6 Month Old Staffy Be Aggressive Towards Pup

[Cosmolo]

Please try to take on board the advise given. Coming home to a dead dog is the most awful, gut wrenching experience- people aren't exagerating or being dramatic- just urging caution.

If you posted a little more about what training and management you intend to do with them i am sure you would get further helpful suggestions.

[staffy2]

You have been given very good advice so far - probably not what you wanted to hear but it is still very relevant and good advice.

Most of the people who have responded to you have years of experience breeding and showing staffords - they do know what they are talking about.

I totally agree with not having 2 stafford bitches so close in age together.

You may have to make the decision to rehome one or the other, depending on which dog you prefer.

Rehoming is not cruel, it is in the best interest of the dogs.

It is not fair for one dog to live in fear of another or another dog to be constantly stressed about having to put another dog in its place..

It would be a happier home for you and the dogs.

But get some professional help first by contacting a good behaviourist to come and see the two dogs together and how they interact.

I notice you are in Victoria - Cos from Underdog training is down that way and if you let us know exactly what area you are in we can recommend a good behaviourist (please don't use bark busters or just anyone)..

Thanks Im in the north of Vic

[staffy2]

Look ok I have handled this wrong ok but as much as I can be stubbon I have taken all advise on board even Sandra777 advice, I didnt what ppl to argee with me because as stated that not the real world lol so if anyone can suggest a good dog trainer in north vic that would be great thank

[Staffyluv]

I have put a link to this thread in the training thread. So hopefully someone will know of a professional in your area that can help..

[staffy2]

Thanks staffyluv

[Cosmolo]

Whereabouts in Northern Vic?

[staffy2]

Whereabouts in Northern Vic?

Shepparton I have came arcoss DOGTECH has anyone dealt with these guys

[Cosmolo]

I don't know anyone in that area that i would recommend. You may have to travel to Melbourne.

[Her Majesty Dogmad]

Please get the behaviouralist asap. I've spoken to more than one staffy owner who had one dog kill another, including a male/female pair (both desexed) who killed the owner's new staffy puppy.

Another staffy breeder had a few dogs and came home to find they'd all mauled the oldest female. Not a breed I'd ever want because of their predisposition for aggression with other animals.

[Staffyluv]

Please get the behaviouralist asap. I've spoken to more than one staffy owner who had one dog kill another, including a male/female pair (both desexed) who killed the owner's new staffy puppy.

Another staffy breeder had a few dogs and came home to find they'd all mauled the oldest female. Not a breed I'd ever want because of their predisposition for aggression with other animals.

Staffords are a beautiful and powerful breed. They are loyal beyond fault but well bred dogs don't have a predisposition for aggression with other animals any more than any other animal.

My whole family have had Staffords for many years (most of them have been from good breeders) and in all the dogs we have had between us there has been 1, just 1 dog who was ever an issue with aggression.. He was PTS at about 18 months old after much work had gone into him.

One dog in about twenty dogs isn't what I would call a predisposition for aggression with other animals. That is just our family. I have known many more Staffords over the years and I can't fathom this constant talk of how aggressive they are.

Of all the dogs at the dog park and training that Zig and i go to, it isn't the Staffords that create issues..

Like any breed they need training, exercise and socialisation..

Why do people always have to generalise a whole breed based on a few they say they have known..

I think it is sad that the only Staffords you have known have aggression issues and have killed or mauled other dogs.

[corvus]

Of all the dogs at the dog park and training that Zig and i go to, it isn't the Staffords that create issues..

It often is where I go. It's not that they are aggressive, it's how they react to other dogs objecting to their behaviour. They don't read the more subtle signals from other breeds well and as a result get 'shouted' at. Nine times out of ten, if a staffy gets shouted at at the dog park it will spin around and have a go at the dog that shouted at them. I frankly think they make awful dog park dogs. I'm not the only one that has to manage interactions with this breed carefully to avoid trouble.

[Staffyluv]

Of all the dogs at the dog park and training that Zig and i go to, it isn't the Staffords that create issues..

It often is where I go. It's not that they are aggressive, it's how they react to other dogs objecting to their behaviour. They don't read the more subtle signals from other breeds well and as a result get 'shouted' at. Nine times out of ten, if a staffy gets shouted at at the dog park it will spin around and have a go at the dog that shouted at them. I frankly think they make awful dog park dogs. I'm not the only one that has to manage interactions with this breed carefully to avoid trouble.

I didn't say they wouldn't and couldn't cause issues.

I totally agree that being between two pi$$ed off staffords is not a place I would like to be.

In my opinion 'they' don't make awful dog park dogs - some of them do, yes but not ALL of them. Again, it is an individual thing.

But I digress - this isn't about staffords and dog parks.

I hope the OP can find a behaviourist to help with the issue they are having with their two girls.

[Sandra777]

I frankly think they make awful dog park dogs. I'm not the only one that has to manage interactions with this breed carefully to avoid trouble.

Staffords don't do well with rude dogs (ie the majority of random dog-park dogs) because they simply don't tend to say 'excuse you' they say 'rack off'. I never have mine off lead around random loose dogs for this reason

However in a group of dogs owned by people who know what they're doing I have no problems or concerns.

Unfortunately there's far too many Staffords out there in the ownership of people who simply don't know the breed's breaking points and think they're all gorgeous little babies that would never hurt a fly.

No different to the multitude of Siberian Huskies in totally unsuitable homes, or Dalmatians or Border Collies whatever other breed suddenly becomes popular. All breeds have different traits which we have bred in to them, it only becomes an issue when they're owned by people who don't understand this.

[juice]

Also most of the staffies around are byb ones who don't even look like a real one.

I was at a dogpark this weekend, first time in ages as its next to kids skate park and took the dogs with me.

Only scrap was with a staffy who was carrying a soccer ball around the whole time, ( his young macho owner thought it was good to lift him up by it and hurl him around), and an entire amstaff who went near the ball.

I watched from the outside for a while, and both these owners had no idea their dogs were intimidating other dogs.

The amstaff owner kept alpha rolling him too

But i digress, really get some help, one dog living in fear of another, and the other always on guard is not good for either dog.

It only takes one sideways look and it coud be on, don't take the risk.

Also don't get any old trainer in, there are plenty of bad ones ,spending money now is the best way to go. good luck.

[corvus]

Staffords don't do well with rude dogs (ie the majority of random dog-park dogs) because they simply don't tend to say 'excuse you' they say 'rack off'.

One of my dogs seems to think most staffords (and mixes thereof) are rude dogs. He tells them very politely to please not chew on his face or shoulder him around and they hardly ever notice, so he escalates and tells them more forcefully. As far as they are concerned, the first they knew about it was this dog they were having a good time with suddenly exploded in their face. So both dogs were 'rude' if you ask the other dog.

[Salukifan]

I think you need to consider the 'risk' any dog poses to other dogs in the context of three things:

1. Level ofreactivity – how easy is it to trigger aggression (for whatever reason) in your dog.

2. Bite threshold – how easily will the dog bite if it reacts.

3. Level of bite inhibition – how hard dog will bite if it bites.

On top of that we add mental and physcial characteristics such as tenacity, size, power etc to give you the breed standard. And we breed for them.

So all these things have been selectively bred for to greater or lesser degrees by man in dog breeds developed for different functions. The biggest error humans make is to forget that all dogs are not alike in these factors.

Clearly, prey hunting or dogs of fighting ancestry have been selected to trigger to aggression easily IF the right stimulus is presented. That level is going to be a lot lower in certain circumstances than for breeds where any form of aggression is undesirable and has been selected out.

Some dogs have been specifically bred to use their mouths –retrievers, heeling dogs, dogs that catch prey.

Some dogs have been bred not to bite hard – you don't want your gundog bringing back your dinner with it chewed to bits anymore than you want a traditional companion breed taking pieces out of you. On the other hand, your sighthound needs to grab that prey and hang on or kill it – a hard bite, when the dog bites is a good thing. Ditto for dogs of fighting ancestry and herding breeds who use their mouths.

Now we take all these dogs down to the dog park, turn them lose and wonder why they do exactly what they were bred to do…

Knowledge of what your dog was bred to do, understanding of their levels of reactivity, what triggers them, how easily they'll bite and how hard they'll bite is essential for managing your dog in any situation. I find with the Whippets, that they don't bite easily but if they snap, they will mean it and it won't be gentle.

So if you take your dog of fighting ancestry down to the dogpark, don't wonder why it will react to behaviour IT perceives an offence and if it finishes, ices and puts the little sprinkles on any dog it perceives to have offended. I find the SBTs are fine with dogs that don't question their behaviour. If they get a negative reaction, that's when the trouble can start.

Human ignorance is what causes the problem here. Or human beings thinking that you can fundamentally alter any of those three factors beyond a certain degree. And of course human ignorance extends to mixing breeds that have differing levels of those three factors, creating unpredictable outcomes and selling them to owners who have no idea what they're taking on. Ditto for irresponsible breeders who breed purebred dogs with no thought to allowing characteristics long culled in the breed to creep back in. Hard mouthed gundogs and human aggression in dogs of fighting ancestry are two dangerous cases in point.

Edited April 4, 2013 by Haredown Whippets

[Sandra777]

Staffords don't do well with rude dogs (ie the majority of random dog-park dogs) because they simply don't tend to say 'excuse you' they say 'rack off'.

One of my dogs seems to think most staffords (and mixes thereof) are rude dogs. He tells them very politely to please not chew on his face or shoulder him around and they hardly ever notice, so he escalates and tells them more forcefully. As far as they are concerned, the first they knew about it was this dog they were having a good time with suddenly exploded in their face. So both dogs were 'rude' if you ask the other dog.

Absolutely Corvus - but in the situation you describe the Stafford is being rude - with well socialised Staffords who get the same attention from a rude dog they don't say please go away, they tend to do some avoidance moves then go straight to the 'rack off'. I think of it as a language barrier :laugh:

[kima]

If staffords are predisposed to agression then I think mine is broken :p

He got told off once or twice by our friends foxy who didn't want to play and now gives her plenty of space. He has also been rushed and attacked by a swf and his response was to hide behind my legs.

Not really fair to tar all members of a breed with the same brush. My miniature schnauzer was very antisocial and had no patience for or interest in other dogs but that doesnt mean all schnauzers hate other dogs.

[juice]

Really interesting post HP

Just curious as it was mentioned , if a dog goes for the throat does it mean it more than if it tries to take a front leg out?

[Sandra777]

If staffords are predisposed to agression then I think mine is broken :p

He got told off once or twice by our friends foxy who didn't want to play and now gives her plenty of space. He has also been rushed and attacked by a swf and his response was to hide behind my legs.

Not really fair to tar all members of a breed with the same brush. My miniature schnauzer was very antisocial and had no patience for or interest in other dogs but that doesnt mean all schnauzers hate other dogs.

Wait until your Stafford grows up kima, before assuming he'd going to behave in any specific way....