Gottalovealab Posted June 26, 2014 Share Posted June 26, 2014 Oh come on... That's far from helpful. Thought there is a school of thought that premature desexing of large breed dogs can be very detrimental to their correct growth? There is. But there is also the school of thought to do it very early on in puppyhood. People are not always as informed about dogs and puppies as we are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oakway Posted June 26, 2014 Share Posted June 26, 2014 Is the breeder of this dog a recognised breeder registered with your states controlling body ? and does this person hold a recognised prefix, if yes, what register is it on. ?. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salukifan Posted June 26, 2014 Share Posted June 26, 2014 (edited) Talk to the pup's breeder and get a second opinion from a good vet. Also bear in mind that less than perfect hips doesn't necessarily equate to life as a cripple. Keep the pup lean and fit and he may have many pain free years. If your first vet is talking surgical intervention now, run a mile (and my guess is that's what's on the agenda) What you need is more information and now. Edited June 26, 2014 by Haredown Whippets Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kamuzz Posted June 26, 2014 Share Posted June 26, 2014 Another vote for Karen Hedberg at North Richmond. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mystiqview Posted June 26, 2014 Share Posted June 26, 2014 Is the breeder of this dog a recognised breeder registered with your states controlling body ? and does this person hold a recognised prefix, if yes, what register is it on. ?. Cannot see how this is very relevant to the issue at this point in time. It does not matter if the dog is from a large recognised kennel or small. Main register or limit. Or even byb. The fact is just simply the dog has been xrayed and one vet has indicated HD/ED. I think the fist point is to verify this initial diagnosis. I think it is important to let the breeder know - however I also think the best thing is to investigate the initial diagnosis and maybe present both sides to the breeder so they can work through it if it is verified. If it is nothing, then why bother the breeder in the first instance? The only difference between registered breeders is may be is getting some insight into any genetic issues within the line - registered vs unregistered. Just being registered does not mean a breeder is ethical or they will support the puppy buyer. Even good small breeders hip/Elbow score. Even dogs with perfect scores can produce HD puppies. HD/ED is also environment. There may be a genetic predisposition to the disorder and environmental factors can influence severity and when it shows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ish Posted June 26, 2014 Share Posted June 26, 2014 The pup is from a registered breeder - the prefix is in the first post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tobie Posted June 26, 2014 Share Posted June 26, 2014 Further to Ish's comment the original post also states that the owner has attempted to contact the breeder but is waiting for a response. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gsd_glenwood Posted June 26, 2014 Author Share Posted June 26, 2014 You may wish to contact bianca.a on here, she has been through this with her youngster, I am sure she would be amenable to giving advice :) Thanks 'Trifecta'..Will do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gsd_glenwood Posted June 26, 2014 Author Share Posted June 26, 2014 Hi ! I am new to forums in general..and posting this as I have found myself suddenly knee deep in vet bills. My family and I purchased a pedigree(Kaisterstern) male pup in March( he was born in January), He is a very affectionate pup and boisterous. We did puppy preschool and in the last couple of months noticed a change in his movement. Initially we thought - his rabbit like movement when we first got him was cute puppy behaviour.... At his desexing our vet did xrays and confirmed hip and elbow dysplasia - more so his right elbow and hip. Anyone else who might have purchased from a litter born January17 this year? ( I did try to contact the breeder and email - no response as yet). As he is only a puppy - could it be he is just a goofy pup growing up fast? ( he weighs now 24 kgs; fed on Blackhawke, fresh bones) Thanks for listening! Sim You had him desexed before he was mature, your vet xrayed an immature puppy and declared he's got ed and hd, what a shemozzle all round that one is. Speak to the breeder, which is what you should have done in the first place before you whipped off his nuts and ruined any chance of correct growth and development. Oh come on... That's far from helpful. Actually - it was the breeder that recommended the desexing and the vet concurred. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VizslaMomma Posted June 26, 2014 Share Posted June 26, 2014 Another vote for Karen Hedberg at North Richmond. Mine as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gsd_glenwood Posted June 26, 2014 Author Share Posted June 26, 2014 one thing i have noticed in recent years, is an increase of many vets and even some so called specialists are very quickly jumping onto the bandwagon of XYZ dog has HD or ED because it is pedigree. I will certainly not dispute that it COULD be on an increase - especially in breeds with known issues. I have also seen quite a bit of soft tissue injury/strain due to the nature of play/environment (particularly in pups or young dogs) be mis diagnosed as HD or ED. When treated for the soft tissue injury, they have come good. It could be a strain/sprain of soft tissue somewhere caused by a puppy being a puppy. If you have not done so already - I would get a second opinion from a good vet Chiro, It may still be HD/ED, but if its not, you may save yourself thousands in vet bills and unnecessary surgery if its only soft tissue and not HD/ED. A couple of operations they can do is to toggle the ball joint to the hip - downside with this op is the toggle can break. The other main option is to remove the femur head altogether and allow the muscle, scar tissue and tendons support the joint. I have been through the second of the above options as one of my dogs jumped out of my husbands car while it was travelling about 60km/hr and badly dislocated her hip, smashing the bottom of the cup. 6 months after the operation, you would not know to see her that she has no joint on that side. Of course there are restrictions, but overall you could not tell. When we had the operation there was a lab in the surgery (old dog) who had both sides done due to HD. Apart from a waddle, again you could not overally tell it had not hip joints. You do need to keep the muscle tone up and weight off. Edit: I had one so called specialist here in Brisbane say a nine month BC had OCD of the shoulder. She had an injury to that shoulder by getting her foot caught between at the top of the gate and post on a 3 foot chainwire fence. She had damaged her ligaments in the front of the shoulder. Because she was pedigree and 9 months - this so called specialist claimed OCD and wanted to operate. Despite me telling them about the injury only a month before. Soft tissue injuries take a long time to heal. I saw a second vet/chiro specialist and he showed me on the same xrays taken at the previous specialist, where he had gotten it wrong. I later found out the original specialist was good at pushing the HD/ED/OCD in pedigree dogs... She was treated for the soft tissue injury. She is now 8 years old and going strong, no limp, no surgery, no OCD. Hi! Thanks for the time to give me a detailed reply.. Hopefully my replies are posted properly (new to forums in general).. Actually thanks to all who responded. He is a very active pup and has an english mastiff cross(7mth old pup) as a playmate. Will get a second opinion - the vet @ Richmond -from someone elses post.. will be my next move .. So far my furbaby has cost me a pretty $$ at the vets the last month with xrays, injections and daily pills. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VizslaMomma Posted June 26, 2014 Share Posted June 26, 2014 [ Thanks for the time to give me a detailed reply.. Hopefully my replies are posted properly (new to forums in general).. Actually thanks to all who responded. He is a very active pup and has an english mastiff cross(7mth old pup) as a playmate. Will get a second opinion - the vet @ Richmond -from someone elses post.. will be my next move .. So far my furbaby has cost me a pretty $$ at the vets the last month with xrays, injections and daily pills. You are doing very well with your posts. You have a big concern, and are trying to seek best resolution. Might I ask how often and how long these two puppies play together? Is their play supervised? Two active youngsters might be the key to his presenting with issues. The other dog is possibly/probably strong enough to knock your puppy around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oakway Posted June 26, 2014 Share Posted June 26, 2014 Is the breeder of this dog a recognised breeder registered with your states controlling body ? and does this person hold a recognised prefix, if yes, what register is it on. ?. Cannot see how this is very relevant to the issue at this point in time. It does not matter if the dog is from a large recognised kennel or small. Main register or limit. Or even byb. The fact is just simply the dog has been xrayed and one vet has indicated HD/ED. I think the fist point is to verify this initial diagnosis. I think it is important to let the breeder know - however I also think the best thing is to investigate the initial diagnosis and maybe present both sides to the breeder so they can work through it if it is verified. If it is nothing, then why bother the breeder in the first instance? The only difference between registered breeders is may be is getting some insight into any genetic issues within the line - registered vs unregistered. Just being registered does not mean a breeder is ethical or they will support the puppy buyer. Even good small breeders hip/Elbow score. Even dogs with perfect scores can produce HD puppies. HD/ED is also environment. There may be a genetic predisposition to the disorder and environmental factors can influence severity and when it shows. It may make a big difference if the breeder is not a registered breeder with their states controlling body. It won't make much difference to the dog but it may be more helpful to new owner if they had some course of redress. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WreckitWhippet Posted June 26, 2014 Share Posted June 26, 2014 (edited) If the pup does have a problem it's going to be worse of now it's been desexed and will lack the hormones necessary for correct growth and development. What on earth makes people think that neutering a large breed dog before it's mature is in any way good for the dog and vets of all people should know better. Another ignorant owner, breeder and vet and the pup is the one that suffers. Edited June 26, 2014 by WreckitWhippet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted June 26, 2014 Share Posted June 26, 2014 Yes, it is very sad that both breeder and vet agreed to castrate at such a young age . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bianca.a Posted June 26, 2014 Share Posted June 26, 2014 My Cooper's surgeon said to not neuter him until at least after his second THR. I was never going to anyway but he said the hormones would help somehow (bit of a memory fog). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salukifan Posted June 26, 2014 Share Posted June 26, 2014 My Cooper's surgeon said to not neuter him until at least after his second THR. I was never going to anyway but he said the hormones would help somehow (bit of a memory fog). Better bone density and different angle of the femur into the socket - shorter femurs on undesexed dogs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gsd_glenwood Posted June 26, 2014 Author Share Posted June 26, 2014 Far more experienced people than me will be able to give you some great advice, in the meantime I'd recommend having a read through some of the links here: http://www.gsdcv.org.au/vet_info Particularly the growth disorders and rate of weight gain downloads. From my understanding a GSD pup can look a bit wobbly when going through certain growth periods, but I would have thought it was a bit early yet for a firm diagnosis. Best of luck to you and your pup! Hi ! Thanks for your repl and the link for more info. Much appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gsd_glenwood Posted June 26, 2014 Author Share Posted June 26, 2014 (edited) [ Thanks for the time to give me a detailed reply.. Hopefully my replies are posted properly (new to forums in general).. Actually thanks to all who responded. He is a very active pup and has an english mastiff cross(7mth old pup) as a playmate. Will get a second opinion - the vet @ Richmond -from someone elses post.. will be my next move .. So far my furbaby has cost me a pretty $$ at the vets the last month with xrays, injections and daily pills. You are doing very well with your posts. You have a big concern, and are trying to seek best resolution. Might I ask how often and how long these two puppies play together? Is their play supervised? Two active youngsters might be the key to his presenting with issues. The other dog is possibly/probably strong enough to knock your puppy around. Hi! Good point.. they are with each other most of the time (they share the backyard as their respective owners share a house).. they are also inside alot and are presently side by side on the sofa Zzzzz.( yes the humans here help him up/off the sofa) Edited June 26, 2014 by gsd_glenwood Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VizslaMomma Posted June 26, 2014 Share Posted June 26, 2014 Hi! Good point.. they are with each other most of the time (they share the backyard as their respective owners share a house).. they are also inside alot and are presently side by side on the sofa Zzzzz. Have they been together long? Is there any chance their friendship/playing might have knocked your pup around? Dogs tend to mask illness & pain. Just wondering if anything changed since they became 'bessies'? Has the house stairs etc as well? Love to see a photo of the pair! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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