Medication To Treat Dog Aggression?

[littlesev]

I'm wondering if anyone here has had success in using medication to treat dog aggression?

We recently got kicked out of puppy school because GG started to get extremely agitated around other puppies and couldn't stop barking at them, even with Thundershirt on. I have to note that he's calm at home - naughty and often gets bitey because he's teething but he rarely barks and loves people. On lead he is a big puller, he runs, not walks and has high adrenaline on general.

The trainer suggested that we put him on medication to lower his stress level, thereby allowing him to interact with dogs in a much more relaxed state and wean him off completely in 9 months. I've read up a bit on the subject but would like to know first hand experience with it

When I let GG come up and say hello to dogs, he doesn't know how to interact properly. He'll jump and use his paws to… scratch (it's a poor word, but I can't think of anything else) them out of excitement. They will just stare back, confused and then he would start growling uncontrollably and I have to ask him to calm down. In other cases, he would growl at sight. Once he tried to pick a fight with a calm and indifferent Rotti (my dog is a 4kg silky terrier) and couple of times, he goes on prey mode, creeps slowly and watches the other dog from a distance. Or sometimes other dog barks first and he'd bark in response.

It has become a sort of catch-22 that I know he needs to learn to interact with dogs but can't bring him to dog park, enrol him in obedience class or let him get too close to dogs because I can't guess what his reaction would be. Sometimes he is well-mannered, particularly with adult dogs. But if he reacts badly, I can't exactly risk other dog's for the sake of training mine. I also don't have friends who have dogs. So right now we stick to 'hi and bye' when meeting unfamiliar dogs. I guess one option is to get a companion dog with whom he could learn to play (with very close supervision of course) but that wouldn't be feasible right now as I have my hands full with one pup

[minimax]

What trainer suggested medication? Was she actually a trainer or was it through a vet where the "trainer" was a vet nurse?

Going up and using their paws to greet other dogs is normal for little pups, they get over excited really quickly. It's up to you to teach him this isn't appropriate, by not letting him do it (as you hold the other end of the leash and can pull him back) and teaching him to greet a dog nicely.

Also, laying on the ground and creeping towards dogs can be a playful thing.

I'd be looking to take him somewhere with a qualified trainer, either as a one-on-one or group.

Getting another pup so one pup can learn to play isn't a practical solution.

[megan_]

I agree with minimax - get some one on one help with a qualified trainer. If you let us know where you are we can suggest someone. You want someone who understands that socialization isn't about meeting every dog, but learning to act appropriately around dogs and even ignore them when required.

[Guest Panzer Attack!]

Medication can have other unwanted side effects (eg. the meds I temporarily put one of my dogs on can be known to make some dogs MORE aggressive). Please see a proper trainer before proceeding any further, and have a chat to your vet.

AND please remember that medication is only one part of healing your dog. In many it doesn't need to be used at all. If your dog's a puppy I'm quite alarmed someone is already suggesting medication!

[megan_]

Especially since it sounds like normal puppy stuff?

Fergus used to stalk and pounce, so we trained a recall game and I could interior this behaviour instantly. This is the kind of thing a good trainer will teach you.

[littlesev]

Yeah, she's a dog trainer who holds puppy classes at the vet's. Thanks Minimax, I'm also considering a private session. I was just told beforehand that other behaviourists & trainers would most likely prescribe medication for him.

megan_, I'm in Eastwood NSW. Yeah, I'm fine if he's not a dog dog. I just want him to be able to have proper interaction with dogs. I'll appreciate any recommendation :)

Panzer Attack!, thanks for the info. Ideally I'd treat medication as last resort. His flea/tick/worm treatment and medicines for recent illness are already too much chemicals for his tiny body.

[megan_]

Try contacting Steve from k9 pro ( or pm huski on this forum, she works for Steve and responds really quickly). If he's too far from you he should be able to recommend someone.

[persephone]

I was just told beforehand that other behaviourists & trainers would most likely prescribe medication for him.

<br style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: verdana, tahoma, arial, sans-serif; line-height: 18px; background-color: rgb(238, 242, 247);">

That seems a big generalisation.

Someone here will give you a recommendation to a person who can help you .... just be careful who you choose ..take advice from DOLers who have 'been there, Done That"

Now this baby has had a bout of severe illness , at an important time in his puppyhood... and who is to say the illness has not affected him ?

My suggestion is a thorough vet check WITH BLOOD TESTS at a vet who knows what they are looking at...just so you have all the info .

THEN .. find a good reliable KNOWN trainer/behaviourist to help you understand what is happening in GG's life ....

[Cosmolo]

How old is the dog?

[huski]

Thanks for the rec Megan :)

Why would a trainer kick you out of class rather than help you? I would definitely advise getting a second opinion. Plenty of pups will behave as you've described and, while no one would make an accurate assessment just based on what you've written I would be extremely surprised if medication was required to address the behaviour and modify it.

[fuzzy82]

Seems ridiculous to put a puppy on medication just because he's a bit overexcited around other dogs. Instead of reaching for the pills, just teach him proper interaction (with professional help if you need to). Medication for behavioural issues should only be used as a last resort for adult dogs. Not for puppies.

[persephone]

Cosmolo, he's around 5 mths old ....

[littlesev]

Try contacting Steve from k9 pro ( or pm huski on this forum, she works for Steve and responds really quickly). If he's too far from you he should be able to recommend someone.

megan_, I'll check it out, thanks!!

I guess his growls often surprise a lot of people. People in the street thought it came from the Rotti (who was just minding his own business). Thankfully, all the giant breeds we've met so far seem so calm and nonchalant. Can't say the same about the small dogs :laugh:

Huski, she tactfully asked me to leave and suggested that we do private training instead. While other dog owners seemed pretty understanding, the class was getting difficult to get through with his constant growling and me having to restrain him, I missed most of the info too. I'm glad to hear that it sounds normal for a puppy.

I was just told beforehand that other behaviourists & trainers would most likely prescribe medication for him.

<br style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: verdana, tahoma, arial, sans-serif; line-height: 18px; background-color: rgb(238, 242, 247);">

That seems a big generalisation.

Someone here will give you a recommendation to a person who can help you .... just be careful who you choose ..take advice from DOLers who have 'been there, Done That"

Now this baby has had a bout of severe illness , at an important time in his puppyhood... and who is to say the illness has not affected him ?

My suggestion is a thorough vet check WITH BLOOD TESTS at a vet who knows what they are looking at...just so you have all the info .

THEN .. find a good reliable KNOWN trainer/behaviourist to help you understand what is happening in GG's life ....

Persephone, there was a bump on the back of his neck where he got his C5 vaccine that went away once the antibiotics started working and he got better, so vet thought it's likely to be vaccine related and not IMPA. The puppy class happened a little while before.

Thanks :) I'll follow the general advice here and get a good trainer for him and pass on medication.

[hankdog]

I use Vicki Austin located in Hornsby that is reasonably close. My dog is on Prozac but I relied on more expert opinions than mine for that. Good luck as far as I know it's important to address small issues in puppyhood at sensitive ages appropriately otherwise you can end up with big problems so I would definitely go to a good behaviorist. Your puppy looks lovely from your pic btw.

[Cosmolo]

While i wouldn't be reaching for the medication- please also remember that the way your puppy behaves now is likely to stay with him into adulthood without intervention so if the behaviour is inappropriate (i don't know- can't see the puppy) it does require immediate attention through a qualified and experienced professional- preferably one with appropriate 'teaching dogs' to be utilised in the process.

It's not what i would recommend as i don't know anyone else who does it but one thing that does tend to help these types of pups at that age is to go and spend a week with a well balanced group of dogs under supervision- i have done it with a number of pups and young dogs that have been at 'make or break' point and it has worked very well.

[Sandra777]

Seems ridiculous to put a puppy on medication just because he's a bit overexcited around other dogs. Instead of reaching for the pills, just teach him proper interaction (with professional help if you need to). Medication for behavioural issues should only be used as a last resort for adult dogs. Not for puppies.

x2

Unbelievable. All the behaviours you described are normal puppy behaviours - sounds like the "trainer" was a very poor example of the breed :laugh:

[persephone]

Seems ridiculous to put a puppy on medication just because he's a bit overexcited around other dogs. Instead of reaching for the pills, just teach him proper interaction (with professional help if you need to). Medication for behavioural issues should only be used as a last resort for adult dogs. Not for puppies.

x2

Unbelievable. All the behaviours you described are normal puppy behaviours - sounds like the "trainer" was a very poor example of the breed :laugh:

x3

[Dame Aussie]

Seems ridiculous to put a puppy on medication just because he's a bit overexcited around other dogs. Instead of reaching for the pills, just teach him proper interaction (with professional help if you need to). Medication for behavioural issues should only be used as a last resort for adult dogs. Not for puppies.

Agree. I'm shocked that a trainer would suggest medication for a puppy before doing any behavioural work or having a full vet check?! I'd stay away from this person.

[murve]

I'm wondering if anyone here has had success in using medication to treat dog aggression?

We recently got kicked out of puppy school because GG started to get extremely agitated around other puppies and couldn't stop barking at them, even with Thundershirt on. I have to note that he's calm at home - naughty and often gets bitey because he's teething but he rarely barks and loves people. On lead he is a big puller, he runs, not walks and has high adrenaline on general.

The trainer suggested that we put him on medication to lower his stress level, thereby allowing him to interact with dogs in a much more relaxed state and wean him off completely in 9 months. I've read up a bit on the subject but would like to know first hand experience with it

When I let GG come up and say hello to dogs, he doesn't know how to interact properly. He'll jump and use his paws to… scratch (it's a poor word, but I can't think of anything else) them out of excitement. They will just stare back, confused and then he would start growling uncontrollably and I have to ask him to calm down. In other cases, he would growl at sight. Once he tried to pick a fight with a calm and indifferent Rotti (my dog is a 4kg silky terrier) and couple of times, he goes on prey mode, creeps slowly and watches the other dog from a distance. Or sometimes other dog barks first and he'd bark in response.

It has become a sort of catch-22 that I know he needs to learn to interact with dogs but can't bring him to dog park, enrol him in obedience class or let him get too close to dogs because I can't guess what his reaction would be. Sometimes he is well-mannered, particularly with adult dogs. But if he reacts badly, I can't exactly risk other dog's for the sake of training mine. I also don't have friends who have dogs. So right now we stick to 'hi and bye' when meeting unfamiliar dogs. I guess one option is to get a companion dog with whom he could learn to play (with very close supervision of course) but that wouldn't be feasible right now as I have my hands full with one pup

How young was you baby when you picked him up?

Did he come from a breeder or elsewhere?

these factors could be taken in consideration of his behavior, if he was taken from the litter to early, he odversely has not really learnt the proper dog body language they learn between the ages of 4-14 weeks, this is mainly taught to them by their mother & interacting with other dog members of the family.

I would stay away from Meds,Go have blood test done by your vets, there might be an underlying medical prob that could also trigger this behavior.

Edited January 7, 2013 by murve

[Nekhbet]

Agree. I'm shocked that a trainer would suggest medication for a puppy before doing any behavioural work or having a full vet check?! I'd stay away from this person

I'm not. It's becoming a fashion and I'm seeing it more and more, animals on a variety of medication with NO behavioral intervention at all. Veterinarians and underqualified idiots who call themselves trainers are doing it a lot, then when the animal gets pulled off the medication and goes ballistic it's marked for death because it's just a bad dog. Because we're all too scared to apply a punisher too, it's just nicer to PTS or medicate into a coma.

Get away from the meds, go find yourself a trainer with a brain. NO trainer is qualified to tell you your dog needs these prescription medications without intervention and consultation with an experienced veterinarian. From the sounds of it your trainer has no idea how to train a bloody dog at all and is handing out dangerous advice.

I had a client this week that after having her dog pushed into a corner, forcebly muzzled and SAT ON to have its nails cut at the vet was declared incapable of nail clipping without a LOT of valium. Funny, a few treats, some fun time and a lot of really awesome pats/cuddles the dog never even knew I snipped a couple of nails at all. When a person heads straight for the medication, run.