*kirty* Posted November 14, 2013 Share Posted November 14, 2013 (edited) My 11.5yr old Lab x was diagnosed with renal carcinoma recently. He has a huge mass on his kidney. This type of cancer is aggressive and spreads rapidly, so we opted for palliative care. He is very skinny but still eats and plays etc. Yesterday he growled at me for the first time in his entire life. I was clipping his nails which he has never enjoyed but has always tolerated well. I'm taking this as a sign that he is feeling pretty crap. He is already taking anti-inflammatory tablets so the next step is something stronger like Tramadol. I guess my question is should I keep upping his pain meds or should I let him go? I don't want him to be in pain, and I'm not sure I should keeping giving him more meds when there is not much to be gained. Edited November 14, 2013 by *kirty* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebanne Posted November 14, 2013 Share Posted November 14, 2013 I know what I would do but I am not you. Sorry you are going through this. I am a big believer in quality over quantity. You will do what is right for your boy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loving my Oldies Posted November 14, 2013 Share Posted November 14, 2013 I'm so sorry for you and your boy, Kirty. Renal failure = feeling very very crappy. I think I'd be letting him go too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daisys Mum Posted November 14, 2013 Share Posted November 14, 2013 Only you know that answer ... Not an easy one I know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
*kirty* Posted November 14, 2013 Author Share Posted November 14, 2013 Surprisingly his kidney function is ok, I guess the second one is working hard. But he probably has mets in his other organs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rappie Posted November 14, 2013 Share Posted November 14, 2013 Kirty, in cases like this if people aren't sure what to do I try good pain relief (as generous doses if needed) for a couple of days. If it's enough to make him feel comfortable enough to 'enjoy' himself then good, if not then we consider other options - but it is always up to the owner to make the call as they live with and love their pets day in day out. It's ok to have them on pain relief if it truly does make a difference to their quality of life. If he thinks he's ok, it's not time for times sake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bertie Posted November 14, 2013 Share Posted November 14, 2013 So sorry for you & your boy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christina Posted November 14, 2013 Share Posted November 14, 2013 Its a personal decision but sounds like he is feeling bad now. To be honest as they can't talk & tell us what they feel by the time we do know its usually bad with cancer so for the 4 animals that I have had that suffered cancers that were terminal & aggressive rather than let them get to the not eating, being miserable pain stage I have euthanised before it got that bad. What was the point of prolonging their life until they suffered for my sake ? That was how I saw it but we are all different so only you can choose what to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spotted Devil Posted November 14, 2013 Share Posted November 14, 2013 Great advice Rappie. I gave Brontë her wings with the philosophy of better a day too early than a day too late. I haven't had to make that choice in the past. It still hurts like hell but I have no regrets. Thinking of you kirty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted November 14, 2013 Share Posted November 14, 2013 ohhh If you have access to strong pain relief ..and just need a bit of headspace ..then if he is a bit zonked , but happy , that's ok short term . i would not be going this route - but I'm not you. Take care .. and don't feel at all guilty. All your boy knows is your love and caring ...and that's all he will ever know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HazyWal Posted November 14, 2013 Share Posted November 14, 2013 With my old boy I always told my vet I would never keep him alive for me and after doing everything possible I stuck to that In my thoughts Kirty it's hard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kelpiecuddles Posted November 14, 2013 Share Posted November 14, 2013 Personally I would plan a lovely weekend with him, get the stronger pain relief so we could enjoy our last bit of time together and then set him free. Just my personal feelings though, be kind to yourself and go with what your heart is saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bindo Posted November 14, 2013 Share Posted November 14, 2013 (edited) Personally I would plan a lovely weekend with him, get the stronger pain relief so we could enjoy our last bit of time together and then set him free. Just my personal feelings though, be kind to yourself and go with what your heart is saying. I have just been through this with my girl, thread here :Lucy We decided to do what Kelpiecuddles said above and others have concurred with, ie quality over quantity. She was still eating, drinking and mobile, but getting sicker by the day and less interested in everything and it was only going to go in one direction. We planned her last day to be lovely for her; BBQ chicken breakfast, new squeaky toy (her favourite thing) and then a huge lamb shank in the afternoon, as she hadn't been allowed bones for over a year. The vet arrived at 5pm and she went to sleep in my arms. Although terribly sad, it was the most peaceful death and i felt positive that we had timed it well, rather than having to rush off to a vet's waiting room full of people in an emergency situation. It's never an easy decision, but I'm sure you'll decide what's best for your boy. Edited November 14, 2013 by Bindo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Maeby Fünke Posted November 14, 2013 Share Posted November 14, 2013 (edited) Oh no, I'm so sorry When my boy was diagnosed with MCT's I told my vet that, if they spread internally, I wouldn't want to prolong his life just for me. Personally, I value quality of life over longevity but that's me... You need to do whatever feels right for you Edited November 14, 2013 by Maeby Fünke Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bamboo Posted November 14, 2013 Share Posted November 14, 2013 I had a Dane who spent the last couple of months on painkillers and appeared content and well. At one point he was put onto strong painkillers and seemed comfortable and able to enjoy his life. One day he growled and snapped at me when I asked him to move. For me that was the deciding factor and he was euthanased that day. If there is a drug option that can genuinely keep the dog comfortable and able to enjoy life I see no problem with continuing. I had a Tibetan spaniel cross with a rare cancer that grew in the bone of his skull. He was put on macrolone for what was expected to be a few weeks. 3 years later he was euthanased, and I made sure they were good years for him. He amazed the vets with the quality of life he was able to enjoy despite his skull being approx 4 cm thick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Her Majesty Dogmad Posted November 14, 2013 Share Posted November 14, 2013 So sorry Kirty, it's so tough when we get to these stages. My vet is always wonderful - since 2007, I have lost dogs most years, all to different illnesses - my vet has always said to me that it is better to make the decision a bit earlier rather than leave it until the dog is suffering so badly that you have to rush them in as an emergency. It just depends what it is, sometimes you don't know that they are about to leave you. When I have known what is wrong and it's taking a major toll on them (cancer, heart disease, cushings etc), I try and be brave and make the decision before the dog reaches a crisis. With my old Cattle girl who had liver cancer, the last two weeks weren't good as she was very unwell but she was still playing ball. The day we went to the park and she had no interest was when I got back in the car and went straight to the vet. With another dog, I gave her a special last day before taking her, she was going downhill and it wasn't fair, my vet felt she was only struggling on for me as she was so devoted. It's never easy and I wish you strength and send you hugs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Airedaler Posted November 15, 2013 Share Posted November 15, 2013 I would give him his wings. We can give them pain relief and they apparently are comfortable .....but are they really or is it just our assessment that they are? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twodoggies2001 Posted November 15, 2013 Share Posted November 15, 2013 Kirty, I sympathize with you. You will remember Benson from the eye vet clinic in Melbourne and his ups and downs. One day I took him to my regular vet for a wellness check, along with my other boy. She checked him over and told me she saw a very unhappy dog in him, and my hubby and I decided there and then to give him peace. I knew it wouldn't have been far off, but honestly didn't expect it on the day. In hindsight it was for the best. All the best, hugs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maddy Posted November 15, 2013 Share Posted November 15, 2013 With my old boy I always told my vet I would never keep him alive for me and after doing everything possible I stuck to that In my thoughts Kirty it's hard. I'm in a similar position at the moment with my old grump and honestly, I think whichever way you go, there's still going to be some amount of guilt over the decision. In my case, I've set myself a definite deadline- his 12th birthday (about four months away). If he can still stand and move around comfortably by then, we go back to the vet for reassessment and more painkillers. If not, that's when I'll have to say goodbye. Whichever way you go, it's a hard decision so take care of yourself Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loving my Oldies Posted November 15, 2013 Share Posted November 15, 2013 I think whichever way you go, there's still going to be some amount of guilt over the decision. This is true and just a matter of recognising it and trying to make the beating up of oneself not too hard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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