued this year from a puppy farm who sells to Sydney pet shops.

This is the mother of their pet shop puppy

[miss2]

a friend of mine has an oddle. her parents loved the dog and wanted one just like it, they went out and bought an oddle from a pet shop and couldn't understand why there's has such a different personality...

[BlaznHotAussies]

I have friends who bought a "pedigree" (I'm guessing that means bred from limited register parents in this case??) OES from a pet shop. They insist she was from a breeder but what kind of breeder would sell to an interstate pet shop?

These are both university educated (one of them is in her last year of med school!!!) people and very smart! And two days before they bought their pup they were asking me if I knew any Aussie shepherd litters coming up because they like my dog.

Edited July 7, 2014 by Scootaloo

[teekay]

It's not that they are stupid. Most people these days just want to do what is most convenient for them and they really don't believe or don't particularly care about stories of puppy farms etc. They want a pretty pup, they want it now and they want to buy it in an easy process.

Yep. Not stupid. Just arses.

Nice. So I am either stupid or I'm an arse!

I bought a Samoyed x GR from the internet 5 years ago. I fell for the spiel. The GR will make the Samoyed coat more manageable. Made sense to me at the time. I do not think I was 'stupid', just ill informed. I did not know the horrors of puppy farms at the time. Thanks to this and other dog forums I have now been educated, thankfully without too much judgement from most people. Making one mistake does not make one stupid or an arse. Making the same mistake again, once educated, that is stupidity.

With regard to the convenient factor, yes that does come into it but do not underestimate how intimidating it can be for an average person to approach some registered breeders. Many people think registered breeders are for those who want to show and they 'just want a pet'. We need to somehow try and get the word out there that the registered breeders are not scary, and will welcome a good pet home for their litters.

[Mrs Rusty Bucket]

I have two friends who dote on their puppy mill specials. The dogs attack and harass big dogs on lead, they've got back and arthritis problems and incredibly bad teeth. It's to the point where one is on steroid drugs to function, and the other can barely walk and they're not yet ten years old.

But the friends' daughter likes these dogs so much she went and got two more from the same "breeder" and I expect she will be up for thousands more than she really needed to fork out at the vet as well.

[taffy]

or, according to someone I know, they "dont have the time to suck up to breeders and go to dog shows" and all registered breeders are unethical.

This was after they saw a breed they liked, called a breeder and got offered a pup the same day, didn't bother about health testing of the parents. Now said pup has expensive health issues. Next time they are just going to get a cross because according to them reg breeders are scams

:banghead:

[cannibalgoldfish]

It's not just dogs My best friend who I consider an educated intelligent person told me she is getting a Birman kitten from a "breeder" (I haven't had a chance to find out what that means in this case) She is allergic to cats and within 5 minutes of meeting her soon to be kitten was tearing up and sneezing but "she will get used to it" if not "my mum is happy to take him"

I doubt it's a registered breeder because who would sell a kitten to someone with allergies? (she would have mentioned it, she wouldn't try to hide the fact) but if it was I do feel a little sorry for them because I know this kitten will be passed along.

(Actually, if my friend told them she has allergies and they still happily sell her a kitten then I don't feel very sorry for them, just the kitten)

[shapeshifter]

Sometimes all it comes down to is 'what the heart wants', there is a photo going around facebook of a golden retriever x dachshund, there would be so many things wrong with that cross BUT how many people would see it and go 'ohhhh soooo cute, I want' regardless of what their brain says about 'wrong'.

[DobieMum]

Sometimes all it comes down to is 'what the heart wants', there is a photo going around facebook of a golden retriever x dachshund, there would be so many things wrong with that cross BUT how many people would see it and go 'ohhhh soooo cute, I want' regardless of what their brain says about 'wrong'.

I've seen that photo and all I can think of is OMG the mating, no matter which way it went.

[cannibalgoldfish]

That's not what the heart wants, that's what the hormones want :D

[RuralPug]

It is lack of education combined with an instant shopping mentality and clever marketing (this will never ever shed because one parent is a woolled breed - therefore you won't ever have to vacuum or dry clean dog hairs and they are magically non-allergenic as well!!!). No mention of course of the huge investment in time or money for grooming if it does inherit a woolled coat...

Sadly, some of those breeders believe their own marketing - that is wilful stupidity, in my book.

[Leah82]

I lived with someone for a couple of months who she said she had a 'cavoodle' before moving in, but apparently she didn't like the curly haired ones in Perth where she lived at the time so shipped one over from Melbourne. Upon meeting the dog it was clear the oodle part was purely a marketing ploy created by the pet shop because it looked like this...

[Remarkabull]

There has been more people than usual advertising pups for sale on FEB sites up here and there were a few comments that made me cringe. One guy was telling everyone (with great authority I might add) that crossbreed don't have any genetic problems and purebreds are nothing but trouble. This was after someone was trying to explain that a purebred from a registered breeder is a better choice as they will have been tested for any genetic issues in the breed etc. The guy also went on to say that he would prefer a pup from a byb because at least they aren't kept in cages all day like registered breeders dogs are.

[The Spotted Devil]

Hybrid vigour

Breeder provided papers

No health problems with the parents

I read that in the past 5 minutes!

[Leah82]

There has been more people than usual advertising pups for sale on FEB sites up here and there were a few comments that made me cringe. One guy was telling everyone (with great authority I might add) that crossbreed don't have any genetic problems and purebreds are nothing but trouble. This was after someone was trying to explain that a purebred from a registered breeder is a better choice as they will have been tested for any genetic issues in the breed etc. The guy also went on to say that he would prefer a pup from a byb because at least they aren't kept in cages all day like registered breeders dogs are.

don't you know that only backyard breeders keep their dogs in the backyard, that's why they got the name :p

[teekay]

There has been more people than usual advertising pups for sale on FEB sites up here and there were a few comments that made me cringe. One guy was telling everyone (with great authority I might add) that crossbreed don't have any genetic problems and purebreds are nothing but trouble. This was after someone was trying to explain that a purebred from a registered breeder is a better choice as they will have been tested for any genetic issues in the breed etc. The guy also went on to say that he would prefer a pup from a byb because at least they aren't kept in cages all day like registered breeders dogs are.

The problem is, the general non dog savvy public are only ever exposed to the 'bad' breeders. The press love to report on the breeders being investigated by the RSPCA. That pedigree dogs exposed show is also very much responsible for an awful lot of this negativity towards breeders. Some how we need some national tv exposure of the ethical registered breeders informing everyone what the process involves, the costs, the tests, the bloody hard work that comes with raising a litter, why buying from them is the best chance you can get, no guarantee obviously, but the best odds of getting a healthy dog.

We can come on here and talk about how stupid people are for buying a x breed, byb etc., but all that will do is turn people away. this thread is not in off topic. We need to educate. We need to be approachable. We need to be non judgemental. We have an awful lot of negative press to fight against.

I also think it relevant to refer the the other thread on here, about the possible new bsl regulation for the brachy breeds. Resorting to regulation to stop registered breeders breeding unhealthy dogs. A move I support but not a good look for the registerd breeder world,. More fodder for the anti breeder brigade.

Edited July 8, 2014 by teekay

[miss2]

i saw this add today which annoyed the heck outta me

http://www.allclassifieds.com.au/pets/dogs-puppies/foxy-pugs-to-give-to-a-good-home/ad4240eee6b378c44c89958f3dbd6d49619c

Especially this bit " Both were professionally bred,"

[RuralPug]

[

We can come on here and talk about how stupid people are for buying a x breed, byb etc., but all that will do is turn people away. this thread is not in off topic. We need to educate. We need to be approachable. We need to be non judgemental. We have an awful lot of negative press to fight against.

I also think it relevant to refer the the other thread on here, about the possible new bsl regulation for the brachy breeds. Resorting to regulation to stop registered breeders breeding unhealthy dogs. A move I support but not a good look for the registerd breeder world,. More fodder for the anti breeder brigade.

Yes...educate. And plot to disseminate that education as widely as possible, both to breeders and potential purchasers.

But if you are going to regulate at all then regulate EVERY breeder, including the accidental once-in-a-lifetime oops forget to desex down the road AND the high volume puppy farmers AND the once a year BYBs as well as registered breeders (some of whom may be also in the other categories, dammit). Whether they are producing purebreds or cross breds or complete Heinz varieties. And then actually police the laws you make (this is where regulation fails dismally in this country IMO).

I think Switzerland has got it right with some of their legislation - before you can become a new owner you must pass a basic course demonstrating your understanding of the needs of your chosen dog, how you can meet those needs, the needs of society re your dog and how you can meet those needs. Sort of Responsible Dog Ownership. And you are also I believe required to have your new dog or puppy pass some sort of Canine Good Citizen exam within a certain number of months of acquisition.

Breeders there have to pass courses that demonstrate they understand all the things we talk about when we say "ethical breeder" - I think ( or do I just hope? Finding out the details of the Swiss owner and breeder courses is on my to-do list but it might be a while before that particular round tuit reaches the top of my in tray. Ooooooh has any DOLer already done that research and would care to share with us all? ).

WARNING: RANT HERE - please feel free to ignore entirely:

I reserve the right to be judgemental of breeders (of ANY stripe) who ignore the opportunities to learn the laws and regulations already in place, or who flout them after becoming aware of them or who take no care to learn basics like selecting and caring for healthy, well-socialised broodstock with appropriate temperaments, how to rear puppies to maximise their chances of a healthy and happy life and how to provide new owners with the information they need to know to continue maximising that puppy's chances. Minimum. Basic. Ethical breeders go a lot further than that, but those basics are an acceptable start.

I also reserve the right to be judgemental when acquaintances/friends/family approach me for advice in helping them choose their next canine family member and after I have spent happy hours over weeks or more pointing them to breed selection quizzes, explaining the difference between ethical breeders, merely acceptable breeders and bad breeders, what to expect from pound adoptions vs rescues vs FTGH on the local buy/swap/sell page, trying to gently set any misconception straight and discussing with them the decisions that they need to make before they even start looking yada yada yada...

.. and then they suddenly appear grinning from ear to ear with an underaged poorly bred cute thing from a pet shop or gumtree ad making a complete mockery of the whole process -

Damn right I'm judgemental then for exactly the same reasons I'm judgemental of uncaring breeders.

[RuralPug]

i saw this add today which annoyed the heck outta me

{link deleted by quoter}

Especially this bit " Both were professionally bred,"

I'm not sure that it's within forum rules to actually post a link of that type that but in the case of that particular cross, favoured of puppy farms, perhaps "professionally bred" in the sense of "the oldest profession" is accurate.

I take your point, though, it definitely would be misleading to the general public, including that poor owner. I bet they were really cute as puppies.

Is there any chance that there is a small breed rescue close to you that you could alert to that pair? At least they are desexed so no danger from that side of it. :)

Edited to add - I've just looked at the "additional info" section of that ad and the owner has been completely hoodwinked by the puppy farm, as he has written YES to the pedigree papers? question even though he is aware they are crosses of two different breeds. He hasn't used a "designer breed" name or anything. Perhaps the puppy farm supplied him with a document giving the names of each parent for the dogs and he honestly believes that equates to pedigree papers.

Exactly the kind of lack of education that we are talking about. Maybe the next home will equally proudly believe that they own a pair of pedigreed cross breeds. Oh by the way I do not apologise for being judgemental of that breeder.

Edited July 8, 2014 by RuralPug

[alpha bet]

We have to accept that there are many in the public who do not want to go to the welfare and get themselves a rescue dog but instead would like to bring a puppy into their home.....

Personally I don't wish to remove this right from a family to go and get a pup of their choosing.... after all it is important for future generations of humans - remember that many now are living in big houses on small blocks and often minute landscaped gardens with fake grass..... to have a dog is often the first real contact kids have with 'mother nature'.... Lifestyles have changed in the last 30 years and families have different needs from their dog so we have to consider that there are many breeds that no longer are suitable for the average family, hence we see the small/medium sized 'OOdles' fitting the mould that might be better suited.

So why do so many of these families pay big bucks to the petshops and online commercial breeders - Well I run training classes / boarding kennels and am also a breeder, so understand a great deal where many of these families are coming from. these are common senarios I have come across.

1. Perhaps they think of getting a pedigree dog and often they ring around and email breeders (often from DOL) - but no one gets back to them..... so eventually just go and look elsewhere.

2. Often families look up breeders sites online but then come across comments about having to agree to contracts etc. which sounds very complicated and at times I have looked up these contracts and been surprised at how negative they are towards the future pet owner.

3. Have met Families who have visited breeders to see pups (sometimes more than once) even thought they were getting a particular pup in the litter and then to receive an email or have it posted on facebook that they have been unsuccessful in getting a pup. Not even the good manners to ring and explain.

4. Families have contacted Dogs Vic for information and listings - however there are no pups on record and even those that are are so out of date and pups are already homed.

5. Public don't understand that it could take 3-12 months to get a pup.....

6. Families have purchased dogs from registered breeders and not received paperwork even 12 months later......!!!!!

Pure Dog Breeders need to be more professional in the way we treat enquiries from the public.... we are often the first port of call and we are the ones who create the impression... For the public it is a daunting process as many of the breeders are difficult to talk to and often come across as judgemental....

Just consider some of the threads here where DOL members are very judgemental about how and who they will sell their puppies.

So where else can the public get dogs if not from us.... they have to resort to petshops or online.

Edited July 8, 2014 by alpha bet