A Real Challenge

[WreckitWhippet]

So Fixer what breed do you show?

SBT's and he's full of sour grapes...

I'm guessing my dog is one that he's taking a shot at :laugh:

[Rebanne]

So dougie is back then?

[fixer]

So Fixer what breed do you show?

SBT's and he's full of sour grapes...

I'm guessing my dog is one that he's taking a shot at :laugh:

Does your dog have yellow eyes?

This may it it folks.

[Rebanne]

So Fixer what breed do you show?

SBT's and he's full of sour grapes...

I'm guessing my dog is one that he's taking a shot at :laugh:

Does your dog have yellow eyes?

This may it it folks.

:laugh: so you started this thread just to have a go a one person and their dog.

Sour grapes big time.

[espinay2]

If white is not a colour what is it?

LACK of colour (pigment). Caused by the white spotting gene. This is basic colour genetics. (I suggest this website.. http://www.doggenetics.co.uk/ )

Edited January 8, 2013 by espinay2

[fixer]

If white is not a colour what is it?

LACK of colour (pigment). Caused by the white spotting gene. This is basic colour genetics. (I suggest this website.. http://www.doggenetics.co.uk/ )

What colour is your dog?

What is the colour listed in its standard.

If your dog was lost, what colour would you use to describe it?

[fixer]

So Fixer what breed do you show?

SBT's and he's full of sour grapes...

I'm guessing my dog is one that he's taking a shot at :laugh:

Does your dog have yellow eyes?

This may it it folks.

:laugh: so you started this thread just to have a go a one person and their dog.

Sour grapes big time.

What you should do is read the topic.

When you have something other than bile to contribute please join us.

I am not responsible for a guilty conscience.

For everyone else.

It is a shame this topic has degenerated into the mire that enveloped the topic that inspired it.

"Look what we have done to our dogs"

That topic was a lost cause before I decided join, so I didn't bother with it.

At first I was disappointed the most vocal of the fault defenders were from the SBT clan.

But in hindsight it was actually a breed that is very good example to use.

Being a breed that regularly attracts a lot of entries, is a breed on a sound footing with many, many beautiful examples of standard, it is ideally suited for the topic.

Which is

"A real challenge"

Giving exhibitors the option to challenge judges to explain when they award an entry with an obvious major fault.

Who would have thought the fault defenders would attack the the fault amenders.

Strange people live here.

[ellz]

At first I was disappointed the most vocal of the fault defenders were from the SBT clan.

Bit of an odd thing to say when you specifically quoted instances from the judging and standard of the SBT......what did you expect us to do? Sit on our hands and watch your chin become browner??

[Rebanne]

:laugh: so you started this thread just to have a go a one person and their dog.

Sour grapes big time.

What you should do is read the topic.

When you have something other than bile to contribute please join us.

I did contribute but you said I didn't count cause I have a minority breed, of course this was before you showed your hand.

[Salukifan]

As exhibitors are frequently advised by judges "you are paying for my opinion" why then are exhibtors prevented from questioning an opinion they have paid for at the time the opinion is given?

If a c.c is awarded to an exhibit that is obviously not to standard for e.g., why can not exhibitors "challenge'' the awarding?

Surely "In my opinion" doesn't cut the mustard when that opinion is obviously "suspect".

Because it holds up every other exhibitor while you give the judge the "benefit" of your wisdom on the breed standard. It's not a debate, its a decision that, regardless of what YOU think of it should be accepted.

There is a time and a place for asking judges why they did what they did and that time is after the judge has finished judging for the day. It's called consideration for your fellow exhibitors. So is not cheapening their win because you can't lose gracefuly.

Most of the "questioning" of opinions I've seen seems to come from people who are disagreeing with what the judge did. Build a bridge I say. The show ring is neither the time nor the place for judge education. If you're that cheesed off about it, put it in writing. Otherwise have the good grace to congratulate the person who won or shut the hell up.

If you dont' like what a judge puts up, don't enter under them again. It's not that hard really.

Kennel blindness is alive and well with some folk. If a whole heap of judges put a dog over yours and you can't figure out why, the best place to start on the "why" of the issue rests with your dog. None of them are perfect. Seems to me those so keen to find fault in others' dogs should conduct the same rigorous evaluation of their own once in a while.

If a judge is prepared to put a dog with "an obvious major fault" over yours, it might still be the better dog ya know. :)

It might also be your handling.

For some exhibitors the "real challenge" is demonstrating grace in defeat.

Edited January 9, 2013 by Haredown Whippets

[ellz]

:laugh: so you started this thread just to have a go a one person and their dog.

Sour grapes big time.

What you should do is read the topic.

When you have something other than bile to contribute please join us.

I did contribute but you said I didn't count cause I have a minority breed, of course this was before you showed your hand.

And those of us who not only have a breed with high numbers, but also the breed the vitriole was aimed at, aren't allowed to reply either.....odd :laugh:

[fixer]

:laugh: so you started this thread just to have a go a one person and their dog.

Sour grapes big time.

What you should do is read the topic.

When you have something other than bile to contribute please join us.

I did contribute but you said I didn't count cause I have a minority breed, of course this was before you showed your hand.

you don't. & it's nothing to do with breed, it's an intellect thing.

Showed my hand?

Does not compute.

[fixer]

:laugh: so you started this thread just to have a go a one person and their dog.

Sour grapes big time.

What you should do is read the topic.

When you have something other than bile to contribute please join us.

I did contribute but you said I didn't count cause I have a minority breed, of course this was before you showed your hand.

And those of us who not only have a breed with high numbers, but also the breed the vitriole was aimed at, aren't allowed to reply either.....odd :laugh:

I mentioned once instance that I witnessed first hand that was more about a judge not knowing the standard ( which isn't that unusual in the overall scheme of things) the rest were complaints I had heard/read third hand.

Each mentioned a fault. A definate fault. Faults you & S 777 denied or defended. Only one was a SBT btw. So far no retorts from the rotties, the Bostons or the lakeland folks.

Do you think they are maybe more in tune with reality than you & your sidekick?

People usually only defend the indefensable because they need to for personal reasons.

Now, cut the crap & give a sensible, logical reasons why the suggestion is out of the question.

Remember, this has nothing to do with personal opinion, we are into reality here.

Try it, it doesn't hurt.

[ellz]

Now, cut the crap & give a sensible, logical reasons why the suggestion is out of the question.

I already have....a couple of times. Only you're so wrapped up in your own opinions you cannot see what others have written......

[Salukifan]

Now, cut the crap & give a sensible, logical reasons why the suggestion is out of the question.

Remember, this has nothing to do with personal opinion, we are into reality here.

Try it, it doesn't hurt.

Did you read my post fixer - you've ignored it so far. The simple answer to your question is because it's simply not feasible to have every decision by the judge "questioned" at the time by someone who doesn't agree with it! It's poor sportsmanship and shows would go for DAYS.

That's the reality. End of story. The fact that you can't find merit in a particular dog doesn't preclude a judge from doing it.

If you're such a gun on breed standards, become a judge yourself!

Edited January 9, 2013 by Haredown Whippets

[fixer]

As exhibitors are frequently advised by judges "you are paying for my opinion" why then are exhibtors prevented from questioning an opinion they have paid for at the time the opinion is given?

If a c.c is awarded to an exhibit that is obviously not to standard for e.g., why can not exhibitors "challenge'' the awarding?

Surely "In my opinion" doesn't cut the mustard when that opinion is obviously "suspect".

Because it holds up every other exhibitor while you give the judge the "benefit" of your wisdom on the breed standard. It's not a debate, its a decision that, regardless of what YOU think of it should be accepted.

There is a time and a place for asking judges why they did what they did and that time is after the judge has finished judging for the day. It's called consideration for your fellow exhibitors. So is not cheapening their win because you can't lose gracefuly.

Most of the "questioning" of opinions I've seen seems to come from people who are disagreeing with what the judge did. Build a bridge I say. The show ring is neither the time nor the place for judge education. If you're that cheesed off about it, put it in writing. Otherwise have the good grace to congratulate the person who won or shut the hell up.

If you dont' like what a judge puts up, don't enter under them again. It's not that hard really.

Kennel blindness is alive and well with some folk. If a whole heap of judges put a dog over yours and you can't figure out why, the best place to start on the "why" of the issue rests with your dog. None of them are perfect. Seems to me those so keen to find fault in others' dogs should conduct the same rigorous evaluation of their own once in a while.

If a judge is prepared to put a dog with "an obvious major fault" over yours, it might still be the better dog ya know. :)

It might also be your handling.

For some exhibitors the "real challenge" is demonstrating grace in defeat.

If you don't comprehend the topic you shouldn't really reply.

[Rebanne]

:laugh: so you started this thread just to have a go a one person and their dog.

Sour grapes big time.

What you should do is read the topic.

When you have something other than bile to contribute please join us.

I did contribute but you said I didn't count cause I have a minority breed, of course this was before you showed your hand.

you don't. & it's nothing to do with breed, it's an intellect thing.

Showed my hand?

Does not compute.

it's an intellect thing.

[ellz]

it's an intellect thing.

:clap:

[Salukifan]

As exhibitors are frequently advised by judges "you are paying for my opinion" why then are exhibtors prevented from questioning an opinion they have paid for at the time the opinion is given?

If a c.c is awarded to an exhibit that is obviously not to standard for e.g., why can not exhibitors "challenge'' the awarding?

Surely "In my opinion" doesn't cut the mustard when that opinion is obviously "suspect".

Because it holds up every other exhibitor while you give the judge the "benefit" of your wisdom on the breed standard. It's not a debate, its a decision that, regardless of what YOU think of it should be accepted.

There is a time and a place for asking judges why they did what they did and that time is after the judge has finished judging for the day. It's called consideration for your fellow exhibitors. So is not cheapening their win because you can't lose gracefuly.

Most of the "questioning" of opinions I've seen seems to come from people who are disagreeing with what the judge did. Build a bridge I say. The show ring is neither the time nor the place for judge education. If you're that cheesed off about it, put it in writing. Otherwise have the good grace to congratulate the person who won or shut the hell up.

If you dont' like what a judge puts up, don't enter under them again. It's not that hard really.

Kennel blindness is alive and well with some folk. If a whole heap of judges put a dog over yours and you can't figure out why, the best place to start on the "why" of the issue rests with your dog. None of them are perfect. Seems to me those so keen to find fault in others' dogs should conduct the same rigorous evaluation of their own once in a while.

If a judge is prepared to put a dog with "an obvious major fault" over yours, it might still be the better dog ya know. :)

It might also be your handling.

For some exhibitors the "real challenge" is demonstrating grace in defeat.

If you don't comprehend the topic you shouldn't really reply.

I comprehend your beef. You dont' like it that a dog you think is not as good as yours keeps winning and the judges wont' see it your way. It's not rocket science. You want reasons for why judges do what they do? Show at specialities.

Cheap shots at the literacy and intellect of those who don't agree with you - is that the best you can do? Seems to me you won't be here for long if that's how you deal with disagreement.

Edited January 9, 2013 by Haredown Whippets

[ellz]

I comprehend your beef. You dont' like it that a dog you think is not as good as yours keeps winning and the judges wont' see it your way. It's not rocket science.

Unless there is a hidden agenda that only fixer knows about.

Either way, I suggest that rather than keep frustrating ourselves going around in circles....that we do ourselves a favour and stop feeding the troll.