mini girl Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 (edited) I have a young bitch first litter belongs to a fellow breeder I am raising the pups for first 2 weeks. The 2 pups were only born last night one tiny one normal size . The mother seems to have so much milk already. The teats are really full. The pups are gaining and no crying but this evening was watching and the larger pup seemed to get so much milk it started coming out of his nose. This really worries me. Some of her teats are really big. She seems fine though and eating and drinking divetalact. Usually my other girls take a couple of days for good milk supply and with much larger litters seem to cope. Could it be the fact that she only has two pups. And is there any danger for her or the pups. I have a young bitch first litter belongs to a fellow breeder I am raising the pups for first 2 weeks. The 2 pups were only born last night one tiny one normal size . The mother seems to have so much milk already. The teats are really full. The pups are gaining and no crying but this evening was watching and the larger pup seemed to get so much milk it started coming out of his nose. This really worries me. Some of her teats are really big. She seems fine though and eating and drinking divetalact. Usually my other girls take a couple of days for good milk supply and with much larger litters seem to cope. Could it be the fact that she only has two pups. And is there any danger for her or the pups. Edited February 17, 2014 by mini girl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 (edited) a bitch produces milk - then according to the sucking etc it will normally lessen or increase cut back on her food if she only has two littlies ...perhaps .. That's what i do . She shouldn't need divetelact .. just good protein food , ... The pup with milk coming out his nose- I am presuming the vet didn't find cleft palate or anything wrong? Edited February 16, 2014 by persephone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mini girl Posted February 16, 2014 Author Share Posted February 16, 2014 He was only born 8.30. Pm last night (Sunday today) so have not taken them to the vet. Never ever had a cleft palate in any of my pups. Already you can easily squeeze milk from some of the teats just think he got too much too quickly. Will cut down on the Divetalact drinks for a day or two. Was worried the milk may have got into his lungs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 it may indeed get into the lungs if the bitch is in good condition - perhaps just feed her a normal maintenance amount for a few days ... just let things even out .... Hope the babies are ok. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mini girl Posted February 16, 2014 Author Share Posted February 16, 2014 Taking them to the vet first thing this morning. Do hope he is ok. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 Fingers crossed all is well for mum & bubs . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mini girl Posted February 16, 2014 Author Share Posted February 16, 2014 Back from the vet and he doesn't have a cleft palate and she checked his lungs very thoroughly so far all good. Poor mum has the two bottom teats swollen and hard and hot but no mastitis. After a thorough examination the vet said he has a slight over shot bottom jaw and probably why he isn't feeding as well. Advice is to put cold compresses on the back teats one in particular and supervise the male pups feelings swing him upside down after feeds. He has dropped only 2 gr from birth weight of 200 gr. now 198 day 3 but was not born till 8 15 pm. I was wondering should I try and get some milk from her and eye drop feed him. Never had this happen before Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 ... cabbage leaves used on boobs will help the mum :) re: puppy .. I am not sure - but would be worried as to whether this jaw problem may continue on , or perhaps self correct. It is certainly not a good start - a puppy which cannot feed itself is a worry. perhaps ask Christina - or someone in teh poodle thread? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mini girl Posted February 16, 2014 Author Share Posted February 16, 2014 Thanks will get some cabbge leaves should be able to Find out how to use them on a google search. Have heard of this even for human mums. this is the first time this has happened. Have had pups with slight under shot jaw which mostly does correct by the tine first teeth come through. Never a problem feeding though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redkidsmum Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 Hi Mini girl ,I have had this happen with my toy poodle pups ..mums milk just flows too fast for baby Never had any affects with pups inhaling to lungs if they are healthy and at his weight he should be ..had pups gain good weight first 24 hrs Back teats should settle down ..I usually compress a little milk from them to ease mum ..try to put bigger pup on them to do the same Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mini girl Posted February 17, 2014 Author Share Posted February 17, 2014 Thanks red kids mum also rang a very long term breeder friend she said the same. This is a small mini and her milk seems like a tap. Have watched him feeding and as the milk bubbles out mum is licking it off him. The smaller girl is drinking fine. No overflow or out the nose. Did your girls milk flow settle down eventually? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mini girl Posted February 17, 2014 Author Share Posted February 17, 2014 Hi Mini girl ,I have had this happen with my toy poodle pups ..mums milk just flows too fast for baby Never had any affects with pups inhaling to lungs if they are healthy and at his weight he should be ..had pups gain good weight first 24 hrs Back teats should settle down ..I usually compress a little milk from them to ease mum ..try to put bigger pup on them to do the same The bigger pup is the one who has it coming out his nose. And only two in the litter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dancinbcs Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 If the teats are hard, massage them every few hours until they are soft and keep a close eye on them. The cabbage leaves will help as well to prevent mastitis with just two feeding. Drop the bitch's food back a bit to slow her milk production but it is not all abnormal to have abundant milk before the litter is born. I would still be concerned about a cleft palate in the bigger puppy as clefts at the back of the soft palate are nearly impossible to see in a live puppy unless the vet is very experienced in dealing with them. Bad bite problems can prevent puppies being able to latch on but I have never heard of it causing milk to come out the nose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mini girl Posted February 17, 2014 Author Share Posted February 17, 2014 Still felt uneasy about it all so rang the ladies at Furkids they are breeders as well as have the vets they also said that about a cleft palate right at the back too and asked if I could bring him in its over 60 Kim's from us but my husband drove me over with the mum and two pups. They have had a lot of experience with everything to do with breeding and raising pups. They thoroughly examined him and no no sign of a cleft palate any where and also said his little lungs were clear. Gave suggestion of how to feed him which I am following held him upside down on a teat it did help a bit. Gave him a swing if he did get the nose bubbles and things seem a lot better now. Watching one of mums back teats but it seems a lot better now the pups drank quite a bit. The ladies at Furkids were so nice and reassuring and didn't even charge us. Only wish they were closer to us. We are on the north they are way down the south. He is a strong little fellow probably sucks too hard on a really full teat. Hope it's only that and it improves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Airedaler Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 I used to find if the pups were getting milk too quickly it would sometimes come out of their nose. It did not seem to affect the pups though and as things settled it stopped. As an aside, and not necessarily in this case, I wounder if it is possible to express milk from a bitch that has an excess and freeze it for use if needed for a subsequent litter if needed. The thought just occurred to me as something that might be useful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poocow Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 Put the cabbage leaves in the freezer for a bit as well. I found that really helped my girl in the first few days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dancinbcs Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 Good news that he has been checked by vets familiar with clefts in the soft palate. They aren't very common and a lot of vets would never have seen them unless they deal with a lot of breeders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heidley Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 One of the pups from my last litter had this, I found putting her on the teats further towards the front helped a lot, seems she was too gutsy and couldn't cope with the "high flow" teats, it worked wonders and she is now a bright, happy 4 month old pup, I did find it very unnerving as it was only my 4th litter, I kept checking her lungs several times a day to be on the safe side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mini girl Posted February 18, 2014 Author Share Posted February 18, 2014 One of the pups from my last litter had this, I found putting her on the teats further towards the front helped a lot, seems she was too gutsy and couldn't cope with the "high flow" teats, it worked wonders and she is now a bright, happy 4 month old pup, I did find it very unnerving as it was only my 4th litter, I kept checking her lungs several times a day to be on the safe side. Glad to hear all came good. Things have settled down very well infact I am amazed at how quickly things have turned around. The pup I think was just a strong sucker and the over production of milk just too much for him. I cut the mothers food down, epressed the engorged teats and supervised the boys feeding and today all seems fine. No longer any engorged teats and she seems to have just the right amount as pups are quiet and both gaining weight. But like you found it very unnerving as I have not seen it before and have raised or help raise about 14 litters. I am still very watchful but hope all will be well. It's so good to know you are not the o ly one who has had a problem like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted February 18, 2014 Share Posted February 18, 2014 Glad things have settled :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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