Victoria To Introduce Amendment To Bsl Legislation

[Simply Grand]

Espinay, if I was in the situation to need to challenge an order that's the approach I would take - I wouldn't bother arguing against council officer's assessment of the dog according to their "test", I'd be bringing all sorts of evidence of features of non-restricted breed dogs that meet the assessment criteria and could be combined to result in a dog that looks like a restricted breed, any evidence I could find of cross bred dogs of documented heritage that end up looking like a different pure breed and as Melza said, whatever results I could find of the inaccuracy of visual assessment of breed.

[Angeluca]

This is much the same as the QLD government's bikie laws,

it's illegal to where a vest that has a bike club name on it, or 'club colours'

it's illegal for a establishment to service a person wearing or associating with bikie clubs.

Qld is proposing automatic weapons for police officers.

And another proposal is bikies must wear pink jump suits in prison.

there are pictures of bikies not sure which club but they running around with pink overalls saying F*CK NEWMAN with their club name printed.

they also set to parole current prisoners to make way for bikies.

This is all bikie clubs harmless or not, criminal or not and it's as simple as guilty by association.

Next thing for Victoria, Dog being PTS because next door's dog is a "pitbull" and he is guilty by socializing through the fence,

Basic human rights are being legislated away bit by bit. Freedom of speech is being suppressed and the right to defend yourself removed.

[Silvawilow]

In no way do I agree with BSL but why can't they put some onus or responsibility on the breeders of these dogs? The amount of SBT, AST, AmBulldog, Mastiff and their crosses that are being bred and sold on FB pet pages is disgusting - one page had 10 new ads go up in one day for regional Vic. If they shared some responsibility it might make them think twice about pumping out litter after litter

Edited November 18, 2013 by Silvawilow

[BlackJaq]

In no way do I agree with BSL but why can't they put some onus or responsibility on the breeders of these dogs? The amount of SBT, AST, AmBulldog, Mastiff and their crosses that are being bred and sold on FB pet pages is disgusting - one page had 10 new ads go up in one day for regional Vic. If they shared some responsibility it might make them think twice about pumping out litter after litter

I'd say they simply cannot be found most of the time. Also, that would be putting in an effort. It might also make a little bit too much sense. Can't have that! Especially since it';s obviously all the nasty pitbull's fault! No human error here at all! (As per Ayen Chol coroner's report )

[GeckoTree]

This is much the same as the QLD government's bikie laws,

it's illegal to where a vest that has a bike club name on it, or 'club colours'

it's illegal for a establishment to service a person wearing or associating with bikie clubs.

Qld is proposing automatic weapons for police officers.

And another proposal is bikies must wear pink jump suits in prison.

there are pictures of bikies not sure which club but they running around with pink overalls saying F*CK NEWMAN with their club name printed.

they also set to parole current prisoners to make way for bikies.

This is all bikie clubs harmless or not, criminal or not and it's as simple as guilty by association.

Next thing for Victoria, Dog being PTS because next door's dog is a "pitbull" and he is guilty by socializing through the fence,

Basic human rights are being legislated away bit by bit. Freedom of speech is being suppressed and the right to defend yourself removed.

That's about right, hey this is Australia, 46 yrs ago Indigenous people were classified under the Flora and Fauna act as being non human.

[Angeluca]

In no way do I agree with BSL but why can't they put some onus or responsibility on the breeders of these dogs? The amount of SBT, AST, AmBulldog, Mastiff and their crosses that are being bred and sold on FB pet pages is disgusting - one page had 10 new ads go up in one day for regional Vic. If they shared some responsibility it might make them think twice about pumping out litter after litter

I'd say they simply cannot be found most of the time. Also, that would be putting in an effort. It might also make a little bit too much sense. Can't have that! Especially since it';s obviously all the nasty pitbull's fault! No human error here at all! (As per Ayen Chol coroner's report )

I cried when I read that.

[Santo66]

I genuinely feel for people who's dogs are subject of these laws, but what I don't understand is that BSL and restricted breed laws have been around for many years and any time over those years, dogs that may resemble restricted breeds are vulnerable to having restrictions placed upon them. Regardless if the laws were ever policed in the past to any great depth, the laws were still in place so is that too hard when making a decision to get a dog especially an unpapered dog or crossbreed to actually check the laws which all the councils publish to determine if the dog you intend to get complies with laws in place?

Is it too hard to check the laws out in your council area prior to getting a dog, that is you are supposed to register the dog with council anyway and abide by council law and coming across the restricted breed list and having a think gee whizz, I wonder if the Bully pup I want to get is a Pitbull or may look like a Pitbull when it grows up and then because a Pitbull is a restricted breed and getting a pup who's breed is difficult to identify, could getting this Bully pup cause me some grief?

Because of the restricted breed list it's possible that an unidentifiable Bully pup could cause some grief, is it not too hard to be on the safe side well within the law to pass on the unidentifiable Bully pup or crossbreed and buy a papered Amstaff or Stafford from a registered breeder or another breed that looks nothing like a Pitbull instead?

[melzawelza]

You SEVERELY overestimate the general public's level of understanding of BSL, how it works, how it is enforced, dog genetics and the Pitbull as a 'breed'.

Edited November 20, 2013 by melzawelza

[Dame Aussie]

Yeah, I agree Santo, it should just be easy to avoid getting a dog that may be in strife.

Problem is a lot of people just dont have a clue, I know people who weren't even aware of BSL, what it is it how it could affect them, and they have bull breed crosses

Sadly the dogs are the ones that pay.

Maybe they should make a tv ad to remind people about the laws? I dunno, it just feels like a lost cause .(

[Dame Aussie]

Gremlins!!

Edited November 20, 2013 by Aussie3

[BlackJaq]

I think expecting people to research before getting a pup that could be a restricted breed is kind of like expecting people to research before buying a loaf of bread. There are millions of them. Everybody has them. They never had a problem previously. Most likely they never even heard the faintest rumor of an issue they might have with it.

For most people, it never occurs to them that their dog might require more of them than a cup of biscuits a day and a rag in some backyard to sleep on.

Some dogs are lucky to get a dog house and I know dogs who survive entirely on food scraps (including cooked chicken bones and similar no no's).

To a lot of people, a dog is not a huge part of their life, not to mention their thought process. Everybody's got one but only very few people actually think beyond that.

[Santo66]

I think expecting people to research before getting a pup that could be a restricted breed is kind of like expecting people to research before buying a loaf of bread. There are millions of them. Everybody has them. They never had a problem previously. Most likely they never even heard the faintest rumor of an issue they might have with it.

For most people, it never occurs to them that their dog might require more of them than a cup of biscuits a day and a rag in some backyard to sleep on.

Some dogs are lucky to get a dog house and I know dogs who survive entirely on food scraps (including cooked chicken bones and similar no no's).

To a lot of people, a dog is not a huge part of their life, not to mention their thought process. Everybody's got one but only very few people actually think beyond that.

That's what happens I agree, but my point is that it's no good blaming the government for their own poor choices and they need to take some responsibility for their own actions as no one forced them to get a restricted breed look a like?? Then there is the blatant "I am having or breeding Pitbulls regardless of the law and they can get stuffed attitude".....just register them as crossbreeds or what the white collar non conformists in the breed did by running Pitbulls off falsified Amstaff paperwork....albeit probably the cleverest option to make a Pitbull comply??.

Whether or not a Pitbull is a threat to the community is a separate debate, but the point is, they are restricted along with assumed crossbreeds of and people need to ensure that their dogs comply otherwise grief will be the obvious outcome if caught with dogs of questionable breed.

On a side note: A niece of mine earlier this year against my better advise bought a Staffy X Lab puppy......a prime candidate to fit the restricted breed criteria, however she said it's not a Pitbull X it's a Staffy cross because they told her that at the pet shop where she bought the pup.......good luck with the ranger on that??

[Ronda]

People also have a "It won’t happen to me" mentality.

[melzawelza]

It's not that people have a 'won't happen to me' attitude.

1. Most people don't even know BSL exists

2. Most people do not understand dog genetics or even what a 'Pitbull' is supposed to look like

3. People don't understand that BSL is based on visual ID which sucks other breeds and mixed breeds in because it's unreliable

4. Therefore people buy a 'Staffy X Lab', an 'Amstaff' without papers, a 'Ridgeback X' etc etc and don't understand that their dog could be caught up in BSL - 'why would it be, it's not a Pitbull!'. They have faith that the way Council's ID restricted breed is accurate and only ID's pitbulls, so they have no reason to be concerned for their dog

5. People buy mixed breed puppies and have no idea or don't even consider what they will look like when they grow up

5. Many dogs being seized don't even look like what anyone that knew anything about the breed would consider to be a 'pit bull', so those people would never expect their dog to come under fire

6. People adopt mixed breed puppies and never see the parents, and have no idea what they will grow up to look like

And so on and so forth endlessly.

Edited November 21, 2013 by melzawelza

[sandgrubber]

I wonder if these fellows would be classed as pit bulls in Victoria.

http://www.hqbullies.com/males/

Living in pit bull land, I find it's very hard to know what is and isn't a pit. Some of the extreme types look more like English bulldogs, despite being 'pedigree' pits.

[BlackJaq]

I can't even figure out how they decide which of the thousands of bullies they see each year is a pit anyway.. They all look different, different shapes and sizes, some that have been declared have been ridiculously large, some had skinny snouts, many have a "red" nose.... I'm actually wondering if they just pick people who annoy them (i.e. personal vendetta) or if there have been complaints by neighbors, or if they pick people who don't appear to have money to contest the verdict in court. Otherwise, why are they not walking around with machine guns destroying every bully in sight? There is no way of making a reliable breed id without seeing pedigree paperwork for the dog.

[Steph M]

I wonder if these fellows would be classed as pit bulls in Victoria.

http://www.hqbullies.com/males/

Living in pit bull land, I find it's very hard to know what is and isn't a pit. Some of the extreme types look more like English bulldogs, despite being 'pedigree' pits.

Almost definitely, I would say.

I can't tell the diff a lot of the time and I try to be as un-biased as I can, it'd be a free for all with a bias!