Dog Crying When Left Alone

[Sylvie]

My neighbor have a 1 year old poodle cross who hates being left alone. She cries, and cries, and howls as soon as the owner left. It has became a real problem as a few other neighbors complained to the council and left a few nasty notes on her door. It has been going on since they got the dog. I did recommend to try and crate train her and even provided a crate when she was a puppy, but the poor dog got sick in it and that was it for the crate.

I've tried to help to get on top of the problem, printing the NILIF program and the Great Dane Rescue info sheet about separation anxiety. We also, a few month ago, introduced her to our dog so we can keep her with us when they really need to go out for a long period of time. I also gave the contact of a recommend trainer who came last week or the week before.

I take her home if I hear her for more than 1/2 hour (I did again yesterday). We don't really want that to be the solution but while they are trying to find a solution, I am happy to do it.

Yesterday the owner told me that they were going to put her down because they did not know how to fix her and did not want to pass on the problem to someone else. I hope it was just a saying and they are going to try and implement what the trainer gave them first. I am not sure what to do. I am pretty new to dog ownership and don't feel it's my place to give them advice. This little dog is such a sweetie,and can settle down pretty quick if she is with someone. She just cannot do it on her own. And she is still a puppy and full of energy.

If it come to that end would suggesting contacting a rescue group be a good idea? Would a rescue take a young dog with this type of problem?

[dididog]

It sounds like they might be throwing in the towel early. Is the dog only being vocal? No trying to escape/self mutilating? If not it sounds like they might not be bothered with trying to fix this poor puppy's situation as Im sure working with a good trainer or behaviourist would help with a milder case of separation anxiety. As for rehoming, if the dog had extreme destructive behaviours brought on by separation or bad dog/human aggression than yes it would be irresponsible to pass on a behaviour problem so bad however it sounds like this puppy's behaviour may be managable. At least try and get an evaluation from a behaviourist and if they are confident the puppy can be helped then maybe rehoming would be a good option. An owner who is home often will be better able to ease the puppy into learning its okay to be left alone. I know this is an awkward situation for you because it is somebody else's dog but please try to talk to them about putting her down. If placed with an experienced rescue who could oversee the rehoming properly she could very well be rehomed and rehabilitated and live a full happy life. It'd be a shame for a by the sounds of it lovely, young dog to be put to sleep because its owners haven't tried to help rectify an issue they are probably at least partly responsible for. (Going off the assumption they didn't do much work as a baby puppy in getting her used to being alone/that they haven't really been implementing the resources you have been giving them from the sound of your post.)

Its great you care and have tried to help though. I am no expert with separation anxiety (if that's actually what this is) just my thoughts.

Edited February 24, 2014 by Terri S.

[Guest Ams]

How long have they been working with the information you gave them to try and correct the behaviour? If she has been like this since a puppy it is now fairly entrenched behaviour and will take a very long time to fix, if ever. How long ago did you give them the info from GDR? Have they had time to implement any of it to see if it works?

It is very easy to say the owner has given up too early but that may not be the case. It may be the owner has the right of it and the pup is not suitable to be placed into rescue as this will add further stressors to the dog. This is a dog that is already highly stressed and we don't know what other behaviours it is manifesting within the house whilst it is vocalising. Some dogs simply have weak temperaments and there is nothing you can do to make them comfortable. Sometimes pts is not the worst thing that can happen.

I have just had the experience of placing a dog that I found to be an extremely easy dog to own, in a trial home and despite no prior indicators of separation anxiety, it certainly had them in that home. There was no damage to the house but the dog worked out how to open the internal door to the garage within a few days, then locked itself in the garage. Video footage in the second week (after me saying if they didn't video behaviours I would simply come and get the dog) showed it pacing continually and whining all day. This dog was not suitable for crating as he didn't like being crated in my home. He would settle eventually but you can't crate a dog for 10 hours a day whilst you are at work and he didn't see a crate as a secure place.

The family worked with me and started changing morning routines, used adaptil, etc to see if we could help reduce stress, but by day 13 the dog got itself entangled in blind cords in a window where it hung upside down all day. By the time the family found him in the afternoon, the cord had cut through the leg just above the hock on his back leg and he had nerve damage to the foot. The dog is now back with me and with the assistance of Jane Harper we are now looking at how to return the confidence to the dog. For what its worth he will be rehomed into a multi dog household next time, as within a week of being back I audio taped my house when I was out and not a single one of the 6 dogs here made any noise at all during a three hour outage which showed he is quite comfortable with company, just not being alone. This family were not in a position to own two dogs.

[dididog]

It is very easy to say the owner has given up too early but that may not be the case. It may be the owner has the right of it and the pup is not suitable to be placed into rescue as this will add further stressors to the dog. This is a dog that is already highly stressed and we don't know what other behaviours it is manifesting within the house whilst it is vocalising. Some dogs simply have weak temperaments and there is nothing you can do to make them comfortable. Sometimes pts is not the worst thing that can happen.

You are right Ams, sometimes dogs just don't have great temperaments and this dog may very well be in that boat, hence suggesting the dog be properly evaluated before considering rehoming as the dog may never be ideal. But as you can see from your anecdote sometimes a change of situation can help a dog, perhaps this dog needs people home more often or a doggy friend which this family can't provide whilst trying to work through the issue. Plus the fact that the dog is fine once the OP brings her home led me to believe the dog doesn't like being alone in general rather than being separated from its owner is reassuring for the possibility of rehoming.

As the OP only said what she had done to help but provided no follow up on how the dog reacted/any improvements I was working under the assumption the owners haven't been implementing this help. Also as you said, 12 months is a long time and the behaviors would be very entrenched by now and the fact they only just sought a trainer's help due to the OP's suggestion also led me to believe they perhaps haven't been too committed to helping their dog thus far. But obviously all assumption and I may be completely wrong.

To the OP, do you know what the trainer said? Did they provide instructions and help or did they advise pts as it seems their decision to do so has coincided with meeting the trainer. Have the owners tried the things you've suggested?

[Guest Ams]

It may be the owners have tried all sorts of things are being polite to the OP when she makes suggestions without saying they have already tried a - z of options. I know that is how I would deal if my neighbours approached me with suggestions to "help" me with the dogs. They don't need to know what I've tried and is not necessarily their business either. I personally wouldn't be going and taking the dog either as, to my mind, it is providing a bench mark for the dog that if it barks or cries for x amount of time then someone will come and get it and it gets to have company.

In answer to the OP if you wish to suggest they contact Lynne Keen of Small Dog Rescue and Poodle Rescue she may be able to help.

http://www.petrescue.com.au/groups/10400

[dididog]

Well it sounds like OP is friendly with her neighbours and that they have been taking on her advice if they used the trainer. I imagine as a person with a lot of dog experience you would find it patronising if somebody tried to give you their help. It sounds like OP is coming from a good place though and it is probably a little bit of her business if she has to put up with the dog howling and barking all day.

This reminds me of a situation with family friends of ours. They had a pom x foxie that would bark and bark and bark when left alone and one day the neighbour brought it over. They then had a bit of an agreement that if the dog was barking too much that the neighbours would look after it which started all sorts of complications when the neighbours would take the dog to their house, then leave the dog alone at their house while they went out. My friend regularly came home to her dog locked in the neighbours house barking her head off with my friend unable to go get her dog. When my friend suggested the neighbours stop taking the dog they got all nasty and said my friend didn't deserve the dog and would regularly take it and keep it at their house without them knowing. They were probably right about my friend not deserving their dog, in the 6 or 7 years I knew them they went through 4 dogs. They would buy a puppy, raise it badly, get rid of it when it was a few years old and behaved badly then buy a new puppy, raise it badly and continue the vicious cycle.

Anyway OP I agree with Ams in that you taking the dog won't be helping in the long run but neither is whatever the owner may or may not be doing at the moment and it is probably hard not to snap when it has been barking non stop for ages. You can try suggesting a rescue and see how it goes as ultimately it is their decision. I personally believe rehoming could be worth a shot in the event that perhaps the owners haven't tried many methods or aren't prepared to try working with a behaviorist because a responsible rescue probably wouldn't let a dog with unmanageable behaviors be rehomed past the foster stage.

[dididog]

accidental triple post

Edited February 24, 2014 by Terri S.

[dididog]

accidental triple post

Edited February 24, 2014 by Terri S.

[Sylvie]

It may be the owners have tried all sorts of things are being polite to the OP when she makes suggestions without saying they have already tried a - z of options. I know that is how I would deal if my neighbours approached me with suggestions to "help" me with the dogs. They don't need to know what I've tried and is not necessarily their business either. I personally wouldn't be going and taking the dog either as, to my mind, it is providing a bench mark for the dog that if it barks or cries for x amount of time then someone will come and get it and it gets to have company.

In answer to the OP if you wish to suggest they contact Lynne Keen of Small Dog Rescue and Poodle Rescue she may be able to help.

http://www.petrescue...au/groups/10400

Thanks Ams and Terri S.,

It is a difficult situation but we are in pretty good term with the neighbor and their dog. The dog is pretty much free range and often wanders on the street and come to our place on her own: she has been taught to be street conscious and even if I don't agree with letting her off leach in the open front yard it is their dog. We went twice for a walk around the block with the dogs and we are keeping an eye/ear on each other dog as good neighbors should do.

I hope they are not too upset that I try to help, but when I went there one night, a few other neighbors were on the street discussing the problem while the poor dog was carrying on. When I went at the back there was a very nasty note on the gate promising to take care of the dog if nothing was done.

To try and clarify a few point, I gave them the crate in the first week they got the dog as they could not find a place for her to settle at night (and during the day). I gave them the NILIF and GDR info only maybe a month ago and they saw Jane Harper last week. From what I was told, Jane said that there was not much wrong with the dog and they are still reading the program she sent them.

So it has been going on for quite a while where they mainly tried to let her alone as little as possible. I hope that with a (fair) bit of work she can learn to stay on her own without stressing as much. I don't know if she would be destructive, but she will try to escape (she did a few times) and now she is tied on the backyard patio when left alone.

The other thing I would like to convince them is to walk the dog every day as she is hardly walked. She has plenty of play time and zoomies but she might need more structured exercise. But I don't want to impose myself or seem rude as I say I am hardly an expert. I hope Jane's program make sense to them and they stick to it.

[dididog]

Thanks Ams and Terri S.,

It is a difficult situation but we are in pretty good term with the neighbor and their dog. The dog is pretty much free range and often wanders on the street and come to our place on her own: she has been taught to be street conscious and even if I don't agree with letting her off leach in the open front yard it is their dog. We went twice for a walk around the block with the dogs and we are keeping an eye/ear on each other dog as good neighbors should do.

I hope they are not too upset that I try to help, but when I went there one night, a few other neighbors were on the street discussing the problem while the poor dog was carrying on. When I went at the back there was a very nasty note on the gate promising to take care of the dog if nothing was done.

To try and clarify a few point, I gave them the crate in the first week they got the dog as they could not find a place for her to settle at night (and during the day). I gave them the NILIF and GDR info only maybe a month ago and they saw Jane Harper last week. From what I was told, Jane said that there was not much wrong with the dog and they are still reading the program she sent them.

So it has been going on for quite a while where they mainly tried to let her alone as little as possible. I hope that with a (fair) bit of work she can learn to stay on her own without stressing as much. I don't know if she would be destructive, but she will try to escape (she did a few times) and now she is tied on the backyard patio when left alone.

The other thing I would like to convince them is to walk the dog every day as she is hardly walked. She has plenty of play time and zoomies but she might need more structured exercise. But I don't want to impose myself or seem rude as I say I am hardly an expert. I hope Jane's program make sense to them and they stick to it.

It's a bit concerning that they allow their dog to just roam. It sounds like some of the barking may come from a bit more than just being left alone. If it isn't walked or mentally stimulated with regular training and then tied up all day (does it get things like kongs or puzzle balls to keep it occupied?) then I'm not surprised it barks all day. Hopefully they take on board what the trainer has said, it seems like they need a bit of a lifestyle change where it comes to their dog not just fixing the separation problems. Your description sounds hopeful for rehoming though but there is no telling if the dog is better off after training and exercise if the owners don't do it that much. It's also a bit concerning that after being met with the news there isn't much wrong with their dog and given professional advice to help the situation their reaction was pts

Also my anecdote was not trying to make it sound like you were outstepping your bounds or upsetting them or anything, it just reminded of a similar situation. The dog would probably be better of with you than roaming the street or being hurt by angry neighbours!

Edited February 24, 2014 by Terri S.

[Rosetta]

The trouble with those programs is that they are very lengthy and require a lot of dedication. These people do not sound as if they would be willing to put in that amount of work if they can't even be bothered creating a secure place for the dog to be contained. Is the dog left alone all day? The dog would probably be better off in another home with another dog for company. It seems too early to condemn the dog to PTS without trying other options such as a secure, confined place for the dog, anxiety wrap and other such aids - even a vibrating collar. It sounds like the dog is just lonely.

It is a very stressful situation but worrisome if neighbours are threatening the dog and I can understand that you want to help.

[Sylvie]

I really hope that the "put down" comment was just in the heat of being upset, coming home, seeing other neighbors down the street thinking they were speaking of it and me coming to say that the dog was with me because it has been winging for a while (she also had received an SMS from one of the other neighbor). It is pretty hard and they are trying at least not to let her alone for too long now. She used to be alone at least half a day every day of the working week, now she is hardly alone a few hours once or twice a week. It is still uni holidays I think and my husband is home at the moment so he can take her if need be.

Although I asked them to drop her at our place if we are home and they know they are going for a while they never did, but I guess it might be bit embarrassing and they just don't want to take advantage. I'll try to speak with tonight and maybe convince to come with me and take their dog to agility.

[Rosetta]

I really hope that the "put down" comment was just in the heat of being upset, coming home, seeing other neighbors down the street thinking they were speaking of it and me coming to say that the dog was with me because it has been winging for a while (she also had received an SMS from one of the other neighbor). It is pretty hard and they are trying at least not to let her alone for too long now. She used to be alone at least half a day every day of the working week, now she is hardly alone a few hours once or twice a week. It is still uni holidays I think and my husband is home at the moment so he can take her if need be.

Although I asked them to drop her at our place if we are home and they know they are going for a while they never did, but I guess it might be bit embarrassing and they just don't want to take advantage. I'll try to speak with tonight and maybe convince to come with me and take their dog to agility.

If that is the case I think the neighbours are being a bit intolerant. Hopefully the trainer gave the owners some good general guidelines around straight forward strategies to try first and not just a lengthly program which is a challenge for even the most dedicated people.

[Guest Ams]

Let them know if they ring Lynne Keen to let her know Jane Harper has done a consult. Jane may be willing to share her professional opinion with a rescue group which will aid with rehoming if the owners decide to go own that track.

[Amax-1]

My neighbor have a 1 year old poodle cross who hates being left alone. She cries, and cries, and howls as soon as the owner left

Puppy farms and poor breeding is a great place to source unstable temperaments. Do people not know that many registered and dedicated breeders go to great lengths in parental selection and early puppy imprinting to produce pups of stable coping mechanism.

[Sylvie]

My neighbor have a 1 year old poodle cross who hates being left alone. She cries, and cries, and howls as soon as the owner left

Puppy farms and poor breeding is a great place to source unstable temperaments. Do people not know that many registered and dedicated breeders go to great lengths in parental selection and early puppy imprinting to produce pups of stable coping mechanism.

Well, what can I say. Sadly I think most people don't have any idea about that .

I saw the neighbor yesterday evening. They are having a bit of a hard time at the moment: loss of job, health issue, teenage boys and neighbors complaints on top of that. That might explain the "I want to give up" attitude the other day. But they seem determine to try and do their best and follow the guideline they have been given for a while, knowing it is going to be a long road. They are also starting to teach her some tricks (shake, drop, ...) and agreed they need to walk her regularly. I might do some evening walk with them.

Hopefully we'll see some improvement. As the lady told me, she will have more time now so it should help.

[Guest Ams]

Thanks Sylvie. They are at least trying to do something right for the dog.

Amax nowhere is it said the pup came from a puppy farm. We have no idea where they sourced the dog and it would make no difference at this point anyway as the behaviour would be pretty entrenched and fixing it is long term.

Sylvie has provided them with information and is providing them with a friendly ear to listen to them and encourage them. That is more than most people could ask for.

[Amax-1]

Amax nowhere is it said the pup came from a puppy farm. We have no idea where they sourced the dog

It wasn't from a dedicated Poodle breeder who screens for environmental stability from years of ancestral knowledge if it's a Poodle X?

[Guest Ams]

Amax nowhere is it said the pup came from a puppy farm. We have no idea where they sourced the dog

It wasn't from a dedicated Poodle breeder who screens for environmental stability from years of ancestral knowledge if it's a Poodle X?

Doesn't make it from a puppy farm either. BYB yes but its a huge stretch to state puppy farm. Either way it is off topic for this thread which is about how to correct / balance the behaviours or have the owners place the dog in rescue for a second chance.

[Steph M]

At least try and get an evaluation from a behaviourist and if they are confident the puppy can be helped then maybe rehoming would be a good option. An owner who is home often will be better able to ease the puppy into learning its okay to be left alone. I know this is an awkward situation for you because it is somebody else's dog but please try to talk to them about putting her down.

Wow. That escalated quickly.

Why would you be suggesting putting her down so quickly?

A young small dog who doesn't like being left alone isn't an instant death sentence is it?

Even thinking about rehoming (assuming the owners arent capable of anything further, which is still a big assumption) there are situations that may suit.

My grandma lives in a block of units and where she couldn't take her dog, which was rare, next door would take him for the day and spoil him rotten.

Or someone who can take him to work/daycare etc.

Obviously yes a behaviourist needs to be consulted but why would you suggest talking to the owner about putting her to sleep already?

Not sure why thats the first answer suggested to be honest.

Understand in some cases its the kindest thing, but hard to assume this is definitely one.

Edited February 25, 2014 by Steph M