Sayreovi Posted December 28, 2013 Share Posted December 28, 2013 I find having a system (whatever one) enables me to clearly communicate with the dogs and it enables them to run harder, stop asking questions and builds confidence. It also helps to problem solve ie the dog did X instead of Y, but I inadvertently told the dog to do X OR the dog doesn't really understand Y. Also helps when you are getting instruction from someone who understands your system and doing puppy foundations. Plus, as my main focus at the moment is retrieving I need a system laid out for me - I don't have the time to invent my own! Not so much inventing my own, more taking bits and pieces from everyone else and running with it :laugh: I would love to do ST's system as I feel my guys would enjoy that kind of crazy best but would probably keel over and die at the end of each run :laugh: and I don't know anyone who does it down here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Podengo Posted December 28, 2013 Share Posted December 28, 2013 I would love to do ST's system as I feel my guys would enjoy that kind of crazy best but would probably keel over and die at the end of each run :laugh: and I don't know anyone who does it down here. I've not really seen anyone do it here either, I really want to learn though! I'm young and fast, so may as well do it now, before I get too old and have to focus on handling at a distance hahaha. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pie Posted December 28, 2013 Share Posted December 28, 2013 It's blind cross galore over here in wa! Some dogs love it, haven't seen many having significant issues but that's because it's mainly the more advanced confident handlers doing them anyway. People are blind crossing jumps, weavers, everything! Pretty much everyone here blind crosses tunnels but I don't think that counts because the dog essentially sees the same picture as they come out of the tunnel as they would if you front crossed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
megan_ Posted December 28, 2013 Share Posted December 28, 2013 Are the blind crosses helping with speed pie? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J... Posted December 28, 2013 Share Posted December 28, 2013 (edited) What course is that Jess? Shape Up Dogs foundation. SG's new handling sounded interesting particularly the "continuous movement" she's talking about, but there was no word on courses at that stage and to be honest I'm a bit over the marketing hype when there is so much opportunity out there in online course land. I've been watching Justine's transition from GD to a blend of ST/european handling and I really liked what I saw. Justine runs workshops with SG at SY. Definitely my favourite online course so far. What do you mean by a K-turn ?? Is that when you see handlers send their dog over the jump then turn & run...dog follows. I've started training this with her & she turns really tight & speeds up to catch me & get the reward. Ketschker turns, effectively a FX followed by a BX. This is Dave handling Darcy demonstrating a K turn at the second bar and a BX at the third: . Edited December 28, 2013 by Jess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
megan_ Posted December 28, 2013 Share Posted December 28, 2013 Thanks - that sounds interesting. SG's stuff seems to be GD with some European elements. I'll definitely look up Justine's course as I think GD with other bits added. (Eg not doing a stop for threadles ) is what I need . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheena Posted December 28, 2013 Author Share Posted December 28, 2013 Thanks for all the replies...very interesting discussion I don't follow any one particular handling system, but prefer to study whatever I can get my hands on & I can & pick out what I think may suit me & my dog/dogs & both my dogs are different so have to be handled differently on course. I can't do the running as GD so I tend to concentrate more on sending & distance where I can. At the moment we are having a lot of success with left & right. We touched on Blind crosses a while ago in class, but got side tracked, but I would now like to pick up again on them & give them a go. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vickie Posted December 28, 2013 Share Posted December 28, 2013 What are other DOL's thoughts on using the Blind Cross ??? I like & use the Blind Cross, but will continue to use front & rears too. I think theres a time & place for all 3.. Like Kristen, I went to Stacy Goudy this year & one of the things she told us was that a front cues collection & a blind cues extension. This makes sense to me & is a good thing to remember when making decisions about courses. Personally I feel more comfortable with a blind than a front if I have to be driving the line after really hard. The advantage that I see is that it may get more speed into the dog, as front crosses tend to slow the dog down & often she is not going fast enough for me to perform a back cross I'm not sure about this. Yes, a front should cue collection...but if the dog is slowing down too much (more than it needs to to take a turn), it's more likely that the timing of the front is late or that you are FCing on the spot rather than moving through it. Personally, I find timing is more crucial on a blind than a front. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kavik Posted December 28, 2013 Share Posted December 28, 2013 What course is that Jess? Shape Up Dogs foundation. SG's new handling sounded interesting particularly the "continuous movement" she's talking about, but there was no word on courses at that stage and to be honest I'm a bit over the marketing hype when there is so much opportunity out there in online course land. I've been watching Justine's transition from GD to a blend of ST/european handling and I really liked what I saw. Justine runs workshops with SG at SY. Definitely my favourite online course so far. What do you mean by a K-turn ?? Is that when you see handlers send their dog over the jump then turn & run...dog follows. I've started training this with her & she turns really tight & speeds up to catch me & get the reward. Ketschker turns, effectively a FX followed by a BX. This is Dave handling Darcy demonstrating a K turn at the second bar and a BX at the third: . At the moment I am not using blind crosses. From what I can gather SG is bringing out a handling course next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheena Posted December 29, 2013 Author Share Posted December 29, 2013 What are other DOL's thoughts on using the Blind Cross ??? I like & use the Blind Cross, but will continue to use front & rears too. I think theres a time & place for all 3.. Like Kristen, I went to Stacy Goudy this year & one of the things she told us was that a front cues collection & a blind cues extension. This makes sense to me & is a good thing to remember when making decisions about courses. Personally I feel more comfortable with a blind than a front if I have to be driving the line after really hard. The advantage that I see is that it may get more speed into the dog, as front crosses tend to slow the dog down & often she is not going fast enough for me to perform a back cross I'm not sure about this. Yes, a front should cue collection...but if the dog is slowing down too much (more than it needs to to take a turn), it's more likely that the timing of the front is late or that you are FCing on the spot rather than moving through it. Personally, I find timing is more crucial on a blind than a front. Thanks Vickie. With my front crosses now I am trying to not stay in the FC position too long, but to do the FC then move on & this is working well. OK...so we now have K-turns to add to the equation......what about Jaakko moves..is there much difference between the two :) I will probably never use either of these, but it is interesting to know all about them & to know how to use them . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
megan_ Posted December 29, 2013 Share Posted December 29, 2013 Can anyone recommend some resources to train blind crosses (esp on jumps )? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzy82 Posted December 29, 2013 Share Posted December 29, 2013 From what I've heard, SG's handling class will start in Aussie autumn, and I'm planning to do it. I did part of her handling workshop in November and it all made perfect sense and is based on making everything extremely clear and easy for the dog. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
megan_ Posted December 29, 2013 Share Posted December 29, 2013 Is that online fuzzy? Apparently she is coming back in April too . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kavik Posted December 29, 2013 Share Posted December 29, 2013 I'm pretty sure it will be online. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piper Posted December 29, 2013 Share Posted December 29, 2013 I like & use the Blind Cross, but will continue to use front & rears too. I think theres a time & place for all 3.. Like Kristen, I went to Stacy Goudy this year & one of the things she told us was that a front cues collection & a blind cues extension. This makes sense to me & is a good thing to remember when making decisions about courses. Personally I feel more comfortable with a blind than a front if I have to be driving the line after really hard. LOL Vickie!! I came back to add some more and that was going to be if I need collection then a front cross is used, if I want to maintain extension than aim for a blind :) It is something that helps me decide what to put where. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzy82 Posted December 29, 2013 Share Posted December 29, 2013 Is that online fuzzy? Apparently she is coming back in April too . Yes, that's an online handling class. I also heard she's returning to Aus in April, but this hadn't been confirmed last time I heard of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vickie Posted December 29, 2013 Share Posted December 29, 2013 (edited) LOL Vickie!! I came back to add some more and that was going to be if I need collection then a front cross is used, if I want to maintain extension than aim for a blind :) It is something that helps me decide what to put where. :) it really does make sense, but I don't think it's the be all & end all. If timing is correct, your position as the dog takes the jump looks the same whether it was a front or a blind. I ran a drill/sequence a while ago, have it on video somewhere, where I timed it with fronts, rears & blinds. It was only 10 obstacles, but I think there was only .10 of a second between each of them. Edited December 29, 2013 by Vickie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elliot's mum Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 For those interested in doing the SG handling course, I have been transitioning across to her handling since she came to Qld last year. I was from GD system but I just can't run fast enough to get to the positional cues needed so was constantly handling with rear crosses, and I am not ashamed to say they were less than pretty. Anyhow, as I said I have been doing the foundation work for a few months and tried my fast boy on a couple of sequences and a course and I was in front of him the whole sequence :) not one rear cross :) this has never happened before. I find the verbals are really helping him understand his job so he can go do it and I can get the hell out of there to the next spot. Would highly recommend looking into it, if you are struggling with your current system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheena Posted January 18, 2014 Author Share Posted January 18, 2014 I would love to do an on-line course with SG & others but I am limited by my internet download....I have a monthly limit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amax-1 Posted January 18, 2014 Share Posted January 18, 2014 Can anyone recommend some resources to train blind crosses (esp on jumps )? I prefer to train a pure breed with good eyesight if that helps :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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