Angeluca Posted October 26, 2013 Author Share Posted October 26, 2013 I guess if one is accepted the other will die out and if people are serious will re register their dogs with the new registry or not. Why are people so against new breeds, when done properly? Please don't take it as I am, I fully support anything dog done properly. But the lines get blurred as to who is doing it properly so it becomes hard to support. Just going to remind people, I love my sister's bullarab, he is a giant boofhead, (who attempted to ruin my new dog pen) but he is very sound and is able to be lead down the street by my 5 yr old nephew. And if he was an example of the breed temperament he would out rank alot of other breeds on my faves list. He has no drive except for chasing butterflies so would never be of purpose, but not all ANKC breeds live up to their purpose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mixeduppup Posted October 26, 2013 Share Posted October 26, 2013 I guess if one is accepted the other will die out and if people are serious will re register their dogs with the new registry or not. Why are people so against new breeds, when done properly? Please don't take it as I am, I fully support anything dog done properly. But the lines get blurred as to who is doing it properly so it becomes hard to support. Just going to remind people, I love my sister's bullarab, he is a giant boofhead, (who attempted to ruin my new dog pen) but he is very sound and is able to be lead down the street by my 5 yr old nephew. And if he was an example of the breed temperament he would out rank alot of other breeds on my faves list. He has no drive except for chasing butterflies so would never be of purpose, but not all ANKC breeds live up to their purpose. Most bullarabs i meet are very calm dogs. Horse puppy (my bullarab) is only 9months old and the quietest young dog you'd ever meet. She has no drive either but she was introduced to a pig and immediately went into prey drive, it was very odd. As long as she's not near pigs she's a dream :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kelpiecuddles Posted October 26, 2013 Share Posted October 26, 2013 (edited) she was introduced to a pig and immediately went into prey drive, it was very odd. I still remember watching my first herding trial with my 9 month old kelpie sitting on my lap, they were setting up and I'd been chatting to one of the old blokes there so I asked him, "How do you know if a dog has a real potential and interest for herding?" He told me to wait a second, then the sheep ran across from the holding yard to the arena about 30 metres away but in full view of Sascha, within seconds she was whining and wriggling to get off my lap, her ears were up and she knew exactly where those sheep were... the bloke told me he thought she'd 'do ok' and gave me a wink LOL She lives with free range rabbits, chooks, etc, etc and that was the first time I'd ever seen her do anything like that! Edited October 26, 2013 by kelpiecuddles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mixeduppup Posted October 26, 2013 Share Posted October 26, 2013 Yep same with my girls, I even have a pet sheep which they completely ignore but take them to a farm and if they see cattle and sheep they completely change. genetics is a wonderful thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kelpiecuddles Posted October 26, 2013 Share Posted October 26, 2013 Yeah it's funny isn't it. I only ever did one herding day with Sascha, just couldn't afford to keep going but if I want the chooks in the coop I can point her where I want her and she'll help me put them in having never had any formal training, It's amazing how they just seem to know what to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mixeduppup Posted October 26, 2013 Share Posted October 26, 2013 Yeah it's funny isn't it. I only ever did one herding day with Sascha, just couldn't afford to keep going but if I want the chooks in the coop I can point her where I want her and she'll help me put them in having never had any formal training, It's amazing how they just seem to know what to do. I've had a 12 week old pup escape and bring me a whole flock of my pet ducks that were happily grazing up the back :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Posted October 26, 2013 Share Posted October 26, 2013 The bull arab breeders have a registry of their own though So do most breeds in development and thats usually what stops them ever really getting to where they could get if they had a third party registry - because there is a greater risk where the people can branch off and do it THEIR way - its why you see three registries for the Aussie Bulldog and several for the Australian Labradooodle. Think about it - knowing the breed politics of all breeds - not just those in development if the registry wasnt third party with set rules for who can and cant decide about changing the standard and what needs to be done for registration purposes etc same could happen even for those which have long been established. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mixeduppup Posted October 26, 2013 Share Posted October 26, 2013 The bull arab breeders have a registry of their own though So do most breeds in development and thats usually what stops them ever really getting to where they could get if they had a third party registry - because there is a greater risk where the people can branch off and do it THEIR way - its why you see three registries for the Aussie Bulldog and several for the Australian Labradooodle. Think about it - knowing the breed politics of all breeds - not just those in development if the registry wasnt third party with set rules for who can and cant decide about changing the standard and what needs to be done for registration purposes etc same could happen even for those which have long been established. But they create their own registries usually because the ANKC and the like won't even consider accepting them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Posted October 26, 2013 Share Posted October 26, 2013 Which one is the proper one if any? I guess it would be the one that gets to the recognition finish line first! With the ANKC that's about right and because it has to withstand 15 years of being the parent club not many can last the distance. Once they are accepted the ANKC wont take any notice of splinter groups. The MDBA comes in much sooner than this with the foundation registry but it's still about who applies for the foundation registry first after they fit the parent club criteria. Once they have been accepted for the foundation registry no splinter groups are able to be involved and they only work with the parent club. It is the parent club which is able to announce that if people want to be sure they have a purebred that unless they purchase dogs with the registry issued papers they are not bona fide pure breds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remarkabull Posted October 26, 2013 Share Posted October 26, 2013 As far as type goes I'd say these 2 certainly look like the same breed go dog despite the difference in markings and colour. This is Simi and her son Arnold (he is 6 months old) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Posted October 26, 2013 Share Posted October 26, 2013 The bull arab breeders have a registry of their own though So do most breeds in development and thats usually what stops them ever really getting to where they could get if they had a third party registry - because there is a greater risk where the people can branch off and do it THEIR way - its why you see three registries for the Aussie Bulldog and several for the Australian Labradooodle. Think about it - knowing the breed politics of all breeds - not just those in development if the registry wasnt third party with set rules for who can and cant decide about changing the standard and what needs to be done for registration purposes etc same could happen even for those which have long been established. But they create their own registries usually because the ANKC and the like won't even consider accepting them. Yes they need to keep records to be able to know what they are breeding with etc and they have to have their own registries because if they ever want recognition thats part of the criteria - so for 15 years they are at high risk of personalities and differing opinions seeing some move off and splinter groups forming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remarkabull Posted October 26, 2013 Share Posted October 26, 2013 The bull arab breeders have a registry of their own though So do most breeds in development and thats usually what stops them ever really getting to where they could get if they had a third party registry - because there is a greater risk where the people can branch off and do it THEIR way - its why you see three registries for the Aussie Bulldog and several for the Australian Labradooodle. Think about it - knowing the breed politics of all breeds - not just those in development if the registry wasnt third party with set rules for who can and cant decide about changing the standard and what needs to be done for registration purposes etc same could happen even for those which have long been established. But they create their own registries usually because the ANKC and the like won't even consider accepting them. Yes they need to keep records to be able to know what they are breeding with etc and they have to have their own registries because if they ever want recognition thats part of the criteria - so for 15 years they are at high risk of personalities and differing opinions seeing some move off and splinter groups forming. And this has happened with Aussie Bulldogs. It was quite a while ago so I don't know the ins and outs of it but basically the founding person (Pip Nobes) and another founding member had different ideas on where the breed should be going and so he split off to start another group. Although TBH when you're still heavily using another breed (BB) and the biggest selling point is how much percentage of that breed the dogs have in them, why not just get that breed to begin with? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angeluca Posted October 26, 2013 Author Share Posted October 26, 2013 I have not input to the previous comments but geez it is making for interesting read. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Posted October 26, 2013 Share Posted October 26, 2013 (edited) The bull arab breeders have a registry of their own though So do most breeds in development and thats usually what stops them ever really getting to where they could get if they had a third party registry - because there is a greater risk where the people can branch off and do it THEIR way - its why you see three registries for the Aussie Bulldog and several for the Australian Labradooodle. Think about it - knowing the breed politics of all breeds - not just those in development if the registry wasnt third party with set rules for who can and cant decide about changing the standard and what needs to be done for registration purposes etc same could happen even for those which have long been established. But they create their own registries usually because the ANKC and the like won't even consider accepting them. Yes they need to keep records to be able to know what they are breeding with etc and they have to have their own registries because if they ever want recognition thats part of the criteria - so for 15 years they are at high risk of personalities and differing opinions seeing some move off and splinter groups forming. And this has happened with Aussie Bulldogs. It was quite a while ago so I don't know the ins and outs of it but basically the founding person (Pip Nobes) and another founding member had different ideas on where the breed should be going and so he split off to start another group. Although TBH when you're still heavily using another breed (BB) and the biggest selling point is how much percentage of that breed the dogs have in them, why not just get that breed to begin with? One of the splits for the Aust Cobberdogs was that some wanted to bring in a border Collie infusion - the founders were pretty upset about this as they had worked hard to have no shedding genes left and they felt introducing the possibility of a herding gene was horrific - once they get out voted etc its a done deal so they either continue on watching what they had envisioned for the breed trashed [ in their opinion] or leave and start again with another registry. Another split was about the level of testing and of course recently with the name change. With a third party registry they cant just change the rules mid stream and there is a procedure which cant be manipulated by individuals to protect the whole thing and give them a better chance of succeeding. Edited October 26, 2013 by Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kajtek Posted October 26, 2013 Share Posted October 26, 2013 (edited) As far as type goes I'd say these 2 certainly look like the same breed go dog despite the difference in markings and colour. The ABS still has a bit of work to do to stabilize the appearance of the breed. I have no doubt they will get to that point in the future as there are many very dedicated breeders in this group. Anyway, here are my standard ABs. To me, they are perfect :D Edited October 26, 2013 by Kajtek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remarkabull Posted October 27, 2013 Share Posted October 27, 2013 As far as type goes I'd say these 2 certainly look like the same breed go dog despite the difference in markings and colour. The ABS still has a bit of work to do to stabilize the appearance of the breed. I have no doubt they will get to that point in the future as there are many very dedicated breeders in this group. Anyway, here are my standard ABs. To me, they are perfect :D Gorgeous :) As with many breeds there are some people who own 2 dogs of the opposite sex and will only ever breed those 2 dogs together with no real thought as to whether or not they are actually suited to each other. I've had others think I'm mad for keeping a male pup from my first litter. Why would I keep a boy who I can't use for breeding with my bitch (his mum) when I could have kept a girl and then had 2 bitches to breed from? Some still don't understand when I explain that he was the best pup in the litter and is everything I'm trying to produce and isn't it the idea that I keep the best to go on with. He may never produce a litter, he needs to be hip and elbow scored first and obviously I'll make the decision once he is mature whether or not to make him available as a stud. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kajtek Posted October 27, 2013 Share Posted October 27, 2013 (edited) Gorgeous :) Thank you :) Edited October 27, 2013 by Kajtek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mixeduppup Posted October 27, 2013 Share Posted October 27, 2013 (edited) My friend had a litter of ABs not long ago (she's registered with the ABS) and I was there helping her with the birth and I have to say that it was wonderful to see a bulldog give birth naturally, with NO problems! Edited October 27, 2013 by mixeduppup Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remarkabull Posted October 27, 2013 Share Posted October 27, 2013 (edited) Gorgeous :) Edited October 27, 2013 by Remarkabull Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remarkabull Posted October 27, 2013 Share Posted October 27, 2013 My friend had a litter of ABs not long ago (she's registered with the ABS) and I was there helping her with the birth and I have to say that it was wonderful to see a bulldog give birth naturally, with NO problems! My bitch also had a natural and trouble free delivery, although it was long (she had 11 pups). There are still some bitches who can't whelp naturally but if they've had 2 litters delivered by c-section then they can't be bred from again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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