Puppy Preschool

[Ranger00]

Hi all

I've been doing a lot of researching trying to find a puppy preschool/class for my new BC (coming home in a little under 2 weeks) but to be perfectly honest I can't find one I am happy with, and the recommendations on DOL for ones in Perth are mostly either "Yeah it was okay" or really old and no longer seem to be running (such as Train A Pup, which going by the website is defunct since it hasn't been updated since 2011).

I do not want to go to any class that has a puppy "free for all" because my boy is very submissive for a BC, bordering on too submissive (IMO) - I'm happy to work on that, if I wasn't I would back out of the purchase, but I don't think another pup rough-housing with him or accidentally trampling him is going to help that issue, so I simply don't want to risk it. My other concern with the class for 8-12 week old pups is that there has been a number of cases of parvo in my area recently.

The breeder recommended a particular class to me but after enquiring with them it turns out it's not for puppies that have not had their second vaccination.

I have no concerns with my ability to train him, so my reason for enquiring about puppy classes is just for the socialisation aspect. I don't know many people with vaccinated friendly dogs to socialise him with at home til he has received his vaccinations either.

So I put the question out there to those more knowledgeable on DOL - is it absolutely necessary to take my boy to puppy preschool, or can I make do without it?

Thanks!

[minimax]

I found puppy pre-school more for the humans than the puppies, and didn't take my second pup. I took my first pup as she was my first pup that was "mine" and not a family pet and I learnt some good things, but if you're comfortable with training then I'd say no, pre-school isn't necessary. It's better to not go than to go to one that has negative impact on your pup.

[Sandra777]

Nope, not essential at all.

If you have the means of providing the same education there's absolutely no point in them.

"Puppy Preschools" are a very modern invention :)

[Guest Maeby Fünke]

I only think it's worthwhile if the person leading it (usually a vet nurse) has a clue about dog obedience. The last one I went to, I didn't go back after the first class. It was pretty bad.

eta

Also, I think it's wrong when vet clinics charge $50 a class when the person leading it has had no training in dog obedience whatsoever. Fair enough if it was run by an obedience club, but they're usually run by vet clinics.

And it sh*its me how they use the classes as an opportunity to push their crappy dog food onto you.

Edited October 1, 2013 by Maeby Fünke

[Guest Maeby Fünke]

So I guess what I'm saying is, I would only recommend going to one that is run by an obedience club, with qualified instructors. Otherwise, it's a waste of money.

Edited October 1, 2013 by Maeby Fünke

[Ranger00]

Thanks all. My concern was the lack of socialisation if I decided not to take him to a puppy class, but on the other hand what good is it if the "socialisation" just hinders him even more. I was under the impression puppy preschool is more for socialisation than actual training/obedience.

I remember (very vaguely) 15 years ago taking our first BC to puppy preschool and she was easily the smartest of the class but also very exciteable. The trick we had taught her and were going to show the class (everyone was set a task to teach their pup a trick and present it the next week) was "speak", however the class "trainer" made her wait until after all the other puppies - about 12-15 of them - had shown their trick, by which time she was already barking her scone off wanting her treat. I remember crying about it in the car on the way home, lol. I was about 11.

[Nushie]

Some of the obedience clubs run puppy classes. Maybe check out the local clubs and see if any are suitable.

In general I really liked puppy school, but as others have said, it was more for the people rather than the puppies. My school had limited interaction between the puppies with only about 10 mins of "play time" and the pups were selected so that like puppies could play together and wouldnt annoy the more timid pups in the bunch.

The puppy school that i went to didnt start until after the second vac, but we had family that had dogs so we could get some socialistation with them before the school started.

[fuzzy82]

There's a lot more to socialisation than playing with other puppies. If you feel like you can train and socialise the puppy on your own, then there's no need for puppy classes. A good puppy class shouldn't just be a free for all play group, it should expose puppies to strangers, including funny looking ones, expose them to different novel objects, noise, etc. I only know of one in my area that does this, the rest are all about the puppies playing and basic obedience training.

Of course puppy classes are good for socialisation anyway, because it means the puppy is exposed to new things, such as riding in the car, being in a new environment and being around strangers and their dogs. But I do feel like classes are mostly for people who don't really know what they're doing.

Personally I know I can train and socialise a puppy properly, but I'm also interested in doing sports with my puppy, which means exposing it to a class environment would be an important part of socialisation. If your puppy is going to be a pet and you've got training/socialisation under control, there's no reason to worry about classes.

[Guest hankodie]

I think a lot of the puppy schools out there are terrible to be honest. Back when I got Odie I will admit I was nowhere near as dog savvy as I am now and I took her to one of those ones that was run at a vet hospital. The class was run by a couple of nurses and it involved a lot of free play and very little obedience. The puppies would get way too excited and the dominant ones were allowed to bully the timid ones and the whole thing was just a disaster. At the time I thought I was doing the right thing by "socialising" her. She was a confident puppy and still is quite a confident dog but I really attribute that early experience of puppy school for a lot of her frustrated greeting/reactivity issues on the lead. Now whenever she sees other dogs her first instinct is to go into excitement mode and it's very very hard to bring her attention back to me if the dog(s) get too close. Her social skills are terrible.

My 4 month old Golden on the other hand is showing excellent social skills and I opted not to take him to puppy class - instead i set up play dates with older, known dogs who mostly just ignored him and taught him calm play. I also used them as distraction to improve his training. He started attending formal obedience at around 3 months, the one I go to is all ages but at the moment there are 4 other puppies around his age. 3 of them have gone to "puppy pre-school" and the owners are having an incredibly hard time trying to get them to focus and pay attention.

Anyways my point is if you are going down the puppy school route make sure it's a good one, preferably run by an accredited trainer who knows what they're talking about!

Edited October 1, 2013 by hankodie

[DeltaCharlie]

We have 11 dogs, yet we still take ours to puppy preschool. Even our last litter went to school (we kept 2 pups) and they have 9 other dogs at home to learn off, were at trials most weekend, and we are experienced trainers ourselves. You can't beat a well run puppy school and I really hope you can find one. We are lucky that our vet runs a really good one and it has the added benefit of making the vets a happy place right from the start.

Good luck with the search :)

[julesluvscavs]

I don't think you have to feel obligated to go puppy kindy with your puppy. I went with mine more just for socialization reasons. It was held over 5 weeks (one night a week) and we only had about 5 dogs in it i think from memory, they were different breeds/sizes/ages. I wanted Miah to get used to being around bigger dogs as well.

We did do a fair bit in our classes, but the pups were all on leash except for some games we played, then it was done under very close supervision. We also let the dogs sniff,/have a bit of a play with each other. I must admit one bigger more playful type dog started getting bit rough with little Miah but i didnt want to overreact and put unnecessary fear into her. They were ok. They were all very well behaved just playful and silly as puppies are lol

Its been months since we finished and now we have just started a 5 week basic course at a dog training school. Miah is now 10 months. Our class at this place consist also of only about 5 dogs, but all different sizes/breeds/ages. Theres strict guidelines in place about our time training there which all seem fair and sensible to me ;)

I just found her blog post from puppy kindy http://julesluvscavs.blogspot.com.au/2013/03/miahs-first-puppy-kindy-session.html

Edited October 1, 2013 by Jules❤3Cavs

[DesertDobes]

No way. Puppy preschool is a waste of money and puppies do a lot of their socialising in the litter then the next few months are about relationships with people.

My husband and I were just laughing about how we got conned into buying a pouch with a chain in it last time we went to puppy preschool a decade ago. Apparently we were to throw the pouch on the ground every time the puppy did the wrong thing and this would stop the behaviour ! This was part of that well known franchise of dog trainers...

[Salukifan]

I honestly think a well run puppy preschool benefits novice owners more than the pup.

If you have the capacity to provide controlled socialisation with other dogs and you're going onto training, I'd not consider it the end of the earth to miss it.

[LisaCC]

I didn't do puppy preschool with Nova, he only played with limited known calm dogs (not very many), but I socialised him by taking him with me to many places in my arms until he had all his vaccs (there was a massive parvo out break here and they vets were worried about pups walking until after 3rd vac), socialisation doesn't mean they have to play with other dogs.

Then when it started up we went to Beginners obedience with a trainer and behaviourist (not a volunteer from a club either) when he was 15wks, we just graduated last night. I think it was much better than a puppy preschool.

[dotdashdot]

I think for owners who are confident in their ability to train and socialize their dog properly - you should just hold out for a proper obedience club.

However, as someone who comes into contact with so many owners who have no idea of what puppies need, puppy preschool is definitely beneficial for some. Today I had to bite my tongue throughout a whole sale with a family who had just picked up a poodle pup that wasn't even 6 weeks yet. When she said the age I was like when I started telling her about bite inhibition she told me to tell the (10yr) daughter as it was hers. People like that make my job hard. People like Lhok make my job enjoyable :D

My work offers the chance to be trained to run our own puppy preschool. I see it as an opportunity to educate, and teach Joe Public about responsible dog ownership and the dog laws (i.e I have an agenda, I'm so sick of idiot dog owners)

LisaCC - on the socialization thing - we just started at obedience training last week and their "socialization" is walking past a line of dogs and everyone is making their dog focus on them and ignore either the dog walking past or the line of dogs and owners. I was impressed (I don't like dogs coming up to Cleo anyway)

ETA: I didn't do puppy preschool either. I went twice as a kid, and my dad's 40 year training veteran.

Edited October 1, 2013 by dotdashdot

[HeroeswitBSD]

I think Puppy Pre School is a waste of money if you have friends with nice dogs and kids that you can use to help socialise the puppies I would go that way, otherwise I would go with a good obedience club/ trained professional run puppy class. It is all a very personal decision but there are more then 1 way to train a dog and there will be thousands of opinions. Go with what you think is best for your individual dog.

[Smurf1]

J. we are in Perth and went to classes run by Paw Prints http://www.pawprintspettraining.com.au/ They are qualitifed dog trainers and in the classes we attended did not do the "free for all" play session, puppy play was 2 puppies at a time.

Oh I should add that to begin with my puppy was very shy and they didnt push the interaction, letting her progress as she felt comfortable.

Edited October 1, 2013 by Smurf1

[Podengo]

I took Elsie to puppy pre-school, and I teach obedience classes myself! It wasn't about me learning stuff, it was just a great opportunity to expose her to something new... Especially as I got her close to Christmas and my agility and obedience clubs had closed for the holidays.

[Steph M]

So I guess what I'm saying is, I would only recommend going to one that is run by an obedience club, with qualified instructors. Otherwise, it's a waste of money.

I don't agree 100%. We loved ours! We're not total novices but it was handy to have everyone in the same boat, the dogs got a play and owners got advice specific to them and we all got to have a chat and have a laugh. We did learn some skills and new approaches and any problems that cropped up IE leash chewing and toilet training were advised by the instructor, who was a vet nurse. I attribute a lot of our fabulous dog to the early socialisation and introduction to new people, dogs and places. The vet nurses even bought their older, calmer dogs in one day too and did some demos and let the pups meet some older dogs.

Of course this can all be done in house, it certainly isn't essential but we really loved ours. I guess we got lucky in finding one we loved and it lived up to that. Certainly wouldn't have bothered if they'd all been rubbish in our area.

[Ranger00]

Thanks for all the further posts, seems like there are varied views on the subject, which is what I suspected! My worry is really only about not having many other doggy friends to socialise him with, but I can take him out and about with me (carried, of course), and I've already organised to have people come by and meet him... Don't know anyone with children, though..

I'll give Pawprints a call, they were one that I looked at but no locations particularly close to me, except the one held at a doggy daycare... I presume that's just the location though, and that the facilitator is someone unrelated to the business?