A Big Dog Attacked My Toy Poodle X

[Kazhak]

I feel for you, I've had my small chinese crested chased by an afghan hound, thank god my little dog was faster than the hound & can leap into my arms on command, all the owner could say was why not let them play.. unfortunately she did not see that her dog running flat out with its head down & out & teeth out was actually aiming to snatch at my dog (who has no hair for protection) we were at a dog beach, suffice to say I no longer visit that side of the beach..

I hope your little dog will be okay..

why don't people have at the very least a collar on their animals, & if they can't control it properly why are they even letting it off lead, even in a dog park..

[WreckitWhippet]

A dog getting rumbled is hardly and "attack", it doesn't excuse an owners lack of control but seriously people, so of the incidents that have happened in these "dog parks" are just that, minor incidents.

[Alison03]

The other day I was at the dog park with Saxon, my little poodle x who is about 5kgs. A big dog I didn't know entered the park, greeted the other dogs in there with sniffs then came over, sniffed noses with Sax and did the circle to sniff butts. She then bit Saxon on the back of the leg (hard enough to leave a bruise). Saxon yelped in pain then ran away trying to get to me. The big dog chased him, pounced and grabbed Saxon around the torso (he ended up with swelling, bruising and a graze on either side of his torso where this big dog grabbed him, as well as on his back leg where she bit him the first time). 

 The dogs were right at me at that stage so somehow I managed to grab Sax by the harness and hold him up over my head while the dog jumped at me trying to get him and its owner jumped around squealing and trying to catch their dog, which had no collar on. Saxon has a sound temperament and is well socialized and trained so he didn't react towards the other dog but instead remained calm and tried his best to come straight to me after the first bite then stayed focused on me until I could lift him right up and get him out of the situation.

The owner of the big dog responded to all of this by saying "oh she's never done that, nothing has ever run away from her before!" and then "she's never been a good dog, she doesn't listen to me, she's just stupid". No apology, not even is he ok. He could have been killed. 

It's happened to me so many times and I'm so frustrated and sick of big dog owners who excuse their dog's behaviour towards small dogs by saying "oh she'll chase if something runs from her", "he thinks it's a toy that's why he's grabbing at it", "it's the squealing and running, it makes him chase".

I should be able to take my dog to a park where dogs are required to be under effective control without him being attacked when he's behaving in a totally appropriate manner!! 

I've had a few similar experiences, a couple where I've had to make contact with the chasing dog to stop it grabbing my Shihtzu cross ( 30kgs plus into 6 kgs doesn't go well), I've got back and knee injuries and suffer for it afterwards but I'm not going to let another dog kill mine in front of me and do nothing.

I don't wait for the owner to react, because quite often from their angle it's looks like the dogs are doing "you chase me, I chase you" play. They can't see the lips drawn back and teeth out. My dog always runs back to me if she's in trouble so the fight is brought to me so to speak, she's a fast little girl in short spurts and can out run a lot of dogs but only over a short distance, by the time she gets to me running flat out she's spent, so I take over. I've never hurt another dog yet but I've scared the living shit out of some of them and it's all bluff and shouting, with a few well aimed smacks for those who don't get the message straight away. Most dogs I've come across (lucky for me) aren't human aggressive and will respond to an assertive human.

I do not use dog parks and will not risk it, I know I have every right to do so and should be able too but it only takes one dog having a bad day and I will go home alone. My little girl means too much to me.

I've come across many off leash dogs of all types in public parks with owners who are just not aware of their dogs capabilities.

In short I know I have every right to take my dog to a dog park, but if another dog grabs her and shakes, she'll be just as dead as if I'd been wrong.

Glad to hear Saxon is ok. : )

[megan_]

Where are the " it was the other dogs fault, not yours. You have the right to expect a dog to behave in a public place" relies? Instead, the OP is told not to take her dog to these places. Interesting given the other thread.

[Her Majesty Dogmad]

There are two dog parks where I live - I've owned large and small dogs - all picked for their fantastic, dog friendly dispositions and I am constantly fostering a dog usually.

I am a very experienced dog owner and know the signs to look for when trouble might be brewing, your average dog owner is not that aware and doesn't know what to look for or what to do.

Most of them have been standing around chatting when I've gone in. My own dogs don't like parks particularly but but in the last few years I've had a couple of fosters that needed to be able to run free so I risked it. I was lucky with one dog a few times, no problems, then the last time we went in as soon as we got in the gate he was monstered by two German Shorthaired Pointers, I simply couldn't get them away from him - he's 10 kilos and older aged. No sign of the owners and yet it isn't an enormous park.

I dragged him out of the park to get him away from them as I knew they were over the top - as well as being undesexed. The very next day they attacked a Cattle Dog.

The other young dog I took in was a very sweet little girl, very sociable but she was harassed by a Beagle and started to scream and then suddenly several dogs were after her right round the park. She was simply terrified - luckily I managed to eventually grab her, hold her up and get her out the gate before it turned into an attack - the other dogs could sense her fear and the squealing was bringing out their prey drive.

I used to go to another much larger park when I had my Cattle dog cross who died in 2010, my dogs used to stay together as we walked around and socialise with other dogs as they appeared. A guy used to sometimes arrive with 2 female Jack Russells and one of them used to make a beeline for my female dogs and have a go - every time - while he stayed the other side of the park. The day she picked on my cattle dog she ended up sorry for herself - not injured but surprised, my other dogs had never retaliated.

I had asked this man a million times to get his dog under control as it always attacked mine. He told someone else in the park that he was carrying a knife, that my dogs were awful dogs, flea ridden (rubbish) and dirty (rubbish) and he didn't like them or me. Needless to say I didn't go back.

[Guest hankodie]

I totally understand the appeal of dog parks and why people choose to use them but IMO there are just too many variables for it to work out safely 100% of the time. I do take my dogs to the dog beach occasionally, but I go during odd times of the day when it's deserted. Sometimes there will be one or two other dogs there but (most of the time) the owners are considerate enough to give each other space. Fenced dog parks are the worst of the worst IMO - it's where owners go with their dogs who are out of control and have zero recall.

My trainer has been talking about organising a "match making" program between her clients - matching up and organising play groups and group walks with friendly dogs who have similar temperaments, which she would assess first. I think it's a fantastic idea and I really hope she works it out because that's something I'd definitely be interested in. I'd love my dogs to be able to have more doggy pals and it sounds like a safer, controlled way for my dogs to make new friends.

[Rosetta]

A dog getting rumbled is hardly and "attack", it doesn't excuse an owners lack of control but seriously people, so of the incidents that have happened in these "dog parks" are just that, minor incidents.

What incident are you referring to? Surely not the OP's? A bite occurred - hardly a rumble.

[Alibi]

The dog was bitten more than once.

[Alison03]

Where are the " it was the other dogs fault, not yours. You have the right to expect a dog to behave in a public place" relies? Instead, the OP is told not to take her dog to these places. Interesting given the other thread.

I know what you are saying Megan, I went through that feeling that I should be able to take my dog anywhere without fear of being attacked, after we were attacked, it was a wake up for me. my dog could easily have been killed. Even though I was doing nothing wrong at the time. I. realized that being in the right would not save her life I can only control what I do, not what other less than responsible dog owners do.

The irresponsible dog owners eventually get their comeuppance, their dog may pick on the wrong dog one day, or they may get sued for a dog bite, they are accidents waiting to happen, they need educating but they don't know that and mostly wouldn't care if they did. All of that knowledge will not save my dogs life if I'm in the wrong place at the wrong time.

I'm not saying don't go to dog parks, I'm saying it's to be done at your own risk.

[Poodle wrangler]

Half the reason some dogs are there is because their owners can't walk them or catch them outside fencing.

I agree with HW.

Many owners I chat to at dog parks imply that's why they're there!

They admit how much their (often large) dog pulls and doesn't come when called!

You only have to watch.....

Sure enough, the dog doesn't come when they call and dog pulls owner back to the car on leash.

Many people don't want to tackle training a dog with bad habits (pulling on leash, poor recall) and are time poor, so this isn't going to change anytime soon.

At least they're getting their dog some exercise and MOST people are sensible about not bringing an aggro dog.

If I'm honest- I like the dog park.

I like talking about dogs, petting other dogs and watching them run around like loons

[Brandiandwe]

I use dog parks but only when I can run my guys alone. We don't do other breeds or dogs. This is partly because my two girls are breed snobs, high prey and reactive, so rude, barking or small dogs aren't ideal. My three are muzzled by law, and should a fight break out, they'd be toast. They have a specific playing style which involves very high speed tip and run followed by bumping, snarling and tripping at speed, which most other dogs don't do. And because, basically, a lot of people are idiots. The number of times a small dog owner has told me its ok because their small dog thinks its a big one is incredible. Big dog owners want to play with the greys, but change their tune when their 'pretty fast dog' is overtaken by the greys. Sigh. We do best alone or with older confident big dogs who wander around checking pee mail. These dogs are few and far between.

[Dame Aussie]

Where are the " it was the other dogs fault, not yours. You have the right to expect a dog to behave in a public place" relies? Instead, the OP is told not to take her dog to these places. Interesting given the other thread.

It's completely the big dogs owners fault.

The reason people are suggesting avoiding dog parks is that these kind of incidents are so common in them.

[koalathebear]

The other thing that annoys me is when people bring their dogs and then sit down and have their own social experience and don't watch their dogs..

I find that sort of behaviour quite weird. We watch our dogs like hawks when we're at the dog park - but I've seen people dump their dog and then sit in a corner on the phone/texting/chatting with friends and not even looking at their dogs. One time, a guy dumped his pit bull in the park and went outside to chat to a mate. The dog was fine, but it was such a risky and strange thing to do. I've seen people leave their small children unattended to while they wandered off to do various things. Our dogs are friendly around children but the parents didn't know that!

We used to get the same people coming through at the same time, these days not so much but there are a lot of familiar faces and dogs and as for all things dog-related, it's a matter of being vigiliant. Our dogs are happy to play with one another - often the park is deserted and they will simply play amongst themselves. They also really enjoy playing with other dogs though. Sometimes owners get really happy because they say after romping with our three, their dog will be nice and tired for the day :laugh:

[bertie]

Simply Grand, I'm sticking with my original assumption & I'm highly amused & puzzled your lesson hasn't got through. But nice try

[Salukifan]

.

I'm not saying don't go to dog parks, I'm saying it's to be done at your own risk.

The problem for small dog owners its that its not just the owners risk. The risk to the dog IF it meets the wrong dog is significant.

Its a risk I'm simply not prepared to take. I know that most times it would probably be OK but my dogs don't particularly enjoy the company of strange dogs and they're older now.

Best to seek exercise elsewhere or wait for quieter times.

Dog parks are an artificial situation that's not natural for a territorial pack animal and the combination of sizes can see the equivalent of a toddler being let loose in the middle of a rugby game. Add clueless owners of some dogs and it's an accident waiting to happen IMO.

[Her Majesty Dogmad]

I'd recommend going to friends with large gardens, it's a change of scene and there's plenty of room to play - my own dogs are all over 12 yrs of age, my 2 foster are a bit younger but I don't want any of them terrified or injured - that's what will happen if I go to a dog park - it might only be one dog, could be more that are the cause of this but it only takes one dog to kill yours, break it's back or whatever, when you have small dogs.

I recommend you don't go back - Toy Poodles are like fluffy toys to some dogs - it can set off their prey drive - as per your experience.

Your dog is lucky to have survived.

Edited November 9, 2013 by dogmad

[Pjrt]

I had a cracker of a dog park story from one of my clients during the week.

They had been there for a while when they noticed one particular dog, a Malamute , did not seem to be attended by anyone. They went around and enquired with everyone but no owner could be found for the dog. The dog had a collar & council disk so they caught the dog and called the council, who some time later came to collect it. The council ranger called my client later to finish off the story...... The ranger called the owner and says 'Do you own a Malamute?', Owner says 'Yes but she's locked up safe now!". Ranger asks 'Where?'. Owner say 'Oh, she escaped this morning but we found her and now she is safe'. Again ranger asks 'Where?'...Owner says 'Oh we dropped her off at the dog park so we could go shopping in the city!!!!!!!!!!'

Owner freely admitted where they had left the dog before the ranger disclosed that he now had custody of their dog!

Dog only knows what goes through some peoples heads....obviously not oxygen in some cases

[Salukifan]

I had a cracker of a dog park story from one of my clients during the week.

They had been there for a while when they noticed one particular dog, a Malamute , did not seem to be attended by anyone. They went around and enquired with everyone but no owner could be found for the dog. The dog had a collar & council disk so they caught the dog and called the council, who some time later came to collect it. The council ranger called my client later to finish off the story...... The ranger called the owner and says 'Do you own a Malamute?', Owner says 'Yes but she's locked up safe now!". Ranger asks 'Where?'. Owner say 'Oh, she escaped this morning but we found her and now she is safe'. Again ranger asks 'Where?'...Owner says 'Oh we dropped her off at the dog park so we could go shopping in the city!!!!!!!!!!'

Owner freely admitted where they had left the dog before the ranger disclosed that he now had custody of their dog!

Dog only knows what goes through some peoples heads....obviously not oxygen in some cases

Sadly, not the first incidence I've heard of people dropping off their dog to amuse itself.

[trifecta]

It is a shame that dogs are 'encouraged'/forced to engage with each other .

I totally agree with you, persephone

Why do owners think their dogs need to play?

Is the interaction between strange dogs & even adult pack members really play in the context that we as humans interpret play?

This is a genuine question & I don't pretend to know the answer as I am not a behaviourist, however I believe we are reading behaviours as 'play' when they are in fact behaviours which are precursors to aggressive, predatory or sexual encounters.

I have two 9 year old dogs, they occasionally 'play' with one another to sort out some perceived inequality in pack dynamics, but it is not what I would term 'play' more the rumbling that WW refers to. They certainly never play with dogs outside of their pack & have never shown an interest in this, as a unit they are totally self contained.

[koalathebear]

It is a shame that dogs are 'encouraged'/forced to engage with each other .

I totally agree with you, persephone

Why do owners think their dogs need to play?

There is no forcing. At our dog park, our dogs like to run around with other dogs. Other dogs go there and chase a ball. Other dogs just chill out in the sun. Some people bring their elderly or anti-social dogs and just walk in laps around the park with the dogs (it's huge). They do about 4 laps and then leave without interacting with our dogs and our dogs leave them alone.