Yonjuro Posted August 21, 2014 Author Share Posted August 21, 2014 ...perhaps this subject needs it's own thread? :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sagittarian Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 Actually, we are a friendly bunch in general. :-) If someone are going to set up a website as a petfood and nutrition expert and offer advice, then it is probably normal to get some mixed responses, questions and an interest in what your background is. Going back to Sunday Pets, the ingredients are broken up into groups. I had to put my glasses on to see the tiny commas and full stops, but they are there. :laugh: Sags Well you're a friendly bunch! Honestly, stating "frighteningly inaccurate" is simply unconstructive criticism. Curious as well. I just read the review for another food and there is information about protein, mentioning Duck and Turkey and then peas (stated as being 5th igredient but actually 6th) as the only significant forms of protein in a particular food - completely overlooking that the 4th ingredient is red lentils (protein around 25 grams per 100). Good that someone wants to have a go, but it needs to be correct information as it is set up to offer advice. It depends on whether you take "duck and turkey meat" as one ingredient or two... it's listed as one. Yes I overlooked red lentils - now updated - I only wrote that review yesterday in my lunch hour. Honestly, I posted on this thread as I was interested in the "meat and bone meal" in this food. I expected a rational discussion, not a witch hunt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-o Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 If someone are going to set up a website as a petfood and nutrition expert and offer advice, then it is probably normal to get some mixed responses, questions and an interest in what your background is. Yes, I realise that... at the heart of it I'm another dog enthusiast who cares about their pets, and probably should've signed up as such. Happy to answer any questions and take any criticism, but perhaps via PM or a separate thread. I didn't mean to hijack this one, sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J Lawrence Posted August 24, 2014 Share Posted August 24, 2014 I've read this whole thread... but is this really a good food?? Looking at the grain free ingredients it seems it's mostly non-descriptive meat & bone meal, which makes the "100% New Zealand Grass fed Lamb" they advertise slightly insignificant. When I see that in a pet food, it makes me wonder what quality the "meat & bone meal" is, which is largely open to interpretation. If it's from a decent source they'd say so, and if it was a quality ingredient then they'd be using that in their marketing, wouldn't they? Hi Pet Food Reviews. I'm Jennifer Lawrence, rep. for Holistic Pet Foods which distribute Sunday Pets and Canidae in Australia. I have a long history in pet nutrition but importantly am a dog person (Tholia ESSs and in a former life Groundswell Dobes) with - like a lot of peeps on this forum - an enquiring mind. I'd like to take this opportunity to point to the description "grass fed" pertaining to the lamb and beef proteins. I'd also like to point out the list of ingredients and the percentage thereof that's in Sunday Pets formulas. I've never seen a company (marketing in Australia) that's willing to do this. Ten points from me in the transparency stakes. Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J Lawrence Posted August 25, 2014 Share Posted August 25, 2014 Anybody got any questions for ME :-)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JulesP Posted August 25, 2014 Share Posted August 25, 2014 Jennifer you might want to clarify what this means - Meat & Meal(min 32%) including Meat & Bone Meal, Organic Beef, Organic Free Range Lamb, Fish Meal. What is the bolded ingredient exactly. At the moment I am not sure if this is just badly written or has some random meat & bone meal in it that could be anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-o Posted August 25, 2014 Share Posted August 25, 2014 Hi Jennifer, Credit where credit's due, it's great to see percentages. I'd love to see Purina do that with their "cereal by-product" based foods. In the case of Sunday Pets grain free, the main ingredients are Meat & Meal(min 79%) including Meat & Bone Meal, Free Range Lamb and Fish Meal. Once cooked the lamb will lose it's water content, making this fairly insignificant in the food, and as such I'd like to know what comprises the "meat and meat meal" content and where it's sourced. Fish meal is also non-descriptive. Appreciate your feedback, thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sas Posted August 25, 2014 Share Posted August 25, 2014 J Lawrence - I don't think the statement in the ingredient panel of 'Meat & Meal' looks positive. We are generally educated that where it says 'Meat' and does not specify which type that this is low grade meat by-products. Why is it do you know that they have opted to state it like this rather that say Fish Meal, Lamb? Forgive me if I'm mis-understanding it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J Lawrence Posted August 25, 2014 Share Posted August 25, 2014 To JulesP and Dav-o (and Great Dane Rescue) Firstly, apologies for taking all day to get back onto the forum. It is my understanding that the "meat & meal" encompasses the grass fed beef and lamb. At least that's how I interpreted it. But I agree that it needs clarifying and Holistic Pet Foods will seek a written statement from SPs as to what's what. When I receive that, I'll advise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sagittarian Posted August 25, 2014 Share Posted August 25, 2014 Having met the owners of Sunday Pets, and spoken to them about the product, that is also my understanding - it's just that the wording is not what we are all used to on a bag of food. There is plenty of information on the website about the types of fish that are used, why they are the selected fish, and about the source of the other ingredients. For example, grass fed, free range lamb and beef - NZ farmed. Sags :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cavNrott Posted August 25, 2014 Share Posted August 25, 2014 J Lawrence - I don't think the statement in the ingredient panel of 'Meat & Meal' looks positive. We are generally educated that where it says 'Meat' and does not specify which type that this is low grade meat by-products. Why is it do you know that they have opted to state it like this rather that say Fish Meal, Lamb? Forgive me if I'm mis-understanding it. No by-products are listed on any of the Sunday Pet Food bags. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-o Posted August 26, 2014 Share Posted August 26, 2014 I contacted Sunday Pets and they sent the following reply: The meat and bone meal comes from the off cuts of both lamb and beef. I'll leave you to interpret "off cut"... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danois Posted August 26, 2014 Share Posted August 26, 2014 Meat and Bone Meal is defined in AAFCO definitions as follows: Meat and Bone Meal - the rendered product from mammal tissues, including bone, exclusive of blood, hair, hoof, horn, hide trimmings, manure, stomach and rumen contents, except in such amounts as may occur unavoidably in good processing practices. NZ follows this in absence of its own standard b Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sas Posted August 26, 2014 Share Posted August 26, 2014 Meat and Bone Meal is defined in AAFCO definitions as follows: Meat and Bone Meal - the rendered product from mammal tissues, including bone, exclusive of blood, hair, hoof, horn, hide trimmings, manure, stomach and rumen contents, except in such amounts as may occur unavoidably in good processing practices. NZ follows this in absence of its own standard b Exactly my concern. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saig Posted November 16, 2014 Share Posted November 16, 2014 Hi Jennifer, I've wanted to try this food for a while and have been reading with interest the reviews everyone have been posting. As I have large breed pup, I was wondering if you had the 'average or as fed calcium phosphorous %. The website just has minimum %. Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gretel Posted November 16, 2014 Share Posted November 16, 2014 Vienna went off eating breakfast until I started giving her Taste of the Wild again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sagittarian Posted November 16, 2014 Share Posted November 16, 2014 Hi Jennifer, I've wanted to try this food for a while and have been reading with interest the reviews everyone have been posting. As I have large breed pup, I was wondering if you had the 'average or as fed calcium phosphorous %. The website just has minimum %. Thank you. I think I have this info on my laptop so will update tomorrow if nobody has replied. Sags :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saig Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 Cool. Could You please provide the calcium: phosphorous % or grams per kcal if you have it for the large breed puppy and large breed adult? Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sagittarian Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 Calcium/Phosphorus 1.2%:0.9% Calories 3825 kc/kg No Large Breed adult available at this stage, however, what is marketed as small/med has the same Cal/Phos ratios and is more of an all breeds food in my opinion. Sags :) Cool. Could You please provide the calcium: phosphorous % or grams per kcal if you have it for the large breed puppy and large breed adult? Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cavNrott Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 I wonder what happened to Jennifer, the rep, for Sunday Pet Foods. She hasn't been back to reply to any of our questions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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