Benefits Of Feeding Raw.

[bronsonb]

I have 2 male Rotties aged 5 and we have been battling ear problems for a while now. My vet has finally diagnosed it as pseudomonas infection and been treating with antibiotics. In an effort to try and discover exactly what the trigger is we have eliminated everything from their diet and have just been feeding Hills Prescription z/d. The infection is now clearing but as you can imagine the Hills is quite expensive especially feeding 2 big boys.

My question is, would there be any benefit in going on to a raw diet, and if so, how would I go about starting them on it and what sort of quantities would you recommend?

Looking forward to some useful responses.

[persephone]

Ok... if you have a few cups of coffee handy, and quiet day or two ..

have a read of the following thread . Everything about RAW feeding ...... :) CLICK HERE

[westiemum]

Pseudomonas is a real b******. Its highly resistant to most antibiotics and mutates very quickly. Mac my westie ended up having a total left ear ablation after his infection became resistant to every antibiotic known to man. So good luck with it but you are up against it.

Having said that yes raw feeding should help but is unlikely to solve the problem IMO. Have a look at the thread Perse posted and go from there.

Good luck - sadly I think you'll need it.

ETA: Also do a search on Psuedomonas - I'm sure I posted at length about it at one stage - might be in Mac's dementia thread or a thread on its own - can't remember.

Edited February 23, 2014 by westiemum

[aussielover]

If your dog is food allergic then it all depends on which type of foods he is allergic to. If he is allergic to beef or chicken (quite common) then a typical raw diet will not help improve things.

Often a kangaroo or fish based diet can be used for food allergic dogs however It's important to find out exactly which foods he is allergic to so a specific allergy free diet can be formulated.

To be honest if they are doing well on z/d it may well be more convenient to keep them on this in the long term.

[denali]

This is an awesome facebook group :)

Really helped me!

https://www.facebook.com/groups/285200538202117/

Hopefully the link works-otherwise it is called raw feeding FRIENDS

And the link to the post here from Persephone will also be super helpful :)

[bronsonb]

Thanks to everyone who has replied, certainly lots to digest. We don't really want to go the surgery option, Westie, but if it's the only way, it will have to be. Will keep going with the z/d for the time being and see what happens. The vet had suggested a dermatologist, worth it, do you think?

[westiemum]

Bronsonb it was more that I completely ran out of options and Mac was in a lot of pain. And on excision the surgeon said the middle and inner ear was so badly infected we'd never have got on top of it clinically anyway. And Mac was a different dog after his surgery - much brighter and happier. He was probably pain free for the first time in a long time.

So for us it was not only the right decision but the only decision. But you might get lucky and it sounds like you're not yet at the end of the drug road yet. As to a dermatologist, you have a diagnosis so I'm not sure what more they could add? Pathology suggests the next antibiotic to try... So I suppose I'm wondering what value a dermatologist could add at this point? Pathology will tell you when you're out of drug options.

Edited February 24, 2014 by westiemum

[bronsonb]

Thanks, westiemum. Will keep going as we are and use the z/d for the time being. I suppose when you weigh up the cost against all the vet visits, pathology and anti-biotics, not to mention the stress of knowing my poor boys are suffering, it's not that bad at all. Well done for taking that huge step for your boy, but I suppose when you get to that stage, you know what you have to do.

Thanks again, and I now know where to come if I need further help.

[westiemum]

Yes you do know when you need to consider surgery.

And there's a lot of truth in that - the ongoing costs of trying this and that can be substantial, particularly when stacked up against surgery costs. But when a trusted vet says 'we're at the end of the road' then I knew surgery was the only option.

I hope it doesn't come to that for your guys. But if it does you'll know. I insisted on one last swab/path test when Mac appeared clinically clear to be absolutely sure (the vet said he's clear and further path was unnecessary) and it came back with heavy resistant infection and no further AB suggestions - the vet was as devastated as I was - so off we went for surgery.

Surgery showed the middle and inner ear from memory, was chock a block full of putrid cottage cheese consistency infection - apparently the smell was unbelievable. It was long tough surgery too - four hours and two GAs. The infection was behind the ear drum so not obvious on clinical exam. (Where's tympanometry for dogs when you need it?).

Bear in mind the surgery removes the hearing mechanism so the dog becomes deaf in that ear. In Macs case after surgery I discovered he had very little hearing in the other ear so was functionally deaf. But at least he's a pain- free, happy deaf old Westie! And we've all adjusted very well to his deafness. I automatically get in his line of sight to get his attention without even thinking about it these days and he cues well off the other westies. So overall it's worked well for us. Good luck. Will be very interested to hear how you get on.

Edited February 26, 2014 by westiemum

[Dr Bruce Syme]

Absolutely worth the change. Most recurrent ear infections are a sign of food allergy, and this can be prevented by changing to a raw diet. You can either do the "cold turkey" approach, and just swap over to the raw diet (make sure you choose a complete and balanced raw food), or you can go with the 10% option- add 10% raw, 90% Hills, then each day increase the raw by 10%, and reduce the kibble by 10%, so by the end of 10 days you are feeding 100% raw.

For nasty ear infections, and especially pseudomonas, I would clean the ear with apple cider vinegar, and then add a few drops of pro-biotic solution (mix powder in water then put into the ear) - the probiotics will help to out-compete the pseudomonas, and assist repopulating the ear post antibiotic drops. Calendula tea or tincture will also assist, and tea tree oil is a great natural antibiotic.

[Salukifan]

Absolutely worth the change. Most recurrent ear infections are a sign of food allergy, and this can be prevented by changing to a raw diet. You can either do the "cold turkey" approach, and just swap over to the raw diet (make sure you choose a complete and balanced raw food), or you can go with the 10% option- add 10% raw, 90% Hills, then each day increase the raw by 10%, and reduce the kibble by 10%, so by the end of 10 days you are feeding 100% raw.

For nasty ear infections, and especially pseudomonas, I would clean the ear with apple cider vinegar, and then add a few drops of pro-biotic solution (mix powder in water then put into the ear) - the probiotics will help to out-compete the pseudomonas, and assist repopulating the ear post antibiotic drops. Calendula tea or tincture will also assist, and tea tree oil is a great natural antibiotic.

Unless of course, you include the allergen in the raw diet. Or are you suggesting that dogs are only allergic to cooked food?

[Dr Bruce Syme]

Absolutely worth the change. Most recurrent ear infections are a sign of food allergy, and this can be prevented by changing to a raw diet. You can either do the "cold turkey" approach, and just swap over to the raw diet (make sure you choose a complete and balanced raw food), or you can go with the 10% option- add 10% raw, 90% Hills, then each day increase the raw by 10%, and reduce the kibble by 10%, so by the end of 10 days you are feeding 100% raw.

For nasty ear infections, and especially pseudomonas, I would clean the ear with apple cider vinegar, and then add a few drops of pro-biotic solution (mix powder in water then put into the ear) - the probiotics will help to out-compete the pseudomonas, and assist repopulating the ear post antibiotic drops. Calendula tea or tincture will also assist, and tea tree oil is a great natural antibiotic.

Unless of course, you include the allergen in the raw diet. Or are you suggesting that dogs are only allergic to cooked food?

Fair point - I simply advise you stay away from the most likely allergens - chicken and beef. Generally I do find that the denatured (cooked) proteins are far mor reactive than when fed raw.

[Salukifan]

I can only talk to poodles but gluten does also seem to trigger a lot of yeast based infections.

[Dr Bruce Syme]

I can only talk to poodles but gluten does also seem to trigger a lot of yeast based infections.

I agree, I have found about 15% of allergy cases are linked to gluten intolerance. Yeast is an opportunist, and will grow in large numbers if the conditions are right - hence the use of a probiotic ear wash, and tea tree oil, which kills yeast.

Attached is my gluten free diet sheet.

Gluten Free diets.doc