I'm Becoming Afraid To Walk My Dogs

[tdierikx]

Are you subject to that BSL stuff that going on in Victoria, surprisingly my view on that is banning a breed will not make any difference to dog attacks, I think they are an easy target. The only interaction I've had with an Am staff type has been positive and he was off leash, I was terrified and he was a perfect gentleman. Also a friend of mine has one and it's very gentle with Bonny and her Maltese.

Oh and I apologize for being a pain in the bum, it all comes from fear and anger on my part.

No - I live in NSW... but let's not kid ourselves that BSL doesn't exist here. If it's large and bull breed, it's viewed with suspicion everywhere... thanks to the media telling us at every opportunity that all bull breed mixes ar Pitbull and want to eat your little dogs and children.

You are playing right into the hands of the people who want to nationalise BSL by your actions and reactions stemming from the bad experience you've had... and if that's OK by you, then I don't think we can come to any agreement in this discussion.

I love my dogs with every fibre of my being, and they reciprocate in myriad ways... and I will defend my right to love and be loved by my large dogs vociferously.

T.

[RazorBlade]

I don't remember the dog attacks we have now happening when I was a kid either, especially not the really serious ones. Where have we gone wrong?

We've gone bloody wrong when the vocal minority scream blue murder to have EVERYONE and their darned dogs legislated against to the point that it's freaking impossible to take them out to socialise properly... FFS, can't anyone SEE that?

No - let's just stamp our feet up and down and legislate to the lowest common denominator and royally fark it up for EVRYONE... that'll fix it, right?

T.

I haven't been to an off leash park (only a beach for small dogs and not many of them) can't dogs socialize there, or is that not what you mean?

Just go and look into a designated off-leash park Trudy08... and tell me if you'd like to let your dog run there with all of the others to "socialise" with...

The problem with most off-leash parks is that they are few and far between, and likely to be highly populated with dogs who aren't ever allowed out anywhere else... and thusly generally running amok like loons...

Yeah - I'd love to take my pup there for some socialisation... NOT!

That said - there are a few off-leash parks where there is a reasonably high proportion of genuinely decent owners with well socialised and friendly dogs... but it's a hike to find one like that at a time that fits in around working for a living.

Quite frankly, I just keep my dogs at home - more because they are large dogs, 2 of which are bull breed crosses - and hysterical people like yourself make taking my dogs out for a walk a very unpleasant experience... even though they are on lead and very social dogs.

T.

I don't have breedism...........it's off lead large dogs that scare me.

Well it's true Razor I don't care what the breed is, just that it's on the large size and it's off leash.

Yeah breeds would be much to specific. You like a much broader sweeping generalisation. That way you can point the finger at even more evil, degenerate, law breakers out for a walk with their dogs. Small dogs are ok are they?

Breaking the law is not ok period. It's this idiotic behavior (ignoring the law) which has caused the stupid restrictions and stupid breed laws. Because some Anus thinks that the law does not apply to them. They can't police every Idiot so make a broad spectrum law. So thank you for being the type of person who has made owning a dog more difficult in this country.

You openly disobey the law and can be put is the same basket as every other bast*rd that does. Which law is irrelevant.

You need to stop calling me nasty names, it's hurting my feelings.

[BC Crazy]

I am not a big person. At 5ft tall & 48 kg. I also have hand/ lower arm impairment on both left & right sides so walking my 2 Border Collies can be very difficult at times. I am scared of off leash big dogs of any breed approaching us or if they are leashed & but not under effective control. Most smaller ones I can frighten off verbally thus far. I just head in the opposite direction asap but it means I never let my guard down while I'm out & about. I am constantly searching in our radius for incoming danger.

[tdierikx]

Oh, and you are MUCH more likely to see small dogs running about offleash or on those stupid extender leads where the owner has no control of them whatsoever - but it's the larger dogs that get the bad rap because "small dogs don't do as much damage"... yes they bloody well do!

T.

[Angeluca]

I don't remember the dog attacks we have now happening when I was a kid either, especially not the really serious ones. Where have we gone wrong?

We've gone bloody wrong when the vocal minority scream blue murder to have EVERYONE and their darned dogs legislated against to the point that it's freaking impossible to take them out to socialise properly... FFS, can't anyone SEE that?

No - let's just stamp our feet up and down and legislate to the lowest common denominator and royally fark it up for EVRYONE... that'll fix it, right?

T.

I haven't been to an off leash park (only a beach for small dogs and not many of them) can't dogs socialize there, or is that not what you mean?

Just go and look into a designated off-leash park Trudy08... and tell me if you'd like to let your dog run there with all of the others to "socialise" with...

The problem with most off-leash parks is that they are few and far between, and likely to be highly populated with dogs who aren't ever allowed out anywhere else... and thusly generally running amok like loons...

Yeah - I'd love to take my pup there for some socialisation... NOT!

That said - there are a few off-leash parks where there is a reasonably high proportion of genuinely decent owners with well socialised and friendly dogs... but it's a hike to find one like that at a time that fits in around working for a living.

Quite frankly, I just keep my dogs at home - more because they are large dogs, 2 of which are bull breed crosses - and hysterical people like yourself make taking my dogs out for a walk a very unpleasant experience... even though they are on lead and very social dogs.

T.

I don't have breedism...........it's off lead large dogs that scare me.

Well it's true Razor I don't care what the breed is, just that it's on the large size and it's off leash.

Yeah breeds would be much to specific. You like a much broader sweeping generalisation. That way you can point the finger at even more evil, degenerate, law breakers out for a walk with their dogs. Small dogs are ok are they?

Breaking the law is not ok period. It's this idiotic behavior (ignoring the law) which has caused the stupid restrictions and stupid breed laws. Because some Anus thinks that the law does not apply to them. They can't police every Idiot so make a broad spectrum law. So thank you for being the type of person who has made owning a dog more difficult in this country.

You openly disobey the law and can be put is the same basket as every other bast*rd that does. Which law is irrelevant.

You need to stop calling me nasty names, it's hurting my feelings.

I didn't actually call You anything, i associated those names to a type of population, If you too can see how you can be put in that same basket, then that is your issue.

i said 'can be' not 'are'

idiotic behavior isn't a direct association 'i said what u do is idiotic not you are'

and 'some Anus' and 'Bast*rd* is a broad statement in reference to a group of people who cause life to hard on others without remorse. If you see your self in these categories maybe you should look at you persona.

[Yonjuro]

... like some others here I am saddened that we live in such a society that has become increasingly litigious.

Hell, my 6 year old daughter is not allowed to do cartwheels or handstands in the school playground incase she hurts herself and someone gets sued!!! It is always the good and responsible majority that pay for the mistakes of the minority.

I think the major issue is socialisation - or lack there of as T mentioned. I might be naive here but I believe that if more people concentrated on early and thorough socialisation then I don't think there would be so many frightened people and dogs. Fear breeds more fear and this worrying for all dog owners.

I am actually empathetic to Trudy08's plight. She has been through some horrible stuff, but, I think this thread has become so fear based that continual posts on this merry-go-round are serving no purpose except to alienate certain individuals. Respect is a two way street.

I have no problem with big boofy dogs being walked off-lead around the streets by responsible owners, it is the ones that never get walked or socialised (big and small) that I would worry about - these are the ones that cause problems when they escape.

[Angeluca]

... like some others here I am saddened that we live in such a society that has become increasingly litigious.

Hell, my 6 year old daughter is not allowed to do cartwheels or handstands in the school playground incase she hurts herself and someone gets sued!!! It is always the good and responsible majority that pay for the mistakes of the minority.

I think the major issue is socialisation - or lack there of as T mentioned. I might be naive here but I believe that if more people concentrated on early and thorough socialisation then I don't think there would be so many frightened people and dogs. Fear breeds more fear and this worrying for all dog owners.

I am actually empathetic to Trudy08's plight. She has been through some horrible stuff, but, I think this thread has become so fear based that continual posts on this merry-go-round are serving no purpose except to alienate certain individuals. Respect is a two way street.

I have no problem with big boofy dogs being walked off-lead around the streets by responsible owners, it is the ones that never get walked or socialised (big and small) that I would worry about - these are the ones that cause problems when they escape.

I too am not afraid of dogs off lead, I live rural so not as many leash laws out here. But were there is I would like those to obey those laws so we can keep our freedom and privileges.

Once upon a time there were no laws, then people stopped being responsible and dog control became less and less. incident after incident cause people to complain to authorities, Authorities can only do what they do, impose laws and regulate things that cause society harm or distress. People who do the right thing get regulated as well all due to some 'Anus' who couldn't care about others.

Razor is living in a world probably 20-40 years too late, back then he would been considered an upstanding member of society to have such a dog that good. Now this is not the case.

There is nothing to justify breaking the law, not a good controlled dog nothing. Guide dogs, Security guards and police don't walk around with their dogs loose, and I would tend to believe their dog is more effectively trained. Law is there cause others thought themselves better then everyone else and caused problems. And while we still have that carelessness is out community more laws and more restrictions will come. and we have those people to blame for it not the government.

Edited September 16, 2013 by Angeluca

[grumpette]

I just wanted to make it clear that I am not at all frightened when I see off lead dogs, although I certainly keep a close eye on them I don't descend into panic.

My dogs are friendly and well socialised but I still don't want random dogs just running up to us out of the blue.

I used to have a DA dog and my main concern was for the off lead dogs that approached us. I was once walking said dog, with another of my dogs and as I was walking past a house 2 little dogs came running at us flat out. The owner had them loose in her front yard and when she yelled for them to stop one did but the other kept coming. This little dog meant business and was not coming to say hello. I lifted my dog by the collar (all 30kgs of her) to keep her face away from the little dog but the stupid bloody thing leapt at her face and bit her. As expected she grabbed it and shook the sh!t out of it while it was screaming bloody murder. I managed to make her let it go and quickly took her home and then I returned to the house to check on the little dog who was fine, not even a puncture wound. I was abused and blamed for the entire incident and given the usual crap of 'what if it had been a child' etc.

So, for me, fear has nothing to do with it. It's just about respect for other people and doing the right thing by everyone else. It's really not a big deal and I think it says a lot about a person when they continuously do something that they know may cause distress to others, especially when its against the law in the first place.

Just like you Remarkabull my girl Dee was attacked three times by off lead dogs that were free to roam from their houses. The dogs were predominantly smaller terrier type dogs as well as a Lab x. She was between the ages of 7 and 13 months. The third attack I had her collar so tight that her front feet were off the ground in an attempt to prevent her from biting the attacking dogs. There were three smaller dogs and the Lab x. I was spinning her around in an effort to stop the other dogs biting her. Once the owner finally came out of his house to round up his dogs we stopped spinning, and poor Dee threw up all over me. Consequently she became reactive.

For the next 8 months I was so hyper vigilant on our walks that neither of us enjoyed them. I had no confidence in myself to keep her safe and she had no confidence in me. So for the sake of both our quality of life we started back at obedience training to reduce her critical distance and reactivity to dogs that were barking and lunging at her. This helped to restore my confidence as a competent handler and Dee's confidence in me to keep her safe so that she did not have to react. We also kept walking around the neighbourhood remaining calm as we went past barking off lead dogs. Of all sizes. I quickly learnt that the more reactive I got, the more reactive she got and therefore the more reactive the off lead dogs got. So when the roaming terrier dogs and currently the Shepherd x come out and bark at us I get Dee to heal closely and to calmly walk on.

Do I hate off lead dogs, hell yes. Do I hate small terrier type dogs? No. Their inconsiderate owners are another story. Do I walk the streets and go to obedience armed to the teeth in case off lead dogs approach us. No. Why? Because I need one hand free to pick up poo and carry the bag. Also it means that I go out on a walk ready to fight instead of relaxing. Do I watch for off lead dogs? Hell yes. But I remain calm and walk on with Dee calmly by my side on the far side of the road.

So maybe Trudy08 all that energy that you have in the form of anger and rage could be used is a positive way like a dog sport to increase your confidence and lessen the trauma?

[BC Crazy]

Oh, and you are MUCH more likely to see small dogs running about offleash or on those stupid extender leads where the owner has no control of them whatsoever - but it's the larger dogs that get the bad rap because "small dogs don't do as much damage"... yes they bloody well do!

T.

Actually I am just making the point that I am frightened by the bigger dogs cause I am phsyically at a huge disadvantage weight wise as appossed to a smaller type dog. I am a big dog lover actually...... It is the first time I visited this thread & it will be my last. Not looking for an argument. Better things to do.

Edited September 16, 2013 by BC Crazy

[RazorBlade]

I didn't actually call You anything, i associated those names to a type of population, If you too can see how you can be put in that same basket, then that is your issue.

i said 'can be' not 'are'

idiotic behavior isn't a direct association 'i said what u do is idiotic not you are'

and 'some Anus' and 'Bast*rd* is a broad statement in reference to a group of people who cause life to hard on others without remorse. If you see your self in these categories maybe you should look at you persona.

Come on now, no need to back away from it now.

[Angeluca]

I didn't actually call You anything, i associated those names to a type of population, If you too can see how you can be put in that same basket, then that is your issue.

i said 'can be' not 'are'

idiotic behavior isn't a direct association 'i said what u do is idiotic not you are'

and 'some Anus' and 'Bast*rd* is a broad statement in reference to a group of people who cause life to hard on others without remorse. If you see your self in these categories maybe you should look at you persona.

Come on now, no need to back away from it now.

Take my comments in their most literal terms, however I am willing to state I do find you an arrogant person, that can be directly associated with the stereotypes myself and others have mention for your sheer disregard for the law and the community you live in. One of those other anuses I have state will see you and your disregard to the law and ask themselves why can't they do the same. It is not up to your judgement when and where the law should be obeyed or enforced nor to give yourself or anybody else the privileged that the law does not apply to you. It does not matter You think your dog is good. It does not matter if your dog IS good.

It does not even directly have to do with the behavior you or your dog has in public, What if a bunch of self righteous complainers see you and your dog and report you repeatedly to the council who then impose the law of no dogs in business districts causing your cafe to enforce a regulation of no dogs with a distance of a human consumption premises. And it was all done cause they got a few sly pics of your dog loose and the council had enough of the complaints which would have been unwarranted if you had just clipped a loose lead to his collar.??

Edited September 16, 2013 by Angeluca

[mita]

I

So, for me, fear has nothing to do with it. It's just about respect for other people and doing the right thing by everyone else. It's really not a big deal and I think it says a lot about a person when they continuously do something that they know may cause distress to others, especially when its against the law in the first place.

The voice of sweet reason.

And you've rightly said that, for you, 'fear has nothing to do with it'.

While for those who've had one or more particularly bad experiences in the past, there may be the triggering of a fear response. It's automatic. The fear sensation comes before the thinking processes kick in.

And specially bad experiences were the theme of this thread.

[RazorBlade]

I didn't actually call You anything, i associated those names to a type of population, If you too can see how you can be put in that same basket, then that is your issue.

i said 'can be' not 'are'

idiotic behavior isn't a direct association 'i said what u do is idiotic not you are'

and 'some Anus' and 'Bast*rd* is a broad statement in reference to a group of people who cause life to hard on others without remorse. If you see your self in these categories maybe you should look at you persona.

Come on now, no need to back away from it now.

Take my comments in their most literal terms, however I am willing to state I do find you an arrogant person, that can be directly associated with the stereotypes myself and others have mention for your sheer disregard for the law and the community you live in. One of those other anuses I have state will see you and your disregard to the law and ask themselves why can't they do the same. It is not up to your judgement when and where the law should be obeyed or enforced nor to give yourself or anybody else the privileged that the law does not apply to you. It does not matter You think your dog is good. It does not matter if your dog IS good.

It does not even directly have to do with the behavior you or your dog has in public, What if a bunch of self righteous complainers see you and your dog and report you repeatedly to the council who then impose the law of no dogs in business districts causing your cafe to enforce a regulation of no dogs with a distance of a human consumption premises. And it was all done cause they got a few sly pics of your dog loose and the council had enough of the complaints which would have been unwarranted if you had just clipped a loose lead to his collar.??

You seriously think the haters care if your dog has a lead or doesn't have a lead on as it sits under the table at your local cafe? Who is more of a menace, my dog who sleeps on my foot as I eat my omelet or the two white fluffies on lead, off their heads, barking and trying to tip over the table they are tied to? (True story)

[mita]

I am not a big person. At 5ft tall & 48 kg. I also have hand/ lower arm impairment on both left & right sides so walking my 2 Border Collies can be very difficult at times. I am scared of off leash big dogs of any breed approaching us or if they are leashed & but not under effective control. Most smaller ones I can frighten off verbally thus far. I just head in the opposite direction asap but it means I never let my guard down while I'm out & about. I am constantly searching in our radius for incoming danger.

Another voice of sweet reason. :) Giving a realistic view of what it's like for some people. And providing a very good reason for why there's a council by-law about leashed dogs in designated public areas.

Edited September 16, 2013 by mita

[OSoSwift]

Ever seen what small dogs can do in a fight, I have. One small Aussie terrier cross was attacked by two Tenterfield Terriers - they all were from the same home. The little Silky cross survived - just.

I don't care what breed of dog you have keep it on lead where it should be, have it off lead but under control in off lead areas and we will all get along just fine. Personally I don't care on the size, with a Whippet a biting JR can cause a lot of damage as can a Kelpie or bigger.

Just this week down here a Cavalier was killed by a dog at our off lead beach. The other dog apparently saw the small dog from a few hundred metres away and ran at him at speed with the owner running and calling frantically. The attacking dog paid no heed. Two young children and their mum saw their dog mauled and that badly injured before them he died. The owner of the attacking dog said - oh he has never done that before. Now I believe that is crap either they are lying or have no bloody idea what their dog is telling them. That dog was not under effictive control and should never have been off a lead. This really strikes a cord with me as I occassionally take my Whippets to this beach, it could have been them.

[mita]

Yes. Size and breed of dog have nothing to do with it. Not mentioned in the by-law at all. Just says 'dogs'.

Making it particularly easy to understand. As well as generally applicable to all dogs.

A neat piece of problem-solving, too. When an off-leash dog, in a leash-required public place does something particularly horrendous & even maybe tragic.... then the question is 'What could have been done to prevent the problem?'

So.... easy to understand, does not discriminate among dogs, & prevents problems.

The whole trifecta.

Edited September 16, 2013 by mita

[Steph M]

Trudy08 - I think we ALL know exactly where YOU stand on the issue... 160-odd postings saying pretty much EXACTLY the same thing, and berating anyone who disagrees with your viewpoint, tends to make YOU look a bit overzealous (to say the least)...

Yes - you have had some traumatic incidents occur - no-one is denying that... but I think you may need to step back a little and look at the issue from other people's side of the "argument". Not every off leash dog is going to turn rampaging killer as soon as they see you and your little dog... and if that IS your experience, you may need to start looking into WHY you and your dog seem to attract much more negative dog attention than the law of averages suggests you should.

Just sayin'...

T.

Ok I'll make a deal with you I won't repeat myself as you all know where I stand.

Lets not forget I've been called crazy and it's even been alluded too that I've made everything up.

I had a very traumatic event and because I live in a semi rural community there seems to be quite a few loose dogs.

I'm not sure why we attract rushers, my dog is very well behaved on leash, perhaps that makes her weak and a target, can't really do much about that can I?

Off leash she mixes very well with friends dogs and at the kennels, where she's described as easy going but doesn't submit readily to other dogs but is not aggressive.

I readily admit I die a thousand deaths when I see an off leash dog and imagine all kinds of horrors that never happen.

Being made to feel vulnerable makes me cranky, you may have noticed that bit.

For the third time, It was me who made the crazy comment and it was in regard to feeling like you needed a weapon to walk your dogs safely, it was widely directed, not solely at you and I said THE ACTION of carrying this out stank of craziness. It seems to suit you to adopt the tag like a pouting child though, so carry on.

I don't think anyone alluded you might have invented anything either.

Edited September 16, 2013 by Steph M

[Alison03]

I didn't actually call You anything, i associated those names to a type of population, If you too can see how you can be put in that same basket, then that is your issue.

i said 'can be' not 'are'

idiotic behavior isn't a direct association 'i said what u do is idiotic not you are'

and 'some Anus' and 'Bast*rd* is a broad statement in reference to a group of people who cause life to hard on others without remorse. If you see your self in these categories maybe you should look at you persona.

Come on now, no need to back away from it now.

Take my comments in their most literal terms, however I am willing to state I do find you an arrogant person, that can be directly associated with the stereotypes myself and others have mention for your sheer disregard for the law and the community you live in. One of those other anuses I have state will see you and your disregard to the law and ask themselves why can't they do the same. It is not up to your judgement when and where the law should be obeyed or enforced nor to give yourself or anybody else the privileged that the law does not apply to you. It does not matter You think your dog is good. It does not matter if your dog IS good.

It does not even directly have to do with the behavior you or your dog has in public, What if a bunch of self righteous complainers see you and your dog and report you repeatedly to the council who then impose the law of no dogs in business districts causing your cafe to enforce a regulation of no dogs with a distance of a human consumption premises. And it was all done cause they got a few sly pics of your dog loose and the council had enough of the complaints which would have been unwarranted if you had just clipped a loose lead to his collar.??

You seriously think the haters care if your dog has a lead or doesn't have a lead on as it sits under the table at your local cafe? Who is more of a menace, my dog who sleeps on my foot as I eat my omelet or the two white fluffies on lead, off their heads, barking and trying to tip over the table they are tied to? (True story)

Yes Razor dog haters do care if your dog is leashed especially in a cafe, as well as the insurance company of the cafe owner if anything goes wrong. Some people do not like dogs of any type and do not like them being in the front of cafes. Not everyone owns a dog and there are people who would like all dog laws to be very tight indeed. In that cafe you are one incident away from helping them ban all dogs from cafe fronts. If one of those fluffy dogs bites your dog and he reacts guess who will be blamed, the person with the unleashed dog. It's common sense really.

[Alison03]

Trudy08 - I think we ALL know exactly where YOU stand on the issue... 160-odd postings saying pretty much EXACTLY the same thing, and berating anyone who disagrees with your viewpoint, tends to make YOU look a bit overzealous (to say the least)...

Yes - you have had some traumatic incidents occur - no-one is denying that... but I think you may need to step back a little and look at the issue from other people's side of the "argument". Not every off leash dog is going to turn rampaging killer as soon as they see you and your little dog... and if that IS your experience, you may need to start looking into WHY you and your dog seem to attract much more negative dog attention than the law of averages suggests you should.

Just sayin'...

T.

Ok I'll make a deal with you I won't repeat myself as you all know where I stand.

Lets not forget I've been called crazy and it's even been alluded too that I've made everything up.

I had a very traumatic event and because I live in a semi rural community there seems to be quite a few loose dogs.

I'm not sure why we attract rushers, my dog is very well behaved on leash, perhaps that makes her weak and a target, can't really do much about that can I?

Off leash she mixes very well with friends dogs and at the kennels, where she's described as easy going but doesn't submit readily to other dogs but is not aggressive.

I readily admit I die a thousand deaths when I see an off leash dog and imagine all kinds of horrors that never happen.

Being made to feel vulnerable makes me cranky, you may have noticed that bit.

For the third time, It was me who made the crazy comment and it was in regard to feeling like you needed a weapon to walk your dogs safely, it was widely directed, not solely at you and I said THE ACTION of carrying this out stank of craziness. It seems to suit you to adopt the tag like a pouting child though, so carry on.

I don't think anyone alluded you might have invented anything either.

For goodness sake I don't care who called me crazy and who didn't. It was Razor who alluded to me having "contributory factors" and that all the dog incidences I report may be because of those factors. That's not a direct quote either, I can't be bothered looking for it.

Now lets not get caught up in semantics of who said what to whom.

I carry citronella spray only, which is harmless to dogs, not harmless because I say so, harmless because that is whats written on the can. I used to carry an umbrella but I got sick of having my hands full. I'm not looking to hurt anyone's dog despite the fact me and my dog were attacked. For the 100th time ( that may not be the true figure but I'm confident the post counters will be able to tell me what number it is ) I just want a relaxing walk with my dog without being harassed by off leash dogs of any type. Stop taking what I say personally it isn't aimed at you.

[kayla1]

If the attacking dog means business then of course its size and strength makes a difference to the outcome. In those cases I will do anything to protect my dogs, and that includes picking up my smaller dogs as a means of protection (getting smaller dogs changed my perspective on that pretty quickly). For the more friendly off lead dogs, I will use change of direction as a first method of avoidance regardless of the size of the approaching dog.

But what I have found though is that I have more problems with the off lead friendly types when I walk Annie and Maxie, than when I walk Kayla. The same people that seem happy to let their off lead dogs approach Annie and Maxie (who are small), will call their dogs away pretty quickly when I have Kayla (who is a medium sized black cross breed). Presumably Kayla is seen to be more of a threat. So when I'm walking Kayla I seem to have fewer off lead dogs approaching.