I'm Becoming Afraid To Walk My Dogs

[mita]

in my opinion, there isn't a downside to walking a well trained/behaved dog off lead.

There isn't...from the offlead dog owners' perspective.

But if you consider all the other dog owners who have to choose a different road or go back home because they can't predict which dog is well trained and which isn't...then it is definitely an issue.

I guess this whole discussion is really about those who prefer to walk their dogs offlead asking "what's in it for me?" And if they can't see a downside to themselves, that's where it stops.

Neat summary. Which is why council's have made on-leash the law in certain places. Which makes it a requirement. No ifs or buts or wiggle-room.

Outside a by-law area, it's frankly left to owner decision.

Edited September 16, 2013 by mita

[Alison03]

Jesus, I didn't say I didn't think it was not serious to break laws - read my posts... If you want to pick my posts to pieces read the whole thing in the context it is meant - don't pick out bits to suit your agenda (whatever it is)..

You know if you read slowly and concisely you will get the gist of most of my posts.

I said, there are loads of people out there that don't care about the law or what you want or need..

Next time I see a perfectly controlled dog off lead, I will congratulate the owner on such a wonderfully trained animal - BECAUSE it doesn't bother me that the well behaved/trained/controlled animal is off lead..

If it bothers you - go dob it in..

You can't make people care about the law - all you can do is dob them in.. If you want to spend your life dobbing every single off lead dog owner into the local council, then go for it.. I for one, have much better things to do with my life than dob every dog owner in that looks like it has a dog walking off lead..

You obviously feel my last post was aimed at you, it was aimed at everyone who feels its ok for off leash dogs to be walked in on lead areas, if you fit into that description then I guess you are part of my target. I have not picked apart your posts, despite the fact you seem to have picked apart mine earlier on in his thread, and called me contradictory, which is a lot nicer than when someone on this forum called me crazy, but to be honest none of those labels really bothers me.

What I'm attempting to point out is that the very people you support, could be the very people who help stricter dog laws be put in to place, its very simple for you to be part of those restrictive laws all you have to do is NOTHING. Let all the perfect off leash dogs sail passed you and say nothing, or you could go one step worse and congratulate the owners but if you really want to help society, you could compliment the owner and say "You do realise this is an on leash area don't you, I wouldn't want you to be fined". By doing nothing you are enabling the off leashers to take away our (and your ) freedom to walk our dogs. It will happen, google dog attacks and new dog laws, I am not making this all up, it will affect us all. Its not to late if everyone abides by the current law and makes sure our dogs are kept secure and on leashes where required and that stops most of the dog attacks it can only help us stay with the law we have. I'm not attacking you I just think there may be a downside to walking off leash dogs that may not have occurred to you.

I know this is a small forum and does not reach a lot of people but its been worked out if you tell one person, and that one person tells another the word will spread like wild fire. In political circles its accepted that if one person writes a letter or an email to an MP on a subject that means 500 people feel the same way, which in their eyes is 500 votes. Taking that a step further if a group get together to try to stop dog attacks and get new laws made that make parks no dog allowed, we are all sunk. Off lead dogs don't just piss off other people with dogs, its not just dog walkers that get attacked.

If you see an off leash walker, ringing the police won't help or the council, they want a name and address, just reminding nicely that this is an on lead area puts the thought in their heads that people are watching and caring what they do, they may tell you to F off but they still heard you, words that are said or written that you know apply to you are never forgotten, human beings are very susceptible to suggestion. All the off leash walkers I've encountered I've said very nicely (apart from the ones with scary dogs, I haven't been too nice then) "Are you aware this is an off leash area" and I haven't seen them since. They don't know who I am, perhaps I work for the local council, what do you think? You can't make people care about the law but they do care about being fined.

Steph don't take this personally its not meant that way.

You quoted me - if you were not responding to me, then don't quote me..

Edited to add - in my opinion, there isn't a downside to walking a well trained/behaved dog off lead. I wouldn't do it but I have seen a few and to be honest, they are a non issue.

You don't have to lecture me on the problems of outdated dog laws - I have been a dog owner and a member of this forum long enough to know what is and isn't OK..

So you spend your spare time making sure all the off lead dog walkers in your area are aware it is an on lead area or they can be fined - good for you..

I have much better things to do with my time - like enjoy my walk with my dog, instead of worrying about something that is of no concern to me (remember I am talking about well behaved/trained dogs who don't run off to meet me and my dog - they simply go about their walk like I do)..

If the dog was off lead, menacing and appearing dangerous - it probably wouldn't have an owner with it in my neck of the woods. So in this case, I would put a call in to our local ranger and let them know there is an off lead dog at such and such location. Now that owner should be fined.. Not the one, causing nobody any harm, minding his own business..

No wonder we can't take our dogs anywhere anymore..

I'm at work at the moment, so I haven't had chance to read every post minutely , my apologies if I quoted you or misquoted you. Its not my intention to start a fight, we obviously both feel very strongly in very different directions, I was attempting to share my opinion and fears with you, it was not my intention to lecture you.

I see all off lead dogs as a potential problem, well behaved or not and I don't seem to be alone in my opinion as you aren't alone in yours. The law however is on my side, can all those animal control people who are consulted about dog laws be wrong about dog behaviour?

I have a close family friend who is a doctor and she no longer walks her dogs (two shepherds) because of some of the injuries to her patients from off leash dogs. This weekend she treated a boy who had been riding his horse, the horse was attacked by two border collies who were being walked off leash by the owner, apparently they had never seen a horse before and freaked out when they came face to face with one, perhaps saw it as a large threat to the owner, the boy was thrown from the horse, the dogs evaded capture and were very worked up, unfortunately the mother of the boy arrived to see her son and she accidentally ran over one of the dogs that was still attempting to get to the horse. It was a nightmare scene, an injured boy, a dying dog, the other dog trying to get to the horse, the dog owner in shock kept saying "They've never seen a horse before". Very sad and very preventable. We all know who will get the blame.

BTW I noticed I got your name wrong on my last post, my apologies for that too, I've got a borderline migraine today.

[Yonjuro]

[Alison03]

You'll have to excuse me I need to vomit.

[Rocketeer]

Jesus, I didn't say I didn't think it was not serious to break laws - read my posts... If you want to pick my posts to pieces read the whole thing in the context it is meant - don't pick out bits to suit your agenda (whatever it is)..

You know if you read slowly and concisely you will get the gist of most of my posts.

I said, there are loads of people out there that don't care about the law or what you want or need..

Next time I see a perfectly controlled dog off lead, I will congratulate the owner on such a wonderfully trained animal - BECAUSE it doesn't bother me that the well behaved/trained/controlled animal is off lead..

If it bothers you - go dob it in..

You can't make people care about the law - all you can do is dob them in.. If you want to spend your life dobbing every single off lead dog owner into the local council, then go for it.. I for one, have much better things to do with my life than dob every dog owner in that looks like it has a dog walking off lead..

You obviously feel my last post was aimed at you, it was aimed at everyone who feels its ok for off leash dogs to be walked in on lead areas, if you fit into that description then I guess you are part of my target. I have not picked apart your posts, despite the fact you seem to have picked apart mine earlier on in his thread, and called me contradictory, which is a lot nicer than when someone on this forum called me crazy, but to be honest none of those labels really bothers me.

What I'm attempting to point out is that the very people you support, could be the very people who help stricter dog laws be put in to place, its very simple for you to be part of those restrictive laws all you have to do is NOTHING. Let all the perfect off leash dogs sail passed you and say nothing, or you could go one step worse and congratulate the owners but if you really want to help society, you could compliment the owner and say "You do realise this is an on leash area don't you, I wouldn't want you to be fined". By doing nothing you are enabling the off leashers to take away our (and your ) freedom to walk our dogs. It will happen, google dog attacks and new dog laws, I am not making this all up, it will affect us all. Its not to late if everyone abides by the current law and makes sure our dogs are kept secure and on leashes where required and that stops most of the dog attacks it can only help us stay with the law we have. I'm not attacking you I just think there may be a downside to walking off leash dogs that may not have occurred to you.

I know this is a small forum and does not reach a lot of people but its been worked out if you tell one person, and that one person tells another the word will spread like wild fire. In political circles its accepted that if one person writes a letter or an email to an MP on a subject that means 500 people feel the same way, which in their eyes is 500 votes. Taking that a step further if a group get together to try to stop dog attacks and get new laws made that make parks no dog allowed, we are all sunk. Off lead dogs don't just piss off other people with dogs, its not just dog walkers that get attacked.

If you see an off leash walker, ringing the police won't help or the council, they want a name and address, just reminding nicely that this is an on lead area puts the thought in their heads that people are watching and caring what they do, they may tell you to F off but they still heard you, words that are said or written that you know apply to you are never forgotten, human beings are very susceptible to suggestion. All the off leash walkers I've encountered I've said very nicely (apart from the ones with scary dogs, I haven't been too nice then) "Are you aware this is an off leash area" and I haven't seen them since. They don't know who I am, perhaps I work for the local council, what do you think? You can't make people care about the law but they do care about being fined.

Steph don't take this personally its not meant that way.

You quoted me - if you were not responding to me, then don't quote me..

Edited to add - in my opinion, there isn't a downside to walking a well trained/behaved dog off lead. I wouldn't do it but I have seen a few and to be honest, they are a non issue.

You don't have to lecture me on the problems of outdated dog laws - I have been a dog owner and a member of this forum long enough to know what is and isn't OK..

So you spend your spare time making sure all the off lead dog walkers in your area are aware it is an on lead area or they can be fined - good for you..

I have much better things to do with my time - like enjoy my walk with my dog, instead of worrying about something that is of no concern to me (remember I am talking about well behaved/trained dogs who don't run off to meet me and my dog - they simply go about their walk like I do)..

If the dog was off lead, menacing and appearing dangerous - it probably wouldn't have an owner with it in my neck of the woods. So in this case, I would put a call in to our local ranger and let them know there is an off lead dog at such and such location. Now that owner should be fined.. Not the one, causing nobody any harm, minding his own business..

No wonder we can't take our dogs anywhere anymore..

If you have aren't too concerned for you dog. I'm happy for you. But some other people on the forum are more vulnerable and have more fragile dogs due to age, illness, size etc. SO I do see why they would be concerned. I've had a dog that was very capable of defending herself. She could easily kill smaller dogs if she wanted to. But breaking up a fight is just an inconvenience on my walk. Nobody wants to deal with this stuff every time they duck out for a walk.

I just think we shouldn't have to go out of our way to make things more convenient for people who want their dogs to be "free range". Why some people believe they deserve special rights? I don't know. I'd like to see what happens if there are NO leash laws- may the best dog win... losers can R.I.P.

[tdierikx]

When I was a young'un, roaming dogs were looked upon as playmates for all of us kids in the area... what the hell changed over the years?

I lived in a lot of places (including Alice Springs and PNG) and neighbourhood dogs were just that - neighbourhood dogs... we ALL shared in the enjoyment of them. Everyone knew which dog belonged to which house, and we kids made sure said dogs got back home when we were finished playing and had to go in for our dinners... dogs were rarely seen as dangerous or narky - and all loved joining in the games of footy or cricket we kids were having.

When a neighbourhood dog had pups, all of us kids were there like shots to play with the pups - and invariably a few of us would end up with one for ourselves to take home (with parents' permission of course). Dogs in general were a HUGE part of every neighbourhood child's upbringing, and none of us had any fear of them at all.

Occasionally if we got bitten for some reason, we were asked what WE had done to deserve it - rather than branding the dog a vicious nasty thing that needed to be destroyed. We learned how to co-exist with all manner of dog types and breeds - and it was FUN!

And the biggest difference back then? If 2 dogs were "tussling" together, they weren't fighting... more likely mating... *grin*

Nowadays, dogs are becoming increasingly ostracised from everyday life - we can't take them anywhere to just hang out or play (like the beach or the playground). If we do take them out, there are so many restrictions on where and when and what we can do with them once we get there - it's all just too freaking hard now - so it's just easier to keep them at home and not let them interact with anyone or anything outside our own family. Is it any wonder then that some dogs, once free of their yards, are going to run amok?

And some of us have gone the complete opposite way as well. When we do take our dogs out, we don't want them interacting with others - human or otherwise. How can that be healthy for either the dog's state of mind, or their human's for that matter?

I want to go back to the "old days" - life with our dogs was MUCH better (and simpler) back then!

T.

[Alison03]

Jesus, I didn't say I didn't think it was not serious to break laws - read my posts... If you want to pick my posts to pieces read the whole thing in the context it is meant - don't pick out bits to suit your agenda (whatever it is)..

You know if you read slowly and concisely you will get the gist of most of my posts.

I said, there are loads of people out there that don't care about the law or what you want or need..

Next time I see a perfectly controlled dog off lead, I will congratulate the owner on such a wonderfully trained animal - BECAUSE it doesn't bother me that the well behaved/trained/controlled animal is off lead..

If it bothers you - go dob it in..

You can't make people care about the law - all you can do is dob them in.. If you want to spend your life dobbing every single off lead dog owner into the local council, then go for it.. I for one, have much better things to do with my life than dob every dog owner in that looks like it has a dog walking off lead..

You obviously feel my last post was aimed at you, it was aimed at everyone who feels its ok for off leash dogs to be walked in on lead areas, if you fit into that description then I guess you are part of my target. I have not picked apart your posts, despite the fact you seem to have picked apart mine earlier on in his thread, and called me contradictory, which is a lot nicer than when someone on this forum called me crazy, but to be honest none of those labels really bothers me.

What I'm attempting to point out is that the very people you support, could be the very people who help stricter dog laws be put in to place, its very simple for you to be part of those restrictive laws all you have to do is NOTHING. Let all the perfect off leash dogs sail passed you and say nothing, or you could go one step worse and congratulate the owners but if you really want to help society, you could compliment the owner and say "You do realise this is an on leash area don't you, I wouldn't want you to be fined". By doing nothing you are enabling the off leashers to take away our (and your ) freedom to walk our dogs. It will happen, google dog attacks and new dog laws, I am not making this all up, it will affect us all. Its not to late if everyone abides by the current law and makes sure our dogs are kept secure and on leashes where required and that stops most of the dog attacks it can only help us stay with the law we have. I'm not attacking you I just think there may be a downside to walking off leash dogs that may not have occurred to you.

I know this is a small forum and does not reach a lot of people but its been worked out if you tell one person, and that one person tells another the word will spread like wild fire. In political circles its accepted that if one person writes a letter or an email to an MP on a subject that means 500 people feel the same way, which in their eyes is 500 votes. Taking that a step further if a group get together to try to stop dog attacks and get new laws made that make parks no dog allowed, we are all sunk. Off lead dogs don't just piss off other people with dogs, its not just dog walkers that get attacked.

If you see an off leash walker, ringing the police won't help or the council, they want a name and address, just reminding nicely that this is an on lead area puts the thought in their heads that people are watching and caring what they do, they may tell you to F off but they still heard you, words that are said or written that you know apply to you are never forgotten, human beings are very susceptible to suggestion. All the off leash walkers I've encountered I've said very nicely (apart from the ones with scary dogs, I haven't been too nice then) "Are you aware this is an off leash area" and I haven't seen them since. They don't know who I am, perhaps I work for the local council, what do you think? You can't make people care about the law but they do care about being fined.

Steph don't take this personally its not meant that way.

You quoted me - if you were not responding to me, then don't quote me..

Edited to add - in my opinion, there isn't a downside to walking a well trained/behaved dog off lead. I wouldn't do it but I have seen a few and to be honest, they are a non issue.

You don't have to lecture me on the problems of outdated dog laws - I have been a dog owner and a member of this forum long enough to know what is and isn't OK..

So you spend your spare time making sure all the off lead dog walkers in your area are aware it is an on lead area or they can be fined - good for you..

I have much better things to do with my time - like enjoy my walk with my dog, instead of worrying about something that is of no concern to me (remember I am talking about well behaved/trained dogs who don't run off to meet me and my dog - they simply go about their walk like I do)..

If the dog was off lead, menacing and appearing dangerous - it probably wouldn't have an owner with it in my neck of the woods. So in this case, I would put a call in to our local ranger and let them know there is an off lead dog at such and such location. Now that owner should be fined.. Not the one, causing nobody any harm, minding his own business..

No wonder we can't take our dogs anywhere anymore..

If you have aren't too concerned for you dog. I'm happy for you. But some other people on the forum are more vulnerable and have more fragile dogs due to age, illness, size etc. SO I do see why they would be concerned. I've had a dog that was very capable of defending herself. She could easily kill smaller dogs if she wanted to. But breaking up a fight is just an inconvenience on my walk. Nobody wants to deal with this stuff every time they duck out for a walk.

I just think we shouldn't have to go out of our way to make things more convenient for people who want their dogs to be "free range". Why some people believe they deserve special rights? I don't know. I'd like to see what happens if there are NO leash laws- may the best dog win... losers can R.I.P.

If there were no leash laws no one would leave their houses, imagine us all walking off leash, all those looney dogs that are normally on leashes running free, actually I see your point, we could have no leashes every alternate week, I'd just stay at home while you all battled it out. It would certainly thin out the herd.

I guess there might be some wannabe off leashers out there that might think they'd like to have a crack at practicing their off leash style.

[Yonjuro]

Jesus, I didn't say I didn't think it was not serious to break laws - read my posts... If you want to pick my posts to pieces read the whole thing in the context it is meant - don't pick out bits to suit your agenda (whatever it is)..

You know if you read slowly and concisely you will get the gist of most of my posts.

I said, there are loads of people out there that don't care about the law or what you want or need..

Next time I see a perfectly controlled dog off lead, I will congratulate the owner on such a wonderfully trained animal - BECAUSE it doesn't bother me that the well behaved/trained/controlled animal is off lead..

If it bothers you - go dob it in..

You can't make people care about the law - all you can do is dob them in.. If you want to spend your life dobbing every single off lead dog owner into the local council, then go for it.. I for one, have much better things to do with my life than dob every dog owner in that looks like it has a dog walking off lead..

You obviously feel my last post was aimed at you, it was aimed at everyone who feels its ok for off leash dogs to be walked in on lead areas, if you fit into that description then I guess you are part of my target. I have not picked apart your posts, despite the fact you seem to have picked apart mine earlier on in his thread, and called me contradictory, which is a lot nicer than when someone on this forum called me crazy, but to be honest none of those labels really bothers me.

What I'm attempting to point out is that the very people you support, could be the very people who help stricter dog laws be put in to place, its very simple for you to be part of those restrictive laws all you have to do is NOTHING. Let all the perfect off leash dogs sail passed you and say nothing, or you could go one step worse and congratulate the owners but if you really want to help society, you could compliment the owner and say "You do realise this is an on leash area don't you, I wouldn't want you to be fined". By doing nothing you are enabling the off leashers to take away our (and your ) freedom to walk our dogs. It will happen, google dog attacks and new dog laws, I am not making this all up, it will affect us all. Its not to late if everyone abides by the current law and makes sure our dogs are kept secure and on leashes where required and that stops most of the dog attacks it can only help us stay with the law we have. I'm not attacking you I just think there may be a downside to walking off leash dogs that may not have occurred to you.

I know this is a small forum and does not reach a lot of people but its been worked out if you tell one person, and that one person tells another the word will spread like wild fire. In political circles its accepted that if one person writes a letter or an email to an MP on a subject that means 500 people feel the same way, which in their eyes is 500 votes. Taking that a step further if a group get together to try to stop dog attacks and get new laws made that make parks no dog allowed, we are all sunk. Off lead dogs don't just piss off other people with dogs, its not just dog walkers that get attacked.

If you see an off leash walker, ringing the police won't help or the council, they want a name and address, just reminding nicely that this is an on lead area puts the thought in their heads that people are watching and caring what they do, they may tell you to F off but they still heard you, words that are said or written that you know apply to you are never forgotten, human beings are very susceptible to suggestion. All the off leash walkers I've encountered I've said very nicely (apart from the ones with scary dogs, I haven't been too nice then) "Are you aware this is an off leash area" and I haven't seen them since. They don't know who I am, perhaps I work for the local council, what do you think? You can't make people care about the law but they do care about being fined.

Steph don't take this personally its not meant that way.

You quoted me - if you were not responding to me, then don't quote me..

Edited to add - in my opinion, there isn't a downside to walking a well trained/behaved dog off lead. I wouldn't do it but I have seen a few and to be honest, they are a non issue.

You don't have to lecture me on the problems of outdated dog laws - I have been a dog owner and a member of this forum long enough to know what is and isn't OK..

So you spend your spare time making sure all the off lead dog walkers in your area are aware it is an on lead area or they can be fined - good for you..

I have much better things to do with my time - like enjoy my walk with my dog, instead of worrying about something that is of no concern to me (remember I am talking about well behaved/trained dogs who don't run off to meet me and my dog - they simply go about their walk like I do)..

If the dog was off lead, menacing and appearing dangerous - it probably wouldn't have an owner with it in my neck of the woods. So in this case, I would put a call in to our local ranger and let them know there is an off lead dog at such and such location. Now that owner should be fined.. Not the one, causing nobody any harm, minding his own business..

No wonder we can't take our dogs anywhere anymore..

If you have aren't too concerned for you dog. I'm happy for you. But some other people on the forum are more vulnerable and have more fragile dogs due to age, illness, size etc. SO I do see why they would be concerned. I've had a dog that was very capable of defending herself. She could easily kill smaller dogs if she wanted to. But breaking up a fight is just an inconvenience on my walk. Nobody wants to deal with this stuff every time they duck out for a walk.

I just think we shouldn't have to go out of our way to make things more convenient for people who want their dogs to be "free range". Why some people believe they deserve special rights? I don't know. I'd like to see what happens if there are NO leash laws- may the best dog win... losers can R.I.P.

If there were no leash laws no one would leave their houses, imagine us all walking off leash, all those looney dogs that are normally on leashes running free, actually I see your point, we could have no leashes every alternate week, I'd just stay at home while you all battled it out. It would certainly thin out the herd.

I guess there might be some wannabe off leashers out there that might think they'd like to have a crack at practicing their off leash style.

How ridiculous. You have made some reasonable comments somewhere in the middle of your 50 odd post diatribe, but now this is just getting silly. It is not a battleground outside everyones door.

[mita]

And some of us have gone the complete opposite way as well. When we do take our dogs out, we don't want them interacting with others - human or otherwise. How can that be healthy for either the dog's state of mind, or their human's for that matter?

I want to go back to the "old days" - life with our dogs was MUCH better (and simpler) back then!

T.

Who's said they don't want their dogs interacting with others? Yes, you did say only 'some'. :)

I posted earlier that I welcomed the opportunity to gently socialise the dogs with those of other reasonable people we met on our walks (in an on-leash by-law area).

We tend to look at the past with rose-coloured glasses.

Our own dogs way back then.... kelpie-types & border collies .... had a pretty free rein. With results that didn't worry people too much then, but would now! Life generally was much simpler.... which is your point.

Now populations are greater, denser urban living, even a wider range of dog types, lifestyle habits are different (dogs took themselves for a walk!). Changing times & conditions. So different rules to live by.

Edited September 16, 2013 by mita

[JulesP]

Jesus, I didn't say I didn't think it was not serious to break laws - read my posts... If you want to pick my posts to pieces read the whole thing in the context it is meant - don't pick out bits to suit your agenda (whatever it is)..

You know if you read slowly and concisely you will get the gist of most of my posts.

I said, there are loads of people out there that don't care about the law or what you want or need..

Next time I see a perfectly controlled dog off lead, I will congratulate the owner on such a wonderfully trained animal - BECAUSE it doesn't bother me that the well behaved/trained/controlled animal is off lead..

If it bothers you - go dob it in..

You can't make people care about the law - all you can do is dob them in.. If you want to spend your life dobbing every single off lead dog owner into the local council, then go for it.. I for one, have much better things to do with my life than dob every dog owner in that looks like it has a dog walking off lead..

You obviously feel my last post was aimed at you, it was aimed at everyone who feels its ok for off leash dogs to be walked in on lead areas, if you fit into that description then I guess you are part of my target. I have not picked apart your posts, despite the fact you seem to have picked apart mine earlier on in his thread, and called me contradictory, which is a lot nicer than when someone on this forum called me crazy, but to be honest none of those labels really bothers me.

What I'm attempting to point out is that the very people you support, could be the very people who help stricter dog laws be put in to place, its very simple for you to be part of those restrictive laws all you have to do is NOTHING. Let all the perfect off leash dogs sail passed you and say nothing, or you could go one step worse and congratulate the owners but if you really want to help society, you could compliment the owner and say "You do realise this is an on leash area don't you, I wouldn't want you to be fined". By doing nothing you are enabling the off leashers to take away our (and your ) freedom to walk our dogs. It will happen, google dog attacks and new dog laws, I am not making this all up, it will affect us all. Its not to late if everyone abides by the current law and makes sure our dogs are kept secure and on leashes where required and that stops most of the dog attacks it can only help us stay with the law we have. I'm not attacking you I just think there may be a downside to walking off leash dogs that may not have occurred to you.

I know this is a small forum and does not reach a lot of people but its been worked out if you tell one person, and that one person tells another the word will spread like wild fire. In political circles its accepted that if one person writes a letter or an email to an MP on a subject that means 500 people feel the same way, which in their eyes is 500 votes. Taking that a step further if a group get together to try to stop dog attacks and get new laws made that make parks no dog allowed, we are all sunk. Off lead dogs don't just piss off other people with dogs, its not just dog walkers that get attacked.

If you see an off leash walker, ringing the police won't help or the council, they want a name and address, just reminding nicely that this is an on lead area puts the thought in their heads that people are watching and caring what they do, they may tell you to F off but they still heard you, words that are said or written that you know apply to you are never forgotten, human beings are very susceptible to suggestion. All the off leash walkers I've encountered I've said very nicely (apart from the ones with scary dogs, I haven't been too nice then) "Are you aware this is an off leash area" and I haven't seen them since. They don't know who I am, perhaps I work for the local council, what do you think? You can't make people care about the law but they do care about being fined.

Steph don't take this personally its not meant that way.

You quoted me - if you were not responding to me, then don't quote me..

Edited to add - in my opinion, there isn't a downside to walking a well trained/behaved dog off lead. I wouldn't do it but I have seen a few and to be honest, they are a non issue.

You don't have to lecture me on the problems of outdated dog laws - I have been a dog owner and a member of this forum long enough to know what is and isn't OK..

So you spend your spare time making sure all the off lead dog walkers in your area are aware it is an on lead area or they can be fined - good for you..

I have much better things to do with my time - like enjoy my walk with my dog, instead of worrying about something that is of no concern to me (remember I am talking about well behaved/trained dogs who don't run off to meet me and my dog - they simply go about their walk like I do)..

If the dog was off lead, menacing and appearing dangerous - it probably wouldn't have an owner with it in my neck of the woods. So in this case, I would put a call in to our local ranger and let them know there is an off lead dog at such and such location. Now that owner should be fined.. Not the one, causing nobody any harm, minding his own business..

No wonder we can't take our dogs anywhere anymore..

If you have aren't too concerned for you dog. I'm happy for you. But some other people on the forum are more vulnerable and have more fragile dogs due to age, illness, size etc. SO I do see why they would be concerned. I've had a dog that was very capable of defending herself. She could easily kill smaller dogs if she wanted to. But breaking up a fight is just an inconvenience on my walk. Nobody wants to deal with this stuff every time they duck out for a walk.

I just think we shouldn't have to go out of our way to make things more convenient for people who want their dogs to be "free range". Why some people believe they deserve special rights? I don't know. I'd like to see what happens if there are NO leash laws- may the best dog win... losers can R.I.P.

If there were no leash laws no one would leave their houses, imagine us all walking off leash, all those looney dogs that are normally on leashes running free, actually I see your point, we could have no leashes every alternate week, I'd just stay at home while you all battled it out. It would certainly thin out the herd.

I guess there might be some wannabe off leashers out there that might think they'd like to have a crack at practicing their off leash style.

How ridiculous. You have made some reasonable comments somewhere in the middle of your 50 odd post diatribe, but now this is just getting silly. It is not a battleground outside everyones door.

Think it is more like 163 posts on the subject. A couple of the post were in another thread but a similar theme! Really quite strange.

[Alison03]

Jesus, I didn't say I didn't think it was not serious to break laws - read my posts... If you want to pick my posts to pieces read the whole thing in the context it is meant - don't pick out bits to suit your agenda (whatever it is)..

You know if you read slowly and concisely you will get the gist of most of my posts.

I said, there are loads of people out there that don't care about the law or what you want or need..

Next time I see a perfectly controlled dog off lead, I will congratulate the owner on such a wonderfully trained animal - BECAUSE it doesn't bother me that the well behaved/trained/controlled animal is off lead..

If it bothers you - go dob it in..

You can't make people care about the law - all you can do is dob them in.. If you want to spend your life dobbing every single off lead dog owner into the local council, then go for it.. I for one, have much better things to do with my life than dob every dog owner in that looks like it has a dog walking off lead..

You obviously feel my last post was aimed at you, it was aimed at everyone who feels its ok for off leash dogs to be walked in on lead areas, if you fit into that description then I guess you are part of my target. I have not picked apart your posts, despite the fact you seem to have picked apart mine earlier on in his thread, and called me contradictory, which is a lot nicer than when someone on this forum called me crazy, but to be honest none of those labels really bothers me.

What I'm attempting to point out is that the very people you support, could be the very people who help stricter dog laws be put in to place, its very simple for you to be part of those restrictive laws all you have to do is NOTHING. Let all the perfect off leash dogs sail passed you and say nothing, or you could go one step worse and congratulate the owners but if you really want to help society, you could compliment the owner and say "You do realise this is an on leash area don't you, I wouldn't want you to be fined". By doing nothing you are enabling the off leashers to take away our (and your ) freedom to walk our dogs. It will happen, google dog attacks and new dog laws, I am not making this all up, it will affect us all. Its not to late if everyone abides by the current law and makes sure our dogs are kept secure and on leashes where required and that stops most of the dog attacks it can only help us stay with the law we have. I'm not attacking you I just think there may be a downside to walking off leash dogs that may not have occurred to you.

I know this is a small forum and does not reach a lot of people but its been worked out if you tell one person, and that one person tells another the word will spread like wild fire. In political circles its accepted that if one person writes a letter or an email to an MP on a subject that means 500 people feel the same way, which in their eyes is 500 votes. Taking that a step further if a group get together to try to stop dog attacks and get new laws made that make parks no dog allowed, we are all sunk. Off lead dogs don't just piss off other people with dogs, its not just dog walkers that get attacked.

If you see an off leash walker, ringing the police won't help or the council, they want a name and address, just reminding nicely that this is an on lead area puts the thought in their heads that people are watching and caring what they do, they may tell you to F off but they still heard you, words that are said or written that you know apply to you are never forgotten, human beings are very susceptible to suggestion. All the off leash walkers I've encountered I've said very nicely (apart from the ones with scary dogs, I haven't been too nice then) "Are you aware this is an off leash area" and I haven't seen them since. They don't know who I am, perhaps I work for the local council, what do you think? You can't make people care about the law but they do care about being fined.

Steph don't take this personally its not meant that way.

You quoted me - if you were not responding to me, then don't quote me..

Edited to add - in my opinion, there isn't a downside to walking a well trained/behaved dog off lead. I wouldn't do it but I have seen a few and to be honest, they are a non issue.

You don't have to lecture me on the problems of outdated dog laws - I have been a dog owner and a member of this forum long enough to know what is and isn't OK..

So you spend your spare time making sure all the off lead dog walkers in your area are aware it is an on lead area or they can be fined - good for you..

I have much better things to do with my time - like enjoy my walk with my dog, instead of worrying about something that is of no concern to me (remember I am talking about well behaved/trained dogs who don't run off to meet me and my dog - they simply go about their walk like I do)..

If the dog was off lead, menacing and appearing dangerous - it probably wouldn't have an owner with it in my neck of the woods. So in this case, I would put a call in to our local ranger and let them know there is an off lead dog at such and such location. Now that owner should be fined.. Not the one, causing nobody any harm, minding his own business..

No wonder we can't take our dogs anywhere anymore..

If you have aren't too concerned for you dog. I'm happy for you. But some other people on the forum are more vulnerable and have more fragile dogs due to age, illness, size etc. SO I do see why they would be concerned. I've had a dog that was very capable of defending herself. She could easily kill smaller dogs if she wanted to. But breaking up a fight is just an inconvenience on my walk. Nobody wants to deal with this stuff every time they duck out for a walk.

I just think we shouldn't have to go out of our way to make things more convenient for people who want their dogs to be "free range". Why some people believe they deserve special rights? I don't know. I'd like to see what happens if there are NO leash laws- may the best dog win... losers can R.I.P.

If there were no leash laws no one would leave their houses, imagine us all walking off leash, all those looney dogs that are normally on leashes running free, actually I see your point, we could have no leashes every alternate week, I'd just stay at home while you all battled it out. It would certainly thin out the herd.

I guess there might be some wannabe off leashers out there that might think they'd like to have a crack at practicing their off leash style.

How ridiculous. You have made some reasonable comments somewhere in the middle of your 50 odd post diatribe, but now this is just getting silly. It is not a battleground outside everyones door.

I have made some reasonable comments have I, I've been called crazy and contradictory you must be confusing me with someone else.

Everyone else is being ridiculous I thought I'd join in. A cartoon of a dead horse springs to mind, oh yes that was you, speaking of ridiculous. We've got one bloke on here romanticizing his childhood with wonderful even tempered dogs, a positive utopia. A few other people having no problems with off leash dogs, so I thought that if off leash walking is ok for some, then why not for everyone. Who are we to judge who is proficient at walking off leash and who isn't.

[tdierikx]

And some of us have gone the complete opposite way as well. When we do take our dogs out, we don't want them interacting with others - human or otherwise. How can that be healthy for either the dog's state of mind, or their human's for that matter?

I want to go back to the "old days" - life with our dogs was MUCH better (and simpler) back then!

T.

Who's said they don't want their dogs interacting with others? Yes, you did say only 'some'. :)

I posted earlier that I welcomed the opportunity to gently socialise the dogs with those of other reasonable people we met on our walks (in an on-leash by-law area).

We tend to look at the past with rose-coloured glasses.

Our own dogs way back then.... kelpie-types & border collies .... had a pretty free rein. With results that didn't worry people too much then, but would now! Life generally was much simpler.... which is your point.

Now populations are greater, denser urban living, even a wider range of dog types, lifestyle habits are different (dogs took themselves for a walk!). Changing times & conditions. So different rules to live by.

I think it's become more of a case of who's going to sue for whatever "transgression" nowadays mita... too many "rights", and not enough "responsibilities" nowadays... and I really don't like what we are doing to our society at all - but that's a different topic, isn't it? *grin*

T.

[mixeduppup]

I don't think I ever saw a dog on a lead in my town. For many years my best friend as a child was a stray rotty that would follow me everywhere I went. until I was about 17 and a ranger started visiting we rarely had dog attacks or run ins and then after the ranger came on the scene attacks and fights started escalating (I volunteered at the local vet for most of my teen years and saw it happen). Not sure what this means but the evidence was there.

Edited September 16, 2013 by mixeduppup

[mita]

Actually I think you're spot on, T, for the purposes of this thread.

[Alison03]

And some of us have gone the complete opposite way as well. When we do take our dogs out, we don't want them interacting with others - human or otherwise. How can that be healthy for either the dog's state of mind, or their human's for that matter?

I want to go back to the "old days" - life with our dogs was MUCH better (and simpler) back then!

T.

Who's said they don't want their dogs interacting with others? Yes, you did say only 'some'. :)

I posted earlier that I welcomed the opportunity to gently socialise the dogs with those of other reasonable people we met on our walks (in an on-leash by-law area).

We tend to look at the past with rose-coloured glasses.

Our own dogs way back then.... kelpie-types & border collies .... had a pretty free rein. With results that didn't worry people too much then, but would now! Life generally was much simpler.... which is your point.

Now populations are greater, denser urban living, even a wider range of dog types, lifestyle habits are different (dogs took themselves for a walk!). Changing times & conditions. So different rules to live by.

I think it's become more of a case of who's going to sue for whatever "transgression" nowadays mita... too many "rights", and not enough "responsibilities" nowadays... and I really don't like what we are doing to our society at all - but that's a different topic, isn't it? *grin*

T.

The whole litigation culture we live in now and the idea that no one is personally responsible for their actions is very scary, makes me wonder what life will be like for our grandkids.

[Yonjuro]

Jesus, I didn't say I didn't think it was not serious to break laws - read my posts... If you want to pick my posts to pieces read the whole thing in the context it is meant - don't pick out bits to suit your agenda (whatever it is)..

You know if you read slowly and concisely you will get the gist of most of my posts.

I said, there are loads of people out there that don't care about the law or what you want or need..

Next time I see a perfectly controlled dog off lead, I will congratulate the owner on such a wonderfully trained animal - BECAUSE it doesn't bother me that the well behaved/trained/controlled animal is off lead..

If it bothers you - go dob it in..

You can't make people care about the law - all you can do is dob them in.. If you want to spend your life dobbing every single off lead dog owner into the local council, then go for it.. I for one, have much better things to do with my life than dob every dog owner in that looks like it has a dog walking off lead..

You obviously feel my last post was aimed at you, it was aimed at everyone who feels its ok for off leash dogs to be walked in on lead areas, if you fit into that description then I guess you are part of my target. I have not picked apart your posts, despite the fact you seem to have picked apart mine earlier on in his thread, and called me contradictory, which is a lot nicer than when someone on this forum called me crazy, but to be honest none of those labels really bothers me.

What I'm attempting to point out is that the very people you support, could be the very people who help stricter dog laws be put in to place, its very simple for you to be part of those restrictive laws all you have to do is NOTHING. Let all the perfect off leash dogs sail passed you and say nothing, or you could go one step worse and congratulate the owners but if you really want to help society, you could compliment the owner and say "You do realise this is an on leash area don't you, I wouldn't want you to be fined". By doing nothing you are enabling the off leashers to take away our (and your ) freedom to walk our dogs. It will happen, google dog attacks and new dog laws, I am not making this all up, it will affect us all. Its not to late if everyone abides by the current law and makes sure our dogs are kept secure and on leashes where required and that stops most of the dog attacks it can only help us stay with the law we have. I'm not attacking you I just think there may be a downside to walking off leash dogs that may not have occurred to you.

I know this is a small forum and does not reach a lot of people but its been worked out if you tell one person, and that one person tells another the word will spread like wild fire. In political circles its accepted that if one person writes a letter or an email to an MP on a subject that means 500 people feel the same way, which in their eyes is 500 votes. Taking that a step further if a group get together to try to stop dog attacks and get new laws made that make parks no dog allowed, we are all sunk. Off lead dogs don't just piss off other people with dogs, its not just dog walkers that get attacked.

If you see an off leash walker, ringing the police won't help or the council, they want a name and address, just reminding nicely that this is an on lead area puts the thought in their heads that people are watching and caring what they do, they may tell you to F off but they still heard you, words that are said or written that you know apply to you are never forgotten, human beings are very susceptible to suggestion. All the off leash walkers I've encountered I've said very nicely (apart from the ones with scary dogs, I haven't been too nice then) "Are you aware this is an off leash area" and I haven't seen them since. They don't know who I am, perhaps I work for the local council, what do you think? You can't make people care about the law but they do care about being fined.

Steph don't take this personally its not meant that way.

You quoted me - if you were not responding to me, then don't quote me..

Edited to add - in my opinion, there isn't a downside to walking a well trained/behaved dog off lead. I wouldn't do it but I have seen a few and to be honest, they are a non issue.

You don't have to lecture me on the problems of outdated dog laws - I have been a dog owner and a member of this forum long enough to know what is and isn't OK..

So you spend your spare time making sure all the off lead dog walkers in your area are aware it is an on lead area or they can be fined - good for you..

I have much better things to do with my time - like enjoy my walk with my dog, instead of worrying about something that is of no concern to me (remember I am talking about well behaved/trained dogs who don't run off to meet me and my dog - they simply go about their walk like I do)..

If the dog was off lead, menacing and appearing dangerous - it probably wouldn't have an owner with it in my neck of the woods. So in this case, I would put a call in to our local ranger and let them know there is an off lead dog at such and such location. Now that owner should be fined.. Not the one, causing nobody any harm, minding his own business..

No wonder we can't take our dogs anywhere anymore..

If you have aren't too concerned for you dog. I'm happy for you. But some other people on the forum are more vulnerable and have more fragile dogs due to age, illness, size etc. SO I do see why they would be concerned. I've had a dog that was very capable of defending herself. She could easily kill smaller dogs if she wanted to. But breaking up a fight is just an inconvenience on my walk. Nobody wants to deal with this stuff every time they duck out for a walk.

I just think we shouldn't have to go out of our way to make things more convenient for people who want their dogs to be "free range". Why some people believe they deserve special rights? I don't know. I'd like to see what happens if there are NO leash laws- may the best dog win... losers can R.I.P.

If there were no leash laws no one would leave their houses, imagine us all walking off leash, all those looney dogs that are normally on leashes running free, actually I see your point, we could have no leashes every alternate week, I'd just stay at home while you all battled it out. It would certainly thin out the herd.

I guess there might be some wannabe off leashers out there that might think they'd like to have a crack at practicing their off leash style.

How ridiculous. You have made some reasonable comments somewhere in the middle of your 50 odd post diatribe, but now this is just getting silly. It is not a battleground outside everyones door.

I have made some reasonable comments have I, I've been called crazy and contradictory you must be confusing me with someone else.

Everyone else is being ridiculous I thought I'd join in. A cartoon of a dead horse springs to mind, oh yes that was you, speaking of ridiculous. We've got one bloke on here romanticizing his childhood with wonderful even tempered dogs, a positive utopia. A few other people having no problems with off leash dogs, so I thought that if off leash walking is ok for some, then why not for everyone. Who are we to judge who is proficient at walking off leash and who isn't.

Are you familiar with the term flogging a dead horse? :)

....and for what it's worth I am an on-lead in on-lead areas and off-lead in off-lead areas dog person.

[Alison03]

I don't think I ever saw a dog on a lead in my town. For many years my best friend as a child was a stray rotty that would follow me everywhere I went. until I was about 17 and a ranger started visiting we rarely had dog attacks or run ins and then after the ranger came on the scene attacks and fights started escalating (I volunteered at the local vet for most of my teen years and saw it happen). Not sure what this means but the evidence was there.

I don't remember the dog attacks we have now happening when I was a kid either, especially not the really serious ones. Where have we gone wrong?

[Alison03]

Sorry double post

Edited September 16, 2013 by Trudy08

[mita]

I dodn't think I ever saw a dog on a lead in my town. For many years my beat friend as a child was a stray rotty that would follow me everywhere I went. until I was about 17 and a ranger started visiting we rarely had dog attacks or run ins and then after the ranger came on the scene attacks and fights started escalating (I volunteered at the local vet for most of my teen years and saw it happen). Not sure what this means but the evidence was there.

MP, this is a joke.... not having a go at you.

Looks like the newly arrived ranger might've been lurking behind trees, hissing 'Sitch-em!' to the dogs in your town. :)

[mixeduppup]

I don't think I ever saw a dog on a lead in my town. For many years my best friend as a child was a stray rotty that would follow me everywhere I went. until I was about 17 and a ranger started visiting we rarely had dog attacks or run ins and then after the ranger came on the scene attacks and fights started escalating (I volunteered at the local vet for most of my teen years and saw it happen). Not sure what this means but the evidence was there.

I don't remember the dog attacks we have now happening when I was a kid either, especially not the really serious ones. Where have we gone wrong?

I think our fear and hysteria has created unstable and antisocial dogs.

Edited September 16, 2013 by mixeduppup