luvsdogs Posted July 18, 2013 Share Posted July 18, 2013 (edited) Where can I buy it? Panda, my Japanese Spitz, has a tear staining problem so I decided to give it a go. He still has staining after nearly finishing the bottle but his tears have greatly reduced so feel that after a moult the staining will go away. I read on the forums last year about Angels' Eyes & how well it worked but the original one has anti-biotics in it & not advisable to use long term. The one I bought has sweet potato, brown rice & tylosin (don't know what this is). I asked the lady if it had anti-biotics in it & she assured me it didn't. Has anyone else used this product & for how long & how did you find it? I did a search for a previous thread & couldn't find it. eta - OK did a search in General & found a few threads so am off to have a read, but would still like to know where I can get it. Edited July 19, 2013 by luvsdogs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piper Posted July 18, 2013 Share Posted July 18, 2013 Doing a quick google, it sounds like tylosin is the antibiotic... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tylosin https://www.google.com.au/search?q=what+is+tylosin&rlz=1C5CHFA_enAU503AU504&oq=what+is+tylosin&aqs=chrome.0.69i57j0l3j69i62.3915j0&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
*kirty* Posted July 18, 2013 Share Posted July 18, 2013 Tylosin is an antiobiotic. You also have no idea how much antibiotic is in the bottle because apparently it is made in large quantities then bottled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luvsdogs Posted July 18, 2013 Author Share Posted July 18, 2013 Doing a quick google, it sounds like tylosin is the antibiotic... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tylosin https://www.google.com.au/search?q=what+is+tylosin&rlz=1C5CHFA_enAU503AU504&oq=what+is+tylosin&aqs=chrome.0.69i57j0l3j69i62.3915j0&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8 Thanks for the links piper, very scary stuff, I definitely will throw the rest away & not use it again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staff'n'Toller Posted July 18, 2013 Share Posted July 18, 2013 Our veterinary wholesaler is stocking it but they are unimpressed that they had to ask the manufacturer for the inactive ingredients three times before they coughed up! One of our senior vets has researched it a bit but as yet we haven't started stocking it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minimax Posted July 18, 2013 Share Posted July 18, 2013 Doing a quick google, it sounds like tylosin is the antibiotic... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tylosin https://www.google.com.au/search?q=what+is+tylosin&rlz=1C5CHFA_enAU503AU504&oq=what+is+tylosin&aqs=chrome.0.69i57j0l3j69i62.3915j0&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8 Thanks for the links piper, very scary stuff, I definitely will throw the rest away & not use it again. I'm surprised your using something with an ingredient you don't know, and haven't at least googled to find out What it is Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
*kirty* Posted July 18, 2013 Share Posted July 18, 2013 Our clinic researched it and decided against stocking it/recommending it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christina Posted July 18, 2013 Share Posted July 18, 2013 It works like magic & is only needed short term. Antibiotics are used for many conditions anyway & info on even the common ones in use is quite scary on some sites. I wouldn't take 99% of the prescription drugs I have taken if I read all the product info, its horrendous especially for such things as anti depressants which are dished out like lollies now. I found this product excellent after trying everything from flushing procedure to over the counter products when I had a white dog. Lots of stockists if you google. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alyosha Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 The product is not registered for use or supply in Australia. Apart from anything else like unknown risk levels to individual animals, low doses of antibiotics contribute to serious resistance issues both in animals and in the wider community. This even impacts upon human health issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luvsdogs Posted July 19, 2013 Author Share Posted July 19, 2013 Doing a quick google, it sounds like tylosin is the antibiotic... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tylosin https://www.google.com.au/search?q=what+is+tylosin&rlz=1C5CHFA_enAU503AU504&oq=what+is+tylosin&aqs=chrome.0.69i57j0l3j69i62.3915j0&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8 Thanks for the links piper, very scary stuff, I definitely will throw the rest away & not use it again. I'm surprised your using something with an ingredient you don't know, and haven't at least googled to find out What it is That's what my son said, guess I was gullible in believing the woman selling it when she said it didn't have antibiotics in it. I've since looked up other products from piper's link & one even said it didn't have antibiotics in it but an antibacterial, aren't they much the same thing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alyosha Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 Not necessarily, but if it is antibacterial it should be registered. Check products here: APVMA pubcris This link is interesting as well: http://www.tearstaincenter.com/tear-stain-remover/tylosin-potentially-dangerous/ It's a bit scary that the lady you bought it off either didn't know what was in it, or was prepared to lie about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maddy Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 It works like magic & is only needed short term. Antibiotics are used for many conditions anyway & info on even the common ones in use is quite scary on some sites. I wouldn't take 99% of the prescription drugs I have taken if I read all the product info, its horrendous especially for such things as anti depressants which are dished out like lollies now. I found this product excellent after trying everything from flushing procedure to over the counter products when I had a white dog. Lots of stockists if you google. It's not so much the potential side effects that are the concern, it's the high risk of antibiotic resistance developing. That problem is already fairly serious in humans (with things like MRSA) and that's just from use of ABs for legitimate medical treatment, not pointless cosmetic use. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alyosha Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 That's exactly it HA. Particularly with Tylosin being in the macrolide group of ABs - resistance issues to these can be serious indeed. Some of the macrolides are last ditch treatments in serious human conditions and they are especially controlled with a view to reducing resistance issues. Just because people are willing to skirt laws and sell this doesn't make it good or safe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nekhbet Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 (edited) Tylosin is not an antibiotic - it's a bacteriostatic agent. It slows the growth (and prevents them reproducing) of susceptible bacteria and is actually a product from another bacteria. It's a survival mechanism from the producing bacteria, slow the growth of others and it gives you a chance to take over. If it killed other bacteria it would probably kill them too, not very useful in the overall survival of your species :p When you remove a bacteriostat the bacteria resume normal metabolic activity. Antibiotics inhibit bacterial growth or kill them completely. It's why they have a greater effect because they can severely diminish the populations of normal bacteria colonising the animal, which in turn potentially makes more available food/space for nasties to take over - this in turn totally disrupts the whole symbiotic relationship thing we got going on. It's that technicality which gets Tylosin into the product. Edited July 20, 2013 by Nekhbet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alyosha Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 The product requires registration in order to be lawfully supplied in Australia. Which it does not have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erny Posted July 23, 2013 Share Posted July 23, 2013 Has the cause for the tear staining been explored/investigated? Whilst some topical applications are necessary to keep symptoms at bay, I'm big on trying to work from the inside out, rather than the other way around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alyosha Posted August 6, 2013 Share Posted August 6, 2013 Erny you would need to look for independent studies as most information about the causes of it that appears on quick internet searches seems to be written by various product-owning companies... For anyone doubting the serious nature of this antibiotic Tylosin (and that includes those who try to say it is not an antibiotic), there is some further information here: http://www.apvma.gov.au/publications/gazette/2001/12/gazette0112p33.php I know this is old but it is also current. Studies on resistance and similar can take very long periods as that is the nature of the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nekhbet Posted August 6, 2013 Share Posted August 6, 2013 I said by technicality and definition it is not an antibiotic. I know exactly that it is used as a feed additive and growth promoter in livestock overseas because it inhibits the growth of bacterial colonies. I don't dispute at all that it's not a good idea, I wouldn't use it either in any of my dogs and I refuse to use any products that are low dose ABs/inhibitors because of the potential for resistance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maddy Posted August 6, 2013 Share Posted August 6, 2013 Erny you would need to look for independent studies as most information about the causes of it that appears on quick internet searches seems to be written by various product-owning companies... For anyone doubting the serious nature of this antibiotic Tylosin (and that includes those who try to say it is not an antibiotic), there is some further information here: http://www.apvma.gov.au/publications/gazette/2001/12/gazette0112p33.php I know this is old but it is also current. Studies on resistance and similar can take very long periods as that is the nature of the problem. As far as I know (and from my own observations) the staining is fungal. I have two parti greyhounds- one has really heavy staining around his mouth (he looks like a filthy child at times) and the other has absolutely no staining. Both are fed the same diet, both live indoors (at least 23 hours a day) and they are of a similar age. The difference, so far as I can tell, is that the male has a wet mouth and the female doesn't. He has been on antibiotics (of differing types) for a few different things but those antibiotics had absolutely no effect on his staining. Interestingly, his teeth/gums are far better than hers, ruling out it being related to dental health but also suggesting that the amount of saliva seems to play a part- when he does the crazy shake, saliva goes everywhere, when she shakes, nothing. I've had a smell of the skin around his mouth (as well as his breath) and while the breath is fine, the staining does have an odour. I've never done anything about his staining because it doesn't bother him and he's otherwise healthy for a elderly dog but in the interests of science, I might pick up some natural yoghurt for him and see if that makes any difference :D Assuming it is fungal, i'd guess the causes would be similar to cause of overgrowth in humans- a warm, wet area to start with and then something happening to trigger the overgrowth: stress, antibiotics, compromised immune system, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luvsdogs Posted August 11, 2013 Author Share Posted August 11, 2013 Has the cause for the tear staining been explored/investigated? Whilst some topical applications are necessary to keep symptoms at bay, I'm big on trying to work from the inside out, rather than the other way around. When he was desexed the vet also flushed his tear ducts. She said that he had very narrow tear ducts & the only thing to do was wipe his eyes with a damp cotton ball twice a day, something which I'm very lax at doing, especially while being treated for cancer. He also had a tooth removed to make a space for his canine to fit. His adult teeth came in with an under-bite. In his 2 years he's only showed cleaner eyes twice, once at around 5 months - see sig pic & again a few months ago. Both times only lasted about 2-3 weeks when the tearing became worse again. The vet said the tears come through clear, it's when the air gets to them & oxidises that it discolours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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