Look What They Have Done To Our Dogs.

[WreckitWhippet]

Ahhh - but therein lies the rub... how does the novice dog owner manage to source a well bred pedigree instead of a BYB/petshop/rescue/pound dog?

As for the RSPCA temp tests - they aren't exactly designed to have dogs pass in great numbers - they are more designed to justify the high kill rates.

T.

Strangely, quite a few novice dog owners manage to pull it off. I was one of them.

Me too and it was well before the days of the internet and I wanted a French Bulldog of all breeds.

[tdierikx]

May I ask what sort of requirements your original dogs' breeders asked you for? Were they as stringent as your current requirements for prospective puppy buyers?

T.

[Salukifan]

May I ask what sort of requirements your original dogs' breeders asked you for? Were they as stringent as your current requirements for prospective puppy buyers?

T.

Given that it was 15.5 years ago, I don't honestly remember too well.

I think the questions related to what kind of home I was offering and that I understood the coat care requirements of a poodle. I travelled to the breeder's home and spent a couple of hours there.

[Bjelkier]

May I ask what sort of requirements your original dogs' breeders asked you for? Were they as stringent as your current requirements for prospective puppy buyers?

T.

What stringent conditions are breeders putting on dogs? Most of us just want the right home for our puppies

[minimax]

Ahhh - but therein lies the rub... how does the novice dog owner manage to source a well bred pedigree instead of a BYB/petshop/rescue/pound dog?

As for the RSPCA temp tests - they aren't exactly designed to have dogs pass in great numbers - they are more designed to justify the high kill rates.

T.

Strangely, quite a few novice dog owners manage to pull it off. I was one of them.

Me too and it was well before the days of the internet and I wanted a French Bulldog of all breeds.

I was one of them too, after a female black pug, and quite specific what I wanted which probably turned some people off. But I finally found a lovely breeder who not only responded to me even though she didn't have any pups planned for a while, but helped me find a pup from another breeder who met her high standards. I then got pup #2 from her as we became friends, and she only had this one pup going to a pet home and probably had a pretty big waiting list.

I do remember in the first email being asked a lot of questions that I thought were very reasonable for a breeder to ask but maybe someone who "just wants a dog" might find intrusive, I can probably find the email if you're after specifics!

Edited December 31, 2012 by minimax

[Joany]

If you want a Staffy a GSD or Lab maybe a whippet all good but try going shopping for another breed especially if you are not in with the in crowd or its a new breed for you and you want a main register...worse if you want a female...

[WreckitWhippet]

May I ask what sort of requirements your original dogs' breeders asked you for? Were they as stringent as your current requirements for prospective puppy buyers?

T.

I had to travel 5 hours one way to meet them. Myself and my then partner at the time faced the Spanish Inquisition in their kitchen for a good hour or so before we even got to meet a single dog. With the exception of the oldie that was begging for food under the table.

I had been wanting the breed since I was about 7 and had done quite a bit of research before I got to the breeders house. I knew I could provide a home and car with airconditioning and proved to them that I could care for the dog properly.

I believe this breeder to be pretty tough on who gets her dogs and she still is a great guardian of the breed and mentor today. I don't think I'm any tougher than she was. My current litter will be leaving for homes that already have the breed and breed experience, so there's no new comers to give the third degree. One of the new owners has already been assessed as a suitable home, as they adopted a foster from me at the beginning of the year.

[tdierikx]

I'm not arguing that breeders aren't looking for the best homes for their pups/dogs Bjelkier - but I am querying whether those who sourced their first pedigreed dogs as novice owners ever felt that were looked upon with the same suspicion as they now look upon prospective pet owners.

I'm thinking that there looks to be a whole lot more distrust of the buying public now than there used to be many moons ago.

T.

[WreckitWhippet]

I'm not arguing that breeders aren't looking for the best homes for their pups/dogs Bjelkier - but I am querying whether those who sourced their first pedigreed dogs as novice owners ever felt that were looked upon with the same suspicion as they now look upon prospective pet owners.I'm thinking that there looks to be a whole lot more distrust of the buying public now than there used to be many moons ago.

T.

Absolutely, I can still remember the day vividly, although there was cups of tea and biscuits provided, there was still an inquisition.

I can remember even getting dressed that day and hoping that I'd chosen then right thing LOL

[Salukifan]

If you want a Staffy a GSD or Lab maybe a whippet all good but try going shopping for another breed especially if you are not in with the in crowd or its a new breed for you and you want a main register...worse if you want a female...

If you want a Main Register female, odds are you don't just want it as a pet. Selling to prospective breeder/show homes is a whole new ball game.

The first dog I bought was a Miniature Poodle - one of the most puppy farmed breeds around. I answered the questions I was asked honestly but it wasn't that hard.

Edited December 31, 2012 by Haredown Whippets

[Rebanne]

Ahhh - but therein lies the rub... how does the novice dog owner manage to source a well bred pedigree instead of a BYB/petshop/rescue/pound dog?

As for the RSPCA temp tests - they aren't exactly designed to have dogs pass in great numbers - they are more designed to justify the high kill rates.

T.

Strangely, quite a few novice dog owners manage to pull it off. I was one of them.

me too :D

[Rebanne]

May I ask what sort of requirements your original dogs' breeders asked you for? Were they as stringent as your current requirements for prospective puppy buyers?

T.

No requirements, no contracts. Same as I have done for my 2 litters.

[The Spotted Devil]

I lived with my ACD for 17 years (originally the family dog) so when it came to sourcing my Dalmatian I was in another state with no dog contacts at all. I wasn't even looking for a Dalmatian but got chatting with a nurse during my ADF medical who had 2 Dallies and was raving about them. Gave me her breeder's details and I gave them a call. Absolutely I got the 3rd degree and was happy that they cared so much about where the puppies went. I waited 2 years for a pup from them because I was so impressed with their ethics. They were in another state but prospective owners HAD to visit their property and meet them and their dogs. I was a full time student so I wasn't exactly rolling in $$$ (hang on - I'm still a full time student :D ). Mr TSD was in the area for work one time so borrowed a car and drove out to their property to have dinner with them. When the puppies were 5 weeks old I flew up and was their guest for several nights - they picked me up from the airport and were incredibly hospitable. Maybe they just liked my choice in wine but they were more than happy to give me pick of the litter and fly him down when the time came and have never ceased to be delighted with all his achievements. I have similar respect for Em's breeder and we spend many hours discussing pedigrees and what we like in a dog.

I have an entire dog and an entire bitch, both on mains register. I was given the 3rd degree and have 2 exceptionally well bred dogs (in my slightly biased opinion) that are perfect for me. Neither have been bred but may be in the future, but only after a lot of research and in consultation with their respective breeders. I know I'm not the average dog owner though....or so I keep getting told.

Edited December 31, 2012 by The Spotted Devil

[pebbles]

My first 'breeder' dog was a Rough Collie about 60 years ago, phoned the breeder, went and got the pup, no questions asked.

No limited reg back then and I showed him a few times. Wasn't the best specimen so I later got another Collie, same deal. This was followed by an Afghan, again no questions. By then I showing quite a bit and usually got dogs from other showies who knew me. I didn't question buyers of pups that much until one Affie I sold ended up in a bad home. Got pretty choosy after that. This was all quite a number of years ago before the DD's were flavour of the month. Glad I'm not breeding now.

[Bjelkier]

I'm not arguing that breeders aren't looking for the best homes for their pups/dogs Bjelkier - but I am querying whether those who sourced their first pedigreed dogs as novice owners ever felt that were looked upon with the same suspicion as they now look upon prospective pet owners.

I'm thinking that there looks to be a whole lot more distrust of the buying public now than there used to be many moons ago.

T.

Yes I do think I was. I was asked plenty of questions about our home/working life, our intentions with the dog, our current living conditions. Exactly the same things I ask my puppy people.

I got a main reg male and then went on to get a bitch.

I wasn't in the loop at the time, I didn't know anyone in the breed and I got the first dog I was after

[Bjelkier]

If you want a Staffy a GSD or Lab maybe a whippet all good but try going shopping for another breed especially if you are not in with the in crowd or its a new breed for you and you want a main register...worse if you want a female...

I've never had a problem.

When I was first interested in getting my own breed to show I contacted a Lapphund breeder and was offered a main reg male, pick of the litter. They were quite rare at the time. I'm after another rare breed now and I'm getting a main reg bitch.

[Gertrude139]

I drove 4 hours each way for my pedigree pup, twice. Would have gone twine that distance or more if I needed to.

I personally had never owned a dog before, as a family my parents and sister and I had raised 2 guide dog pups but that is all the experience I had with dogs.

I filled in a 3 page questionnaire, to me it didn't feel at all like they were suspicious of me, it felt like they wanted to make sure their pups had the best homes possible and to make sure the prospective owners new what they were in for. I think I actually probably gave more info then they were looking for because I was still trying to make sure I would be a good home and if someone more experienced than me thought that it wasn't right for me then I wanted to know.

For the amount of info I provided the breeders they must have given me 10x as much back. It isn't like thanks for your life story here you go have a pup, it is a 2 way street. I feel like if you can't be bothered to answer a few questions to get a pup how does anyone know you will be bothered to look after that pup to the best of your ability for its entire life.

I had no idea where to look at first. I think I literally googled Siberian Husky and went from there.

Club pages and gumtree/trading post were the first results and after reading about possible genetic conditions and temperament issues in dogs not bred properly I decided a pedigree was for me. I was curious as to whether any of the so called 'registered breeders' advertising on gumtree had done any eye and hip testing and sent a few emails asking if "all vet checks done" included them - surprise surprise not one response and most of the gumtree pups were advertised for more than I paid for my pedigree.

At the point where I decided I wanted a dog however, I never would have imagined I would get a pedigree. I'm not really sure why but I think it was that sort of unattainable mentality and a false perception that it would be way more expensive. It didn't take much investigation though to realise that it was not the case.

I did research on different breeders and had in mind a handful that I really liked, one of them put a puppy listing on DOL and I inquired and it all went well from there.

I also have a dog now which I got through rescue, I would not feel comfortable adopting straight from the pound. I don't feel guilted into it at all. I don't have any real reason why I would need a predictable dog, they are pets for me. I don't need to be able to trust them around stock or children as I don't have any so a rescue suits me fine. I have also received just as much support from the rescue as I have from the breeder.

And I think there is more distrust then there might have been in the past but sadly I think it has to be that way now. Unfortunately I feel sometimes and application form has to be geared towards being able to weed out the liars who will try to say what they think you want to hear as to deliberately deceive. If you have nothing to hide it shouldn't be a problem.

[tdierikx]

For the record, I haven't always had crosses - I've had pedigreed dogs as well, and even bred a registered litter before deciding that it wasn't really my thing. That was quite some time ago, and there wasn't as much emphasis on the stringent health testing in as many breeds as there is today. Everything is in constant evolution when it comes to those sorts of things I guess.

I was fussy about who I sold my pups to, but didn't put them through the Spanish Inquisition - my preference was to have a nice long informal chat while we all played with the dogs and pups. You can get a pretty good feel for how well someone is going to be owning one of your pups by seeing them interact with your dogs. I did knock back a few potentials as I didn't like how they came across, and my dogs were avoiding them like the plague - dogs are sometimes VERY good judges of people... *grin*

I do the same when people come to see our rescues - interaction with the dogs, and a seemingly informal chat while they interact with them... some get knocked back there too.

T.

[Sheridan]

Re the general public, their newspaper of choice in Victoria, had this to say yesterday. To get the full article without subscribing, put the article title in your search bar.

http://www.heraldsun...f-1226545103469

So yes, there is an issue, and that piece looks very much as if it were scripted by AA or a similar organisation. It even takes a swipe at the RSPCA.

--

MAHATMA Gandhi said "the greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated".

Leaving aside the more complex issue of how we treat our livestock, it's still difficult to determine if Australia is a progressive, humane society or one with a moral compass in urgent need of repair.

We have one of the highest rates of pet ownership

in the world and spend billions caring for our furry friends - but we also put down thousands of healthy cats and dogs every week.

This disturbing paradox is particularly conspicuous this time of year, when animal lovers happily pay more than $1000 for a designer puppy while unwanted cats and dogs sit on death row in shelters awaiting their cruel fate.

An estimated 250,000 cats and dogs are euthanased each year in Australia, a figure that should distress every civilised, thinking human being.

The problem isn't one of demand - 450,000 dogs and 165,000 cats are sold every year - the problem is the out-of-control supply through puppy mills, backyard breeders and irresponsible pet owners who refuse to desex their animals.

Regardless of how reputable breeders claim to be, their very existence contributes to an oversupply of animals, and the sad reality is that many do not behave ethically; keeping their breeding bitches in appalling conditions.

Pet stores and even shelters must also share the blame for the number of unwanted animals.

Australia's biggest animal shelter, the Lost Dogs' Home, kills many more dogs than it rehomes and as for cats the kill rate is often above 80 per cent.

Even the RSPCA, that much lovedorganisation charged with protecting the welfare of animals, has been criticised for its kill rate and temperament tests.

A behavioural assessment to determine whether an animal is suitable for adoption is done for every animal received at the shelter.

If an animal fails the test it will be destroyed.

It stands to reason that animals in a shelter would be anxious, "food guarding" and stressed by sudden loud noises. How many good-natured cats and dogs have been put down before ever getting the chance to be adopted?

There can also be a disconnect between the many animal rescue groups and authorities such as the RSPCA and council-run shelters.

They share the common goal of finding homes for as many animals as possible but appear to spend more time in dispute than in collaboration.

The Geelong Animal Welfare Society is an example of what can be accomplished when a shelter works with rescue groups and engages the community to reduce its kill rate.

GAWS has made significant changes to its operation in the past year and has reduced its kill rate to 10 per cent for dogs and 50 per cent for cats.

Without receiving any government funding the shelter has achieved the highest adoption rate in Victoria.

Progress also is being made on a legislative front.

Last year Victoria abolished the time limit rule that dictated animals had to be destroyed if they were not found homes within 28 days.

However, this has had little effect on the number of animals killed as there simply aren't enough people adopting animals from shelters.

People want a puppy, or are so fixated on a particular breed of cat or dog that they refuse to consider shelters when buying a pet.

The truth is that shelters have so many cats and dogs available for adoption that it's almost impossible not to find an ideal pet to suit your needs.

As consumers, we need to stop adding to the oversupply problem by patronising breeders and pet stores.

Head to the pound next time you want to add a cuddly cat or canine to your household.

You won't be disappointed.

I'll disagree with you in that this is a clear swipe at LDH more than anything. That it comes from the Hun is quite remarkable, given their support of LDH previously.

[Diva]

It reads like a media release from an AR group picked up as written by a lazy journalist. Increasingly media release of all sorts seem to get copied into the press with no critical thinking by the media.