Christina Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 thanks heaps - I normally do not have an issue with early desexing, but these pups have had a rough start to life and so I am not comfortable giving them a general anaesthetic them whilst they are so young. I was thinking about asking the owners to pre-pay for desexing at their local vet clinic and provide me with a receipt prior to pick-up ? (as was not sure the legalities were with taking money and refunding it once proof of desexing has been provided). well hold onto them until they are old enough and well enough to be put under GA. If they aren't well enough for a GA, then they aren't well enough to be rehomed That's what I was going to suggest. A couple of extra weeks shouldn't be a problem. Doubt people will pay an extra $150 etc to be refunded on desexing for cross breed or mongrel pups. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Her Majesty Dogmad Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 I've worked in rescue for many years now, with one group for 9 years. Quite regularly that group would get a pregnant bitch from the pound who would have pups a day or two later. Those puppies were raised to the age where they could be safely desexed BEFORE being rehomed. If you are a rescuer, you never rehome an undesexed puppy - NEVER. I'm afraid you simply can't trust anyone, no matter how nice they seem, no matter what they do for a profession. Recently I assisted in the rescue of a young cat with kittens from a pound. The local vet offered to help rehome some of the kittens. They wanted to do this without desexing and telling the new owners to "bring the kitten back in a few weeks time" for desexing. After hearing that they had just had a litter to rehome from an undesexed kitten - now a cat - that they'd rehomed before but the owner had never gotten desexed, there was no way that I was going to allow them to rehome any kittens that weren't desexed already. I wouldn't have anyway but this was just more proof that you can't rely on people to do the right thing. You simply cannot allow any mistakes to contribute to the over population of animals, you then become part of the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 thanks heaps - I normally do not have an issue with early desexing, but these pups have had a rough start to life and so I am not comfortable giving them a general anaesthetic them whilst they are so young. I was thinking about asking the owners to pre-pay for desexing at their local vet clinic and provide me with a receipt prior to pick-up ? (as was not sure the legalities were with taking money and refunding it once proof of desexing has been provided). well hold onto them until they are old enough and well enough to be put under GA. If they aren't well enough for a GA, then they aren't well enough to be rehomed That's what I was going to suggest. A couple of extra weeks shouldn't be a problem. Doubt people will pay an extra $150 etc to be refunded on desexing for cross breed or mongrel pups. I agree ... hang onto them for another few weeks ..if you can , as there really is no way of 'enforcing' desexing.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdierikx Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 Our rescue vet will desex rescue pups that are over 8 weeks and over 1 kg in weight... and they haven't lost one or had any complications from any of the surgeries they've done to date. They do the neatest and most pain free job every time... in fact, it's impossible to keep the pups quiet and inactive once they come out of the anaesthetic - even the girls! And pups heal so fast after surgery too! If the boys' testicles haven't dropped, we hold them in care until they have, then they are desexed before advertising. It's not completely uncommon to have the smaller breed pups in care a bit longer than the larger breed ones, as they sometimes drop later (around 10 to 12 weeks old). We've only had one boy pup who hadn't dropped by 12 weeks old, and they didn't look like they were going to anyways - his surgery was a bit more complicated, but he came through it with the same resilience as every other pup we've had done, so it all worked out in the end, and he went on to the very best forever home soon after... We also had one small breed pup that had a nasty hernia that decided to start strangling when he was 5 weeks old - he was only 800 grams, but sailed through his surgery like a true little pro - he had already dropped, so he was desexed at the same time. It was a risk that we absolutely had to take because he would have died from the hernia strangulation if he didn't have the surgery. The vet called us once the hernia was repaired and told us he was coping with the anaesthetic well, and did we want him desexed at the same time - and that's awesome service I reckon! T. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WExtremeG Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 De-sex before re-homing- why add to the problem? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spyda62 Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 Why dont you give these puppies to a reputable rescue, that can put them into foster care until they are big and well enough to be desexed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebanne Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 Why dont you give these puppies to a reputable rescue, that can put them into foster care until they are big and well enough to be desexed? what a good idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdierikx Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 The pups had the offer of rescue in the other thread about them in the rescue forums... T. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brutus Posted February 15, 2013 Author Share Posted February 15, 2013 (edited) Why dont you give these puppies to a reputable rescue, that can put them into foster care until they are big and well enough to be desexed? what a good idea. thanks - have taken all these comments on board and am in the process of working things out with a rescue organisation. and as I mentioned before - there are reasons for these pups not having anaesthetics straight away, and I am not on here to discuss those as I trust the vets I have sought guidance from. Edited February 15, 2013 by brutus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spyda62 Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 (edited) ... Edited February 16, 2013 by spyda62 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brutus Posted February 16, 2013 Author Share Posted February 16, 2013 (edited) Why dont you give these puppies to a reputable rescue, that can put them into foster care until they are big and well enough to be desexed? what a good idea. thanks - have taken all these comments on board and am in the process of working things out with a rescue organisation. and as I mentioned before - there are reasons for these pups not having anaesthetics straight away, and I am not on here to discuss those as I trust the vets I have sought guidance from. Who on earth are you goin to rehome 6-7 week old pups with health issues to? I sincerely hope that you do your research on the families that you place them with. They MUST be made aware of the responsibilty they are taking on in getting one of these pups. Thanks for your input - love the fact that you have come up with all sorts of insinuations regarding the long term health of these pups and who I have rehomed them to. And yes I had several offers from rescue groups for these pups - and I advised them all that I would be in touch at the end of the month if I needed help. I have met many different types of rescue groups over the years, and so reserve the right to choose one of my own accord. Which I have now done. Thanks to those people who were willing to help without jumping to their own conclusions. Edited February 16, 2013 by brutus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdierikx Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 I didn't jump to any conclusions - I offered help when you were asking for it in the rescue forums... and gave examples of vets who can do early age desexing with no issues. It's a bit late after the fact to ask how you can enforce a desexing "contract" IMHO... the only way that you can guarantee desexing of these pups is to have it done before rehoming them. T. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brutus Posted February 16, 2013 Author Share Posted February 16, 2013 I didn't jump to any conclusions - I offered help when you were asking for it in the rescue forums... and gave examples of vets who can do early age desexing with no issues. It's a bit late after the fact to ask how you can enforce a desexing "contract" IMHO... the only way that you can guarantee desexing of these pups is to have it done before rehoming them. T. The comment re jumping to conclusions was not directed at you. I was very grateful for your help and was honestly going to contact you once I had spoken to a few people this morning. Regardless, the pups will now be desexed prior to rehoming - I do appreciate the opinions I received and have taken that advice. As I have mentioned several times I have no problem with early age desexing (have personally done several surgeries myself) - but it is just not optimal in this situation (and do not feel the need to explain the medical reasons behind it on here). Sincere thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mita Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 [ thanks - have taken all these comments on board and [i]am in the process of working things out with a rescue organisation.[/i] and as I mentioned before - there are reasons for these pups not having anaesthetics straight away, and I am not on here to discuss those as I trust the vets I have sought guidance from. Good on you. You're doing all you can to explore safe options for the puppies.... both physically & in terms of welfare. And good on you for bringing up the topic, anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~Anne~ Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 Well done Brutus for doing what you can for these little pups. I agree with Mita, you're doing all you can and taking the issues seriously and I think it is fabulous that you are continually seeking advice and information. Rescues don't have a monopoly on the rights of dogs and some of the comments made in threads of this nature are incredibly arrogant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spyda62 Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 Why dont you give these puppies to a reputable rescue, that can put them into foster care until they are big and well enough to be desexed? what a good idea. thanks - have taken all these comments on board and am in the process of working things out with a rescue organisation. and as I mentioned before - there are reasons for these pups not having anaesthetics straight away, and I am not on here to discuss those as I trust the vets I have sought guidance from. Who on earth are you goin to rehome 6-7 week old pups with health issues to? I sincerely hope that you do your research on the families that you place them with. They MUST be made aware of the responsibilty they are taking on in getting one of these pups. Thanks for your input - love the fact that you have come up with all sorts of insinuations regarding the long term health of these pups and who I have rehomed them to. And yes I had several offers from rescue groups for these pups - and I advised them all that I would be in touch at the end of the month if I needed help. I have met many different types of rescue groups over the years, and so reserve the right to choose one of my own accord. Which I have now done. Thanks to those people who were willing to help without jumping to their own conclusions. I am only going on the facts that you have presented and there is no insinuation what so ever from me. You stated you have found homes for 6-7 week old pups, the age of those pups alone is a very valid reason for needing to be very careful who you place them with. You say they cannot have an anaesthetic straight away on advise from your vet. So...that was not because of health? They are going to be rehomed undesexed...another valid reason for being extra careful with who they are rehomed to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brutus Posted February 16, 2013 Author Share Posted February 16, 2013 Why dont you give these puppies to a reputable rescue, that can put them into foster care until they are big and well enough to be desexed? what a good idea. thanks - have taken all these comments on board and am in the process of working things out with a rescue organisation. and as I mentioned before - there are reasons for these pups not having anaesthetics straight away, and I am not on here to discuss those as I trust the vets I have sought guidance from. Who on earth are you goin to rehome 6-7 week old pups with health issues to? I sincerely hope that you do your research on the families that you place them with. They MUST be made aware of the responsibilty they are taking on in getting one of these pups. Thanks for your input - love the fact that you have come up with all sorts of insinuations regarding the long term health of these pups and who I have rehomed them to. And yes I had several offers from rescue groups for these pups - and I advised them all that I would be in touch at the end of the month if I needed help. I have met many different types of rescue groups over the years, and so reserve the right to choose one of my own accord. Which I have now done. Thanks to those people who were willing to help without jumping to their own conclusions. I am only going on the facts that you have presented and there is no insinuation what so ever from me. You stated you have found homes for 6-7 week old pups, the age of those pups alone is a very valid reason for needing to be very careful who you place them with. You say they cannot have an anaesthetic straight away on advise from your vet. So...that was not because of health? They are going to be rehomed undesexed...another valid reason for being extra careful with who they are rehomed to. I really do not want to continue this debate, but will just point a few things out: Firstly, I was never going to rehome the pups at 6-7 weeks of age - I was always going to hang on to them until March, so that they were at least 10 weeks of age. I have been very careful with whom I am rehoming them too, and have certainly knocked back plenty of people who I did not think were suitable. As for the anaesthetic, I am not going to justify my reasons and am content with the decision that I have made with my vet. These pups will be desexed prior to going to their new homes. Thank you everyone for your input - it is appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 oh ok - my issue is most certainly with the anaesthetic due to their size (& this has been backed up by 3 senior vets at the clinic I am at). They are otherwise healthy, and are ok to go to their new homes in 1-2 weeks. spyda.... maybe you missed this bit ? It answers your doubt You stated you have found homes for 6-7 week old pups, the age of those pups alone is a very valid reason for needing to be very careful who you place them with. I think brutus is wise to have a rescue organisation involved , and I'm sure the pups will be placed carefully. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brutus Posted February 16, 2013 Author Share Posted February 16, 2013 Well done Brutus for doing what you can for these little pups. I agree with Mita, you're doing all you can and taking the issues seriously and I think it is fabulous that you are continually seeking advice and information. Rescues don't have a monopoly on the rights of dogs and some of the comments made in threads of this nature are incredibly arrogant. Thank you so much for your comments anne - and mita as well (not sure how to reply to both together). I really am trying to do what is right by these dogs, and really have done my research in regards to rescue organisations. I try to be very careful as I am aware of more than one rescue group who is not overly reputable, and so want to make sure these pups have the best chance at life. I have also signed them all up to petplan through my work so am hoping the new owners decide to continue with pet insurance (but that is a whole other debate :p). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mita Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 [i really do not want to continue this debate, but will just point a few things out: ... Thank you everyone for your input - it is appreciated. I repeat. Good on you. You've shown every indication of having the best interest of the puppies in mind. You've been unfailingly polite to people who've made suggestions. And you're very wise to indicate you're closing the debate. Best wishes for the puppies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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