Call For Participants: Canine Temperament Testing

[Sheridan]

I would be fascinated to see the kerry blue temperament test. Do please send it along.

My bet is that not only a there few breed specific temp tests, they're not used by the majority of pounds.

[Cosmolo]

Don't assume that everyone conducting assessments has poor breed knowledge and does not take into consideration what is typical behvaiour for various breeds. It doesn't have to be about fitting every dog into a box.

[Sheridan]

Don't assume that everyone conducting assessments has poor breed knowledge and does not take into consideration what is typical behvaiour for various breeds. It doesn't have to be about fitting every dog into a box.

Just because you do, it doesn't mean someone in Nowheresville, Outback does. And I think for people like the RSPCA and LDH, it does mean neat little boxes, as it clearly does for some rescues. Few have the time or the resources to put work into dogs that don't fit neat little boxes.

[Kirislin]

Poor little Feather. You nearly put me off taking mine down but I think it is important for all the poor displaced dogs that end up in the pound.

That's exactly the reason I took my girls. I never intend for them to end up in a pound, but if it helps dogs of a similar nature then it's been worthwhile.

Don't assume that everyone conducting assessments has poor breed knowledge and does not take into consideration what is typical behvaiour for various breeds. It doesn't have to be about fitting every dog into a box.

Just because you do, it doesn't mean someone in Nowheresville, Outback does. And I think for people like the RSPCA and LDH, it does mean neat little boxes, as it clearly does for some rescues. Few have the time or the resources to put work into dogs that don't fit neat little boxes.

Sheridan that's basically what Diana meant when I asked if Feather would fail a temperament test. It's not that she was aggressive but she was fearful in certain situations and definitely didn't fit into the boxes. Diana said a tester might feel she needed work to improve in those situations and that some of the larger places wouldn't have the time or resources to put into her.

Edited February 2, 2013 by Kirislin

[piper]

Don't think I like what it sounds like this temperament test is being developed for....

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/south-australia/desexing-order-for-bad-natured-pets-given-teeth/story-e6frea83-1226567433144

EVERY dog will be desexed unless they can pass a test proving they are good natured under a proposal aimed at reducing attacks.The State Government is examining a Dog and Cat Management Board proposal to compulsorily desex dogs unless they pass a good-character test.

The board has made the recommendation to the Government because it believes it would reduce the number of dog attacks in South Australia.

Board executive officer Ben Luxton said yesterday the board's long-term goal was to "work towards breeding a more amicable and socially acceptable dog population".

"We are not saying it's mandatory desexing. What we are saying is that dogs should be assessed for temperament and that those dogs that have a temperament that is suitable to be passed on to the next generation should be allowed to breed," he said.

About 65 per cent of dogs registered in South Australia are desexed.

Mr Luxton said the desexing proposal would not be breed-specific but would apply to all dogs.

However, he said he favoured a model in which dog owners who wanted to prevent their dogs from being desexed would submit their pets for an assessment that would determine if they were suitable for breeding.

He said the board was funding research at Melbourne's La Trobe University to develop a reliable test on temperament for dogs.

There is more to the story in the link....

[Sheridan]

Well, how very interesting.

[Greytmate]

The uni is claiming they are developing this test for the purpose of rehoming dogs. The info is in the link on the first post.

I don't think universities are allowed to lie about the nature of a particular study.

[WoofnHoof]

I think temperament testing as a whole can be fraught with danger for many breeds, this tendency to want to standardize everything sounds good for the bean counters and pen pushers but it isn't necessarily correct for the dogs and the owners IMHO.

At the end of the day the only thing that will prevent dog attacks is education of owners, education about breeds, temperament, management and welfare. Anything else is a waste of time again IMHO. Rather than spending time and research trying to standardise the vast variety of temperaments that exist in the canine population I would rather see a standardised education and examination program for owners, breeders and the general public.

[*kirty*]

Poor Feather. Hope she has gotten over her 'ordeal'. :) The poor Iggies wouldn't do well either - so many of the ones that end up in pounds are labelled as very timid and flighty, etc but once in a stable home, they are fine. They just don't do well in pounds.

[Rebanne]

Well I will now be seeking some anwsers from LaTrobe before I allow my dogs to be tested. I was all for helping pounds etc understand dogs/greyhounds better but I won't be party to any attempt to force people to desex their dogs just because they don't pass a temperament test.

[Greytmate]

If a dog is timid and flighty, why shouldn't it have that label? it isn't desirable for a dog to become overly anxious and not be able to self-recover in situations of mild stress. It is essential for the welfare of these dogs that their needs be recognised and they be put into a suitable environment if one is available.

You can't really blame a test for a dog being nervy, it's something that the dogs breeders are responsible for.

[Greytmate]

Well I will now be seeking some anwsers from LaTrobe before I allow my dogs to be tested. I was all for helping pounds etc understand dogs/greyhounds better but I won't be party to any attempt to force people to desex their dogs just because they don't pass a temperament test.

Yes good idea. They are required to tell people the truth about the purpose of the research, and the link was pretty specific about what the study was for.

[*kirty*]

Sorry, I should have been clearer. Some of the dogs are assumed to be too nervy or shy to be put up for adoption. But the breed is like that. They are nervous in strange places and they are often shy around strangers. There is not something wrong with them. Allowances should be made for these dogs.

Edited because I read the full article.

Edited February 3, 2013 by *kirty*

[corvus]

Don't think I like what it sounds like this temperament test is being developed for....

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/south-australia/desexing-order-for-bad-natured-pets-given-teeth/story-e6frea83-1226567433144

EVERY dog will be desexed unless they can pass a test proving they are good natured under a proposal aimed at reducing attacks.The State Government is examining a Dog and Cat Management Board proposal to compulsorily desex dogs unless they pass a good-character test.

The board has made the recommendation to the Government because it believes it would reduce the number of dog attacks in South Australia.

Board executive officer Ben Luxton said yesterday the board's long-term goal was to "work towards breeding a more amicable and socially acceptable dog population".

"We are not saying it's mandatory desexing. What we are saying is that dogs should be assessed for temperament and that those dogs that have a temperament that is suitable to be passed on to the next generation should be allowed to breed," he said.

About 65 per cent of dogs registered in South Australia are desexed.

Mr Luxton said the desexing proposal would not be breed-specific but would apply to all dogs.

However, he said he favoured a model in which dog owners who wanted to prevent their dogs from being desexed would submit their pets for an assessment that would determine if they were suitable for breeding.

He said the board was funding research at Melbourne's La Trobe University to develop a reliable test on temperament for dogs.

There is more to the story in the link....

This came up at the AIAM conference a few months ago. A couple of weeks later I spoke to Tammy King about it at the APDT conference and unless I misunderstood, she had no idea people in SA animal management were kicking around amicability in relation to some kind of desexing policy. She was mystified and somewhat alarmed. Most of the information the people involved presented in their talk about it was only half the story.

Meanwhile, there are a lot of people in animal management that want standardised temperament testing. The reasons why are kind of convoluted, but mostly I think they don't like making subjective decisions about a dog's future based on a test they don't entirely believe in. They know that dogs don't fit into little boxes, but they don't want these decisions to be arbitrary. A standardised temperament test does not have to ignore breed, it just involves a lot more background research than we have at the moment. I know there are a lot of ideas being kicked around about this at the moment and people in the industry want to make the process more scientifically rigorous. Some of the problem, though, is that the moment you bring people into the equation you have already introduced bias. Maybe the person testing thinks the dog has a cute face, or doesn't like the breed, or isn't fond of dogs that jump up. Dogs in shelters and kennels are largely starved for human interaction. There is no way none of those dogs are adjusting their behaviour in response to the body language of the assessor. Even if the assessment were to somehow exclude direct interaction with the assessor, if someone has to score responses, there will be bias unless you can reduce it down to counts. To me, this research is a step in the right direction.

And no, researchers cannot mislead participants about the purpose of a study, unless there is a sound scientific reason to. Ethics committees can and sometimes do shut whole projects down if they get a whiff of a major breach of the ethics agreement.

[WoofnHoof]

If they want to standardise temperament testing they should at the very least use the breed standards as a reference point, that's no help for crosses of course but at least with purebreds it should be using the correct reference point rather than a 'one size fits all' temperament test. There are hundreds of breeds all bred for different purposes with different temperament types, it's ludicrous to suggest that a one size fits all approach is logical or even remotely useful in this context.

[dancinbcs]

I took Kibah and Feather along yesterday for their temperament tests. Both fared pretty much as I thought they would, no aggression at all but fearful with some things. Kibah was calmer and less inclined to panic but I think poor little Feather was terrified, which I thought might be the case. When it was over and she was back in the car she was fine, but for a while there her heart rate got so high they were nearly going to stop the test. I asked if she would fail a current temperament test if she ended up in a pound and the tester said she might be considered too much effort in some of the bigger pounds so it's quite likely she would fail. My poor little girl, to me it just proves that the tests are wrong for whippets because she's the sweetest funniest little dog. I hope my girls contributions go some way to helping them make a more appropriate test. I would hate to think a dog like Feather could be put down simply because she failed the temperament test.

What on earth did they do that could terrify a dog that much?

[Greytmate]

Woof, the actual test could be a standard test. But to be useful the results need to be looked at in breed context, and not just added up as a score.

I think timidity is a fault in any breed. I think the implications for this are different in a guardian breed than they are in a hound.

Scientific rigour is important, but dogs live in homes and not in laboratories. The methodology for any research is going to have to acknowledge cultural bias and environment.

[Kirislin]

I took Kibah and Feather along yesterday for their temperament tests. Both fared pretty much as I thought they would, no aggression at all but fearful with some things. Kibah was calmer and less inclined to panic but I think poor little Feather was terrified, which I thought might be the case. When it was over and she was back in the car she was fine, but for a while there her heart rate got so high they were nearly going to stop the test. I asked if she would fail a current temperament test if she ended up in a pound and the tester said she might be considered too much effort in some of the bigger pounds so it's quite likely she would fail. My poor little girl, to me it just proves that the tests are wrong for whippets because she's the sweetest funniest little dog. I hope my girls contributions go some way to helping them make a more appropriate test. I would hate to think a dog like Feather could be put down simply because she failed the temperament test.

What on earth did they do that could terrify a dog that much?

Feather would be frightened in unfamiliar situations, especially if I wasn't there. Apparently some dogs were very chilled out and not frightened by the test. They said Feather kept coming to them and trying to jump on their laps but they weren't allowed to interact with her. I'm sure that would have confused her even more. I expected that she would have been afraid by the ordeal but I wanted to help them get a reaction on a whippet that is otherwise a great little pet, I dont think they fare well in these kinds of tests. Feather is absolutely fine now, back to her cute loveable little self.

[WoofnHoof]

Woof, the actual test could be a standard test. But to be useful the results need to be looked at in breed context, and not just added up as a score.

I think timidity is a fault in any breed. I think the implications for this are different in a guardian breed than they are in a hound.

Scientific rigour is important, but dogs live in homes and not in laboratories. The methodology for any research is going to have to acknowledge cultural bias and environment.

It seems to me a cumbersome and error prone way to do it though, by standardising it generically it primes the tester to have a preconceived concept of what is 'correct' or 'good' behaviour which you then have to try and undo/negate by putting it in a breed context. I'd rather see it go the other way around if it's going to be done at all so the tester is primed to look at specific behaviours within the context of the breed first and foremost.

It's not about homes vs laboratories it's about not creating a bias against certain breeds because their behaviour is not consistent with the generic 'ideal' dog concept.

Like I said I think this should all be considered secondary to the education of the home, if they want a dog of a certain breed they need to understand and accept the breed characteristics, not have a preconceived generic idea of what a dog should be and assume the dog will be that without fully understanding the characteristics underlying those breeds.

[dancinbcs]

I took Kibah and Feather along yesterday for their temperament tests. Both fared pretty much as I thought they would, no aggression at all but fearful with some things. Kibah was calmer and less inclined to panic but I think poor little Feather was terrified, which I thought might be the case. When it was over and she was back in the car she was fine, but for a while there her heart rate got so high they were nearly going to stop the test. I asked if she would fail a current temperament test if she ended up in a pound and the tester said she might be considered too much effort in some of the bigger pounds so it's quite likely she would fail. My poor little girl, to me it just proves that the tests are wrong for whippets because she's the sweetest funniest little dog. I hope my girls contributions go some way to helping them make a more appropriate test. I would hate to think a dog like Feather could be put down simply because she failed the temperament test.

What on earth did they do that could terrify a dog that much?

Feather would be frightened in unfamiliar situations, especially if I wasn't there. Apparently some dogs were very chilled out and not frightened by the test. They said Feather kept coming to them and trying to jump on their laps but they weren't allowed to interact with her. I'm sure that would have confused her even more. I expected that she would have been afraid by the ordeal but I wanted to help them get a reaction on a whippet that is otherwise a great little pet, I dont think they fare well in these kinds of tests. Feather is absolutely fine now, back to her cute loveable little self.

So you didn't get to see what they did? I wouldn't be handing one of mine over if I couldn't watch and demand they stop if I was not happy with what they are doing and my dogs have rock solid temperaments. I also don't see that a lap dog wanting to jump on people's laps is being timid, just what it is used to. I also wonder how they can test temperament if they are not interacting with the dog? All seems very odd to me.