Blackhawk, Artemis Or Holistic Select

[fluff1234]

Hi all

My 12 week pup is currently on Pro plan. I wish to change this to a better quality food.

I have on my short list Blackhawk, Artemis or Holistic select and dont know which one to go for.

Blackhawk dont do a large breed puppy which worries me?

I did consider taste of the wild (think thats what its called, but too difficult to source)

So which would you pick and why?

Interested in people who own artic breeds too as it will be more relevant I think?

thanks

Edited August 20, 2013 by fluff1234

[Gertrude139]

I have sibes and I use taste of the wild, the salmon one (though I mostly feed raw this is just the backup), I order from Paws For Life and it couldn't be easier. I will only feed them a grain free kibble as my girl gets skin problems with grains.

My foster sibe and samoyed are on blackhawk + some raw which seems to have good results with most arctics.

Try to get some samples packs of each maybe and see what your pup does best on?

[Salukifan]

Hi all

My 12 week pup is currently on Pro plan. I wish to change this to a better quality food.

I have on my short list Blackhawk, Artemis or Holistic select and dont know which one to go for.

Blackhawk dont do a large breed puppy which worries me?

I did consider taste of the wild (think thats what its called, but too difficult to source)

So which would you pick and why?

Interested in people who own artic breeds too as it will be more relevant I think?

thanks

Can you define "better quality"?

I know plenty of breeders and exhibitors who swear by Pro Plan - it's not rubbish.

[fluff1234]

From research it comes with very poor results on most food analysis sites and frequently rates low in stars. Its loaded with corn and grains from what I have read and poor quality.

Is this not correct?

.

Hi all

My 12 week pup is currently on Pro plan. I wish to change this to a better quality food.

I have on my short list Blackhawk, Artemis or Holistic select and dont know which one to go for.

Blackhawk dont do a large breed puppy which worries me?

I did consider taste of the wild (think thats what its called, but too difficult to source)

So which would you pick and why?

Interested in people who own artic breeds too as it will be more relevant I think?

thanks

Can you define "better quality"?

I know plenty of breeders and exhibitors who swear by Pro Plan - it's not rubbish.

[fluff1234]

I was slammed on a raw feeding site for feeding Purina!

[fluff1234]

Thanks... Is it suitable for a large breed puppy?

I cannot find the puppy one in Australia?

:)

I have sibes and I use taste of the wild, the salmon one (though I mostly feed raw this is just the backup), I order from Paws For Life and it couldn't be easier. I will only feed them a grain free kibble as my girl gets skin problems with grains.

My foster sibe and samoyed are on blackhawk + some raw which seems to have good results with most arctics.

Try to get some samples packs of each maybe and see what your pup does best on?

Edited August 20, 2013 by fluff1234

[fluff1234]

I just got a sample of Black hawk but am a little concerened with the bad reviews lately on the blackhawk thread..

[sheena]

I just got a sample of Black hawk but am a little concerened with the bad reviews lately on the blackhawk thread..

I have raised both my dogs on Black Hawk & couldn't be happier. There are also lots of GOOD reviews on BH too, though the bad ones seem to get all the attention. My youngest boy, border collie, I raised on BH Adult from the day I got him at ten weeks on advice from breeders & people here on DOL. The best food for your dog is the one your dog does best on, & sorry I have no experience with your breed of pup :) Going by the surveys conducted here on DOL, from time to time, Black Hawk is the one dry that most people use, so there must be some happy people out there :laugh:

[Gertrude139]

If you have a sample of the blackhawk puppy why not try it and see how it goes? If you've read the bad reviews on BH then you will know what to look out for if it isn't agreeing with your pup. I admit I too was put off BH originally by that thread but I know a lot of arcitcs on it now which are doing really well, better than on other premium brands. Different things suit different dogs.

I imagine you will get slammed in most raw feeding sites for feeding any dry food at all. Has there been a problem on the Pro Plan?

Remember to swap to the new food slowly too don't just start feeding the new one straight away, mix them together for a bit.

[WreckitWhippet]

Give the Blackhawk a miss, it left my dogs under muscled and looking like crap, to me that screams poor protein source.

If your puppy is doing well on the Proplan and than I'd leave it be and if you are going to change than either of your two other selections.

[Rebanne]

Is your pup actually not doing well on his current food or do you just think he needs a better food?

[Salukifan]

I have fed everything from a completely raw diet to the best imported kibbles. Let me share what I've learned with you:

No amount of star ratings on an American website is going to tell you how well your dog will do on a food. It certainly won't tell you how palatable the food will be to your dog. Thank God for sample bags because I tried my dogs on quite a few of the highly rated dog foods and they turned their noses up at them. In addition, most Australian made dog foods are not rated on any of the main food review websites so you won't learn anything there. You certainly won't find an analysis of Black Hawk outside of the information the manufacturer provides.

Despite the ravings on a number of websites that demonise grain based kibbles, grain is NOT an issue for many dogs to eat. Historically its what man has been feedings dogs ever since we put down roots and started farming. What is an issue is when the food's primary ingredient is grain - there is a difference and you'll see it in the back yard quickly enough. Substituting other fillers (like potato) for grain does not necessarily make for a "better" food IMO. Its still filler. It's the quality of ingredients including protein that matters - and for me that means no meat meals and no subgrade fillers.

IMO the best way to source which food to feed is to ask people who have your breed or do what you do with your dogs and whose dogs are in prime condition. Or feed what your pup's breeder recommends if you think its a good diet.

Ultimately, if your pup is doing well on the food he is on now, why change? I don't think it hurts to improve the variety in a dog's diet and to add some RMBs but don't overthink it. There is more than one good way to feed a dog and more than one product that will do the job.

Edited August 20, 2013 by Haredown Whippets

[fluff1234]

Thanks all. Will have a think on it :)

He is doing fine on pro plan and growing well, he went from 8.6 kg at 10 weeks to 10.4 kg on different scales 12 days later.

His legs are getting longer by the day!

Poo is usually solid, but can be sloppy, but he eats everything he can pinch outside, before I grab it!

He goes 2-3 times a day and other than REALLY stinky trumps, he seems fine...

The breeder had only Just started trying pro plan, so isnt that experienced with it, upon talking to her she has been researching black hawk too. She kept one of the pups, so maybe see what she does as she breeds and shows, so will know what to look for..

( He does eat 1/2 raw anyway too mixed in as recommended by the breeder)

I will speak to her, see what she thinks and maybe just keep him as is for now. I am planning on switching to raw and VAN when he is fully grown anyway, so may just stick too this. I was ONLY changing him after reading such bad reviews on purina.

thanks again, appreciate the information and thoughts :)

[Salukifan]

I will speak to her, see what she thinks and maybe just keep him as is for now. I am planning on switching to raw and VAN when he is fully grown anyway, so may just stick too this. I was ONLY changing him after reading such bad reviews on purina.

thanks again, appreciate the information and thoughts :)

Don't forget, if you go on any raw food website, they'll cane you for feeding ANY kibble.

If you want to try an Australian made kibble that contains no grains, the Advance Turkey and Rice might be a go when your dog is older. I gather its very palatable.

Edited August 20, 2013 by Haredown Whippets

[fluff1234]

thank you :)

I will speak to her, see what she thinks and maybe just keep him as is for now. I am planning on switching to raw and VAN when he is fully grown anyway, so may just stick too this. I was ONLY changing him after reading such bad reviews on purina.

thanks again, appreciate the information and thoughts :)

Don't forget, if you go on any raw food website, they'll cane you for feeding ANY kibble.

If you want to try an Australian made kibble that contains no grains, the Advance Turkey and Rice might be a go when your dog is older. I gather its very palatable.

[Salukifan]

What am I saying, rice IS a grain.

I've just asked a Sibe breeder I know what she feeds. I'll report back.

ETA: She responded. RC Medium Junior - coincidentally what I feed.

The way some websites talk about Royal Canin, you expect the bags to grow horns and a tail.

But... my Whippets love it and do very well on it. And the poodles get the RC Mini 8+ and love that too.

Edited August 20, 2013 by Haredown Whippets

[Whiskered]

I have fed everything from a completely raw diet to the best imported kibbles. Let me share what I've learned with you:

No amount of star ratings on an American website is going to tell you how well your dog will do on a food. It certainly won't tell you how palatable the food will be to your dog. Thank God for sample bags because I tried my dogs on quite a few of the highly rated dog foods and they turned their noses up at them. In addition, most Australian made dog foods are not rated on any of the main food review websites so you won't learn anything there. You certainly won't find an analysis of Black Hawk outside of the information the manufacturer provides.

Despite the ravings on a number of websites that demonise grain based kibbles, grain is NOT an issue for many dogs to eat. Historically its what man has been feedings dogs ever since we put down roots and started farming. What is an issue is when the food's primary ingredient is grain - there is a difference and you'll see it in the back yard quickly enough. Substituting other fillers (like potato) for grain does not necessarily make for a "better" food IMO. Its still filler. It's the quality of ingredients including protein that matters - and for me that means no meat meals and no subgrade fillers.

IMO the best way to source which food to feed is to ask people who have your breed or do what you do with your dogs and whose dogs are in prime condition. Or feed what your pup's breeder recommends if you think its a good diet.

Ultimately, if your pup is doing well on the food he is on now, why change? I don't think it hurts to improve the variety in a dog's diet and to add some RMBs but don't overthink it. There is more than one good way to feed a dog and more than one product that will do the job.

What an excellent post :)

[Clyde]

I have tried all the foods in the title plus Taste of the Wild. I have 6 dogs of varying ages and sizes and they all did poorly on Black Hawk. Coats went dull, all had flatulence, sloppy stinky poos and dogs became 'slobby' looking. Artemis they did okay, better than Black Hawk but they do best on Holistic Select fish. Coats shine up, muscles look good, firm poos, no flatulence etc. They also do well on Taste of the Wild Salmon, I feed this sometimes and they do really well on it but the Holistic Select just gets their black coast extra glossy. Taste of the Wild is readily available from the natural pet food store online. Two of them are now fed BARF mix though and kibble as back up.

eta: Ive fed the proplan fish too. For me, it rates way better than black hawk. Dogs did well on it but I still prefer TOTW or HS. My neighbours dogs are all on ProPlan and they look fantastic.

Edited August 20, 2013 by Clyde

[wire]

Mine were on Black Hawk for about a year but they started getting similar issues to what Clyde listed. They were on Artimis before but didn't really like the 'fresh mix' one. I purchased the Artemis osopure duck and they seem to really like it but most importantly their skin is improving, breath is better and no more constant farting. They also have raw.

[fluff1234]

Thank all :)

I may stick with pro plan for now or may try holistic select :)