MonElite Posted March 5, 2013 Author Share Posted March 5, 2013 People realise money makes the workd go around, but if you sell a pup for 2000 and say its for food and vaccs and vet visit, it doesnt add up. If you say its for time spent raising the pup so you have a nice even tempered pet i think people are more likely to pay IMO If I go to a hairdresser to have my hair coloured I expect to pay for the hair dye AND the service that comes with it, not just the hair dye. How is buing a puppy different? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mita Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 (edited) If you say its for time spent raising the pup so you have a nice even tempered pet i think people are more likely to pay IMO The more the pet-buying public can be educated about all the factors that go into producing puppies.... with best all-round chances to develop as well as possible... the better. Most people automatically think of puppies' health histories, soundness of limb & being able to function. But not all realise the importance of socialisation. Dogs' behaviour & personalities don't just come ready-made like the colour of their fur. No, it's hugely linked with parent dogs & whoever raises & cares for them, from the earliest age on. Which is why that pic of the breeder I posted, shows her doing something that's worth pure gold. While lying on the sofa! :) To show this further.... scroll thro' how that Danish breeder talks about her dogs. Yes... all the things associated with breeding & showing, like conformation & health. But the dogs are all described in terms of encouraging & loving their personalities, especially their closeness & trust in people. http://www.kennel-sommerlyst.dk/our_dogs.htm Incidentally, one of the best descriptions I've heard about raising puppies/dogs this way, came from a Victorian registered Rottie breeder talking on ABC Radio. She was explaining how her 'show' Rottie does pet therapy work with elderly people ... it was all in how she bred and raised her dogs. As I said, this work to savvy pet owners, is worth pure gold. Edited March 5, 2013 by mita Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kavik Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 I wonder why they wanted to visit the puppies so young MonElite? You can't temperament test a 2 week old puppy! I am happy to pay for the expertise of the breeder - their knowledge of the breed, lines, temperament, conformation, drive. I acknowledge that it takes time and money to test their dogs in their chosen arena, and raise a litter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BoxerB Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 People realise money makes the workd go around, but if you sell a pup for 2000 and say its for food and vaccs and vet visit, it doesnt add up. If you say its for time spent raising the pup so you have a nice even tempered pet i think people are more likely to pay IMO If I go to a hairdresser to have my hair coloured I expect to pay for the hair dye AND the service that comes with it, not just the hair dye. How is buing a puppy different? Because people know what happens at the hairdresser as it's a regular common purchase. Puppies in a lot of cases are once/twice in a lifetime. All the poster is recommending is that breeders put out all the info so buyers know what goes into breeding a pup. Why is that so wrong? I mentioned it earlier and a few have since, and it's not directed at anyone specific here, but there are breeders who need to get over this, I am the breeder, do not question me, attitude. There is no benefit to anyone by not putting out all the info, other than making themselves feel extra important because they know something we don't. I've got no issues with the prices, and was happy to pay what i did for my pup from a breeder. But some of the experience while searching did sour my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twodoggies2001 Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 It still puzzles me how some people think nothing of "wasting" $1,500 on something like a piece of furniture or TV or holiday (which is gone in a flash) yet they are outraged at spending that amount on their companion to be & new family member for the next 10 or 15 years etc, one hopes. I guess common sense would tell them a limit & expectation of some sort. According to their personal finance & whether the breeder price is within the sensible/average range. Sorry,but I have to disagree with you. 'Wasting' $1500 on furniture or TV is not the same as spending on a puppy. In the lifetime of the puppy, you spend much more than the $1500 and that's OK, but you can't make such a comparison. Having said that, my husband and I spent much more that $1500 on our last puppy to have as a pet, and we were told the price on the initial enquiry. It was up to us to say yes or no and we opted for yes. I don't regret it, but some other people, and rightly so, wouldn't consider this a reasonable price or a puppy. I feel the buyer has the right to know what he/she is up for so as not to waste the breeder's or buyer's time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuckandsteve Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 People realise money makes the workd go around, but if you sell a pup for 2000 and say its for food and vaccs and vet visit, it doesnt add up. If you say its for time spent raising the pup so you have a nice even tempered pet i think people are more likely to pay IMO If I go to a hairdresser to have my hair coloured I expect to pay for the hair dye AND the service that comes with it, not just the hair dye. How is buing a puppy different? Because people know what happens at the hairdresser as it's a regular common purchase. Puppies in a lot of cases are once/twice in a lifetime. All the poster is recommending is that breeders put out all the info so buyers know what goes into breeding a pup. Why is that so wrong? I mentioned it earlier and a few have since, and it's not directed at anyone specific here, but there are breeders who need to get over this, I am the breeder, do not question me, attitude. There is no benefit to anyone by not putting out all the info, other than making themselves feel extra important because they know something we don't. I've got no issues with the prices, and was happy to pay what i did for my pup from a breeder. But some of the experience while searching did sour my opinion. Thats my point exactly. I know nothing about buying a pup, I was raised with rescue dogs and have continued with rescue dogs. Everything I have read about breeders is they do it for the benefit of the breed and make absolutely no money, not that i assume they deserve no money but that is what some have led me to believe. I pay for a behaviourist for my rescues if I was going to get a pup the first thing I would be willing to pay for is the pup being well socialised. So I am saying plug it you pay me more for my time because I put the effort in to give you a well socialised pup rather than one raised in a cage Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mita Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 (edited) People buying puppies need to take the position of being wise consumers. Wise consumers first do their homework... and research. So find out for yourself, first , what are the essentials that go into producing puppies with best chance possible. There's all sorts of sources of good information for doing that . Which then becomes your guide as you deal with individual breeders. Know what you're looking for & move on until you find it. We've been talking about breeders putting in the hard yards to produce quality. Puppy buyers need to put in the hard yards to find quality. And, speaking for myself, I'm happy to pay for what I consider quality. And, I've been fortunate, have found lots of it in my two breeds of interest. Shelties & tibbies. Edited March 5, 2013 by mita Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuckandsteve Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 People realise money makes the workd go around, but if you sell a pup for 2000 and say its for food and vaccs and vet visit, it doesnt add up. If you say its for time spent raising the pup so you have a nice even tempered pet i think people are more likely to pay IMO If I go to a hairdresser to have my hair coloured I expect to pay for the hair dye AND the service that comes with it, not just the hair dye. How is buing a puppy different? Because people know what happens at the hairdresser as it's a regular common purchase. Puppies in a lot of cases are once/twice in a lifetime. All the poster is recommending is that breeders put out all the info so buyers know what goes into breeding a pup. Why is that so wrong? I mentioned it earlier and a few have since, and it's not directed at anyone specific here, but there are breeders who need to get over this, I am the breeder, do not question me, attitude. There is no benefit to anyone by not putting out all the info, other than making themselves feel extra important because they know something we don't. I've got no issues with the prices, and was happy to pay what i did for my pup from a breeder. But some of the experience while searching did sour my opinion. Thats my point exactly. I know nothing about buying a pup, I was raised with rescue dogs and have continued with rescue dogs. Everything I have read about breeders is they do it for the benefit of the breed and make absolutely no money, not that i assume they deserve no money but that is what some have led me to believe. I pay for a behaviourist for my rescues if I was going to get a pup the first thing I would be willing to pay for is the pup being well socialised. So I am saying plug it you pay me more for my time because I put the effort in to give you a well socialised pup rather than one raised in a cage eta, I have rescued a few and when asked about cost I tell them that some you make a little on and others you lose a lot on so hopefully it balances out in the end, most people are fine with that even if they know that theirs was one I would make a bit on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
german_shep_fan Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 (edited) What is so wrong with prospective buyers wanting to see the puppies early? Obv you cannot tell temp ect but I would just be excited to see them at such a young age, be able to gush, perhaps get some pics of proud mum with her pups ect. As for calling them tyre kickers... Edited March 5, 2013 by german_shep_fan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minimax Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 What is so wrong with prospective buyers wanting to see the puppies early? Obv you cannot tell temp ect but I would just be excited to see them at such a young age, be able to gush, perhaps get some pics of proud mum with her pups ect. As for calling them tyre kickers... I took great delight in meeting my pup when he was a week old. Okay, so I didn't know which was mine, there were two black boys and it could have been either of them. But I held all the babies and it was awesome seeing him so little. However, I'd been on the list for him for over a year, so there was no "tyre kicking" going on. And although I'd never met the breeder in person, we'd spoken online and on the phone for well over a year. I completely understand though how some people don't like letting strangers into their house, and my breed is a lot different to yours so I can also understand mum might not be as welcoming to strangers around her babies. I wouldn't like a whole stream of randoms I'd never met traipsing through my house to look at two week old puppies, especially if they were "just looking" and not committed to buying. So I can see it from both sides. If you have a lot of pups, as MonElite does, that's potentially a lot of people coming through to look at them, even if it's just one or two people looking at each pup! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Danni Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 FH, turn your phone off when you go to bed! :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OSoSwift Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 I would not bet letting people see my babies that young. I know of breeders who have lost whole litters after someone came to look at 5 week old pups, said they hadn't been to any other breeders places that day - they lied end result all puppies dead from PArvo. Also I dare anyone to go into a room with a Dobe bitch and her two tweek old babies and try to put their hand in, touch them ro anything - thats if they get into the room in the first place. When they were older she would probably hand you one as you walk out the door. Yes it is nice to get all mushy over new babies but it is not in the new babies or mums best interestes to be upset when theya re that young. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OSoSwift Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 My phone is my alarm so I get phone calls starting early generally, the odd pate night email or text :) This morning was for a dog hit by a car on our road so I didn't mind that one - poor doggy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
german_shep_fan Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 I would not bet letting people see my babies that young. I know of breeders who have lost whole litters after someone came to look at 5 week old pups, said they hadn't been to any other breeders places that day - they lied end result all puppies dead from PArvo. Also I dare anyone to go into a room with a Dobe bitch and her two tweek old babies and try to put their hand in, touch them ro anything - thats if they get into the room in the first place. When they were older she would probably hand you one as you walk out the door. Yes it is nice to get all mushy over new babies but it is not in the new babies or mums best interestes to be upset when theya re that young. I guess we have had different experiences then :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bjelkier Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 What is so wrong with prospective buyers wanting to see the puppies early? Obv you cannot tell temp ect but I would just be excited to see them at such a young age, be able to gush, perhaps get some pics of proud mum with her pups ect. As for calling them tyre kickers... I won't allow anyone to see my puppies until they are at least 6 weeks old and then it's only the people who are definitely getting puppies (these people have always met my older dogs first at other times). I screen my puppy people very heavily. The last lot of puppy people had a lot of children, 2 and 5 under 10 not to mention one of the groups brought her friends and their children too It's a lot of ask of the breeder (who is more then likely exhausted, lord knows I was at 2 weeks) and the bitch and lets face it, at that age puppies are cute slugs. Photos are just as good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonElite Posted March 5, 2013 Author Share Posted March 5, 2013 (edited) What is so wrong with prospective buyers wanting to see the puppies early? Obv you cannot tell temp ect but I would just be excited to see them at such a young age, be able to gush, perhaps get some pics of proud mum with her pups ect. As for calling them tyre kickers... I send photos of proud mum with puppies. I can even take a video if there is a need. I completely understand though how some people don't like letting strangers into their house, and my breed is a lot different to yours so I can also understand mum might not be as welcoming to strangers around her babies. I wouldn't like a whole stream of randoms I'd never met traipsing through my house to look at two week old puppies, especially if they were "just looking" and not committed to buying. So I can see it from both sides. If you have a lot of pups, as MonElite does, that's potentially a lot of people coming through to look at them, even if it's just one or two people looking at each pup! I have had about 30 enquiries so far. Just imagine 30 couples, some with kids coming on a weekend (probably every weekend) to see mum and pups. :) I guess Im getting so many enquiries as right now (advertised on DOL where I get most of my enquiries from) there is myself and another breeder in Sydney metro area that has puppies. I would not bet letting people see my babies that young. I know of breeders who have lost whole litters after someone came to look at 5 week old pups, said they hadn't been to any other breeders places that day - they lied end result all puppies dead from PArvo. Also I dare anyone to go into a room with a Dobe bitch and her two tweek old babies and try to put their hand in, touch them ro anything - thats if they get into the room in the first place. When they were older she would probably hand you one as you walk out the door. Yes it is nice to get all mushy over new babies but it is not in the new babies or mums best interestes to be upset when theya re that young. Thank you! Thats exactly right. She barked at my partners Mum when she came over few days ago, and she has met her before. Imagine what would go on with strangers. This particular buyer asked if they can see the dogs, as the husband never owned a dobe and they just want to see if the size of the dog is right for them. I said that I don't let people come over until pups are 6-7 weeks old. And that I don't own the sire, however if they want to meet him, he is being shown on the weekend and they can meet him there. But I wont be at the show as I'm home with the puppies 200km away from the show. Now I'm thinking - you are enquiring about buying a dobermann and you dont know if the size of the dog is right for you? Im guessing there was little research done prior to contacting me. I actually really liked the original enquiry and was more than happy to sell them a dog. They sounded like a great home for one of my puppies. Edited March 5, 2013 by MonElite Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonElite Posted March 5, 2013 Author Share Posted March 5, 2013 Thats my point exactly. I know nothing about buying a pup, I was raised with rescue dogs and have continued with rescue dogs. Everything I have read about breeders is they do it for the benefit of the breed and make absolutely no money, not that i assume they deserve no money but that is what some have led me to believe. I pay for a behaviourist for my rescues if I was going to get a pup the first thing I would be willing to pay for is the pup being well socialised. So I am saying plug it you pay me more for my time because I put the effort in to give you a well socialised pup rather than one raised in a cage That is part of my advertisement Both dogs have been extensively tested and all puppies will be DNA negative for DCM (cardio) by parentage. No puppy from this litter will be vWD affected. Puppies from this litter are expected to be very substantial and strong, with beautiful, powerful looking heads. Our puppies are brought up in a family environment, they're extensivelly socialised with a variety of people, children, taken for car rides and fed a natural diet. These puppies will be great show and obedience prospects, and of course fantastic companions and family members. Purchasing a puppy from us you'll be provided with a life time of support for your dog and a fantastic puppy pack. But seriously - when people get their pup at 8 weeks, how much socialisation would they expect? The pups get vaccinated at 6-7 weeks, shouldnt be going anywhere as they are not immune. They dont really interact much till they are about 5 weeks old, so how much can be done in the 3 weeks? Considering that its not one pup but the whole litter, and they should not be leaving the breeders premises. What are peoples expectations? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OSoSwift Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 Not to mention they can go to a show and see many DObes to get a really good idea of how big they are, then meet the dad and the mum a little down the track. I remember going to my Dobes breeders, they allowed me to look at the babies from the doorway of the spare room at 5 weeks of age when mum was out on a toilet run and the babies were inside slepping after their play time outside. They didn't offer for me to touch them, I didn't ask and I was getting one of them! I did get growled at by one of the babies who then immediately starting sooking and wanting to be picked up when she heard the breeders voice. I got her flown down at 8 weeks and she was a fantastic little girl :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
julesluvscavs Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 I won't allow anyone to see my puppies until they are at least 6 weeks old and then it's only the people who are definitely getting puppies (these people have always met my older dogs first at other times). I screen my puppy people very heavily. Thats how our new puppy's breeder was too :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonElite Posted March 5, 2013 Author Share Posted March 5, 2013 (edited) Not to mention they can go to a show and see many DObes to get a really good idea of how big they are, I told them that the male (they wanted a male) will be about 70-72 cm tall at the wither and as an adult will be about 45kg. It's a bit sad, they really sounded like a great home. Now that I know what is advertised, there are very few pups around. If they will want to meet the dogs they will have to travel to other breeders hundereds of km. Or will end up buying a BYB pup with no papers. Edited March 5, 2013 by MonElite Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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