Look What They Have Done To Our Dogs.

[MarieEvans]

There really are a lot of differences as people have been breeding out unlikable dog traits and breeding in the ones they like. It's a pity how some natural hunting breeds of dogs have gotten too much of a furry coat which makes it difficult for them to do something that they are genetically predisposed to do so.

[Bullbreedlover]

There really are a lot of differences as people have been breeding out unlikable dog traits and breeding in the ones they like. It's a pity how some natural hunting breeds of dogs have gotten too much of a furry coat which makes it difficult for them to do something that they are genetically predisposed to do so.

What breeds are you referring to exactly?

[WExtremeG]

Anyone keen on putting a more realistic video together? This one here wants to show the worst traits and not the average traits imo

[Crisovar]

There really are a lot of differences as people have been breeding out unlikable dog traits and breeding in the ones they like. It's a pity how some natural hunting breeds of dogs have gotten too much of a furry coat which makes it difficult for them to do something that they are genetically predisposed to do so.

Show coats are maintained to the nth degree to keep them at their best, if you put the same dog in the field it wouldn't have that same huge glamorous coat.

[Rebanne]

There really are a lot of differences as people have been breeding out unlikable dog traits and breeding in the ones they like. It's a pity how some natural hunting breeds of dogs have gotten too much of a furry coat which makes it difficult for them to do something that they are genetically predisposed to do so.

already covered this with the working dogs.

[WreckitWhippet]

There really are a lot of differences as people have been breeding out unlikable dog traits and breeding in the ones they like. It's a pity how some natural hunting breeds of dogs have gotten too much of a furry coat which makes it difficult for them to do something that they are genetically predisposed to do so.

Show coats are maintained to the nth degree to keep them at their best, if you put the same dog in the field it wouldn't have that same huge glamorous coat.

Yep, no sleeping on hessian beds, coats are often wrapped to protect them, washed and dried on a regular basis, groomed thoroughly to avoid tangles, in some cases no rough play.

There's a hell of a lot that goes into keeping a dog or bitch in coat and it doesn't take much for it to be gone, a few days of racing around and getting it caught in bushes and not groomed out properly will quickly see it disappear.

[kobblyness]

Perhaps they should have focused on the body changes and not the coats. There seems to be a lot of restrictions placed on show dogs to keep their coat in show condition.

[tdierikx]

You only have to look at some dogs in show condition/show coat to see that they actually seem to think they are the bees knees... strutting around and looking beautiful... they don't seem to mind that it may mean no rough play or running around in the dirt.

T.

[hortfurball]

The second post you made was the first one in this thread, why have you joined?

Ah, love a good conspiracy theory! Perhaps people lurk here and only feel compelled to join when the urge to contribute becomes too strong, such as in a topical and emotive thread like this one!

Anyone keen on putting a more realistic video together? This one here wants to show the worst traits and not the average traits imo

That's because nobody has a problem with the average traits, only the ones so extreme they have become ridiculous. I do wonder why everyone here gets so upset by these videos/threads that do not target your kennel, or even most of the time your breed. There are a whole lot of breeds that were not singled out, and some were praised. All the representative breeders involved in these should give yourselves a congratulatory pat on the back for having the dogs' best interests at heart and staying true to the standard.

In regards to coat, even I can see the hairspray and combing involved in the 'modern coats' in the video. I went to a couple of shows to see the danes and remember watching with some amusement the poodle people next door 'fouffing' their dogs' coats with hairspray and backcombing. Also, there is absolutely no evidence that the 1915 examples weren't clipped and that the full coats of today weren't prevalent back then. I think the biggest mistake in the video was to bother even mentioning coat.

[Skitch]

I dont really have an opinion on this.. but the lack of angulation in the 'bone mouth sharpei's' hind legs at 3:29 is a bit unsettling! Is that normal for a bone mouth sharpei??

[Are You Serious Jo]

But she started this thread, she didn't just join in. Why join a forum of purebred dog breeders with your first thread is about what "they" are doing to dogs. It's just another nail in the coffin.

[Crisovar]

The second post you made was the first one in this thread, why have you joined?

Ah, love a good conspiracy theory! Perhaps people lurk here and only feel compelled to join when the urge to contribute becomes too strong, such as in a topical and emotive thread like this one!

Anyone keen on putting a more realistic video together? This one here wants to show the worst traits and not the average traits imo

That's because nobody has a problem with the average traits, only the ones so extreme they have become ridiculous. I do wonder why everyone here gets so upset by these videos/threads that do not target your kennel, or even most of the time your breed. There are a whole lot of breeds that were not singled out, and some were praised. All the representative breeders involved in these should give yourselves a congratulatory pat on the back for having the dogs' best interests at heart and staying true to the standard.

In regards to coat, even I can see the hairspray and combing involved in the 'modern coats' in the video. I went to a couple of shows to see the danes and remember watching with some amusement the poodle people next door 'fouffing' their dogs' coats with hairspray and backcombing. Also, there is absolutely no evidence that the 1915 examples weren't clipped and that the full coats of today weren't prevalent back then. I think the biggest mistake in the video was to bother even mentioning coat.

Passionate dog people hate to see generalisations that tar a whole population with the same brush and give people the impression that all purebred dog breeds are damaged beyond repair. It is simply untrue.

[hortfurball]

But she started this thread, she didn't just join in. Why join a forum of purebred dog breeders with your first thread is about what "they" are doing to dogs. It's just another nail in the coffin.

Ok, I missed that, sorry, but comments like this don't seem designed to start anything:

Most show dogs are very good examples of the breed, better groomed and polished for a show but essentially the same as the working dogs, a few others have gone overboard, no animal rights or anything involved in telling the truth. No need for a shit fight either.

I'd say perhaps just a rather rash newbie. :) I did the same, came in guns blazing :laugh:

Passionate dog people hate to see generalisations that tar a whole population with the same brush and give people the impression that all purebred dog breeds are damaged beyond repair. It is simply untrue.

But do you not realise that by protesting so vigorously, it appears you are defending/condoning the very few who are not doing the right thing? The video, taken on its own merits, would not convince anyone that all purebred dog breeds are damaged beyond repair. It is actually relatively well balanced, if a little off track in some areas. The average reasonably intelligent person will see this. Those who are more easily led will see what they want to see, regardless, and will take all the outrage as confirmation of guilt across the board. If the purebred dog community acknowledged that not ALL breeders are perfect, but that most of you are doing the right thing, in my opinion it would be a much more effective way of promoting purebreeds. Just my two bobs worth.

[Jed]

Hotfurball

But do you not realise that by protesting so vigorously, it appears you are defending/condoning the very few who are not doing the right thing? The video, taken on its own merits, would not convince anyone that all purebred dog breeds are damaged beyond repair. It is actually relatively well balanced, if a little off track in some areas. The average reasonably intelligent person will see this. Those who are more easily led will see what they want to see, regardless, and will take all the outrage as confirmation of guilt across the board. If the purebred dog community acknowledged that not ALL breeders are perfect, but that most of you are doing the right thing, in my opinion it would be a much more effective way of promoting purebreeds. Just my two bobs worth.

Unfortunately, AR in it's many guises, is centred on promoting the demise of the dog, via any and all means, including supposed lack of health and inbreeding.

Most of the "dog" organisations, AKC, CKC, etc are defending the dogs, but breeders/fanciers also need to defend at grass roots level, which is what is happening here.

No one is defending the dodgy - we are refuting an overall view that all pedigree dogs as unsound, badly treated and being bred by careless and selfish breeders who care only for show wins, not dog welfare. And who are becomimg more unsound and used by the year.

Which is simply not true. But if WE don't spread the message, no one will.

[Rebanne]

But she started this thread, she didn't just join in. Why join a forum of purebred dog breeders with your first thread is about what "they" are doing to dogs. It's just another nail in the coffin.

OP joined in Sep 2011

[Crisovar]

But she started this thread, she didn't just join in. Why join a forum of purebred dog breeders with your first thread is about what "they" are doing to dogs. It's just another nail in the coffin.

Ok, I missed that, sorry, but comments like this don't seem designed to start anything:

Most show dogs are very good examples of the breed, better groomed and polished for a show but essentially the same as the working dogs, a few others have gone overboard, no animal rights or anything involved in telling the truth. No need for a shit fight either.

I'd say perhaps just a rather rash newbie. :) I did the same, came in guns blazing :laugh:

Passionate dog people hate to see generalisations that tar a whole population with the same brush and give people the impression that all purebred dog breeds are damaged beyond repair. It is simply untrue.

But do you not realise that by protesting so vigorously, it appears you are defending/condoning the very few who are not doing the right thing? The video, taken on its own merits, would not convince anyone that all purebred dog breeds are damaged beyond repair. It is actually relatively well balanced, if a little off track in some areas. The average reasonably intelligent person will see this. Those who are more easily led will see what they want to see, regardless, and will take all the outrage as confirmation of guilt across the board. If the purebred dog community acknowledged that not ALL breeders are perfect, but that most of you are doing the right thing, in my opinion it would be a much more effective way of promoting purebreeds. Just my two bobs worth.

Calling for a BALANCED view is not defending the bad breeders,If it appears that way to you then maybe you are the one seeing what you want to see. Most complaints made to controlling bodies about bad breeders are made by fellow Breeders. I don't know any Breeder among my circle that thinks we are all perfect, far from it.

[jr_inoz]

I dont really have an opinion on this.. but the lack of angulation in the 'bone mouth sharpei's' hind legs at 3:29 is a bit unsettling! Is that normal for a bone mouth sharpei??

the cropped ears on the bone-mouthed sharpei at 6:09 is the thing that unsettled me the most - or did noone else notice it?

[hortfurball]

Hotfurball

But do you not realise that by protesting so vigorously, it appears you are defending/condoning the very few who are not doing the right thing? The video, taken on its own merits, would not convince anyone that all purebred dog breeds are damaged beyond repair. It is actually relatively well balanced, if a little off track in some areas. The average reasonably intelligent person will see this. Those who are more easily led will see what they want to see, regardless, and will take all the outrage as confirmation of guilt across the board. If the purebred dog community acknowledged that not ALL breeders are perfect, but that most of you are doing the right thing, in my opinion it would be a much more effective way of promoting purebreeds. Just my two bobs worth.

Unfortunately, AR in it's many guises, is centred on promoting the demise of the dog, via any and all means, including supposed lack of health and inbreeding.

Most of the "dog" organisations, AKC, CKC, etc are defending the dogs, but breeders/fanciers also need to defend at grass roots level, which is what is happening here.

No one is defending the dodgy - we are refuting an overall view that all pedigree dogs as unsound, badly treated and being bred by careless and selfish breeders who care only for show wins, not dog welfare. And who are becomimg more unsound and used by the year.

Which is simply not true. But if WE don't spread the message, no one will.

I don't know what AR stands for so am missing the gist of your first sentence, but I'm not quite sure why any group would have an interest in the demise of the dog. Do they hate dogs? Or do they hate the idea of companion animals? Either way, surely it'll never take hold - too many dog/animal lovers in the world.

I think you missed my point a bit. I don't think you are defending the dodgy, just warning that it may appear that way to some if you're not careful how you (the collective) present your arguments. Sometimes I think it can do more harm than good. You need some very good spokespeople to represent the body of reputable breeders, whose message can't be misconstrued. The odd few who are doing the wrong thing are tarnishing the rest of you, there's no argument there, but is it not within the means of the governing bodies to stamp on this so that the reputation of breeders can rise to what it should be. If the AKC, CKC, KCGB, ANKC, FCI and UKC would unite and clarify the breed standard of those breeds targeted, or require judges to examine their decisions, then the whole debacle could be reversed within a few years of selective breeding, at least the easily visible aspects of it. Yeah, I know...in a perfect world...

But she started this thread, she didn't just join in. Why join a forum of purebred dog breeders with your first thread is about what "they" are doing to dogs. It's just another nail in the coffin.

OP joined in Sep 2011

On holidays and bored then :laugh:

[hortfurball]

Calling for a BALANCED view is not defending the bad breeders,If it appears that way to you then maybe you are the one seeing what you want to see. Most complaints made to controlling bodies about bad breeders are made by fellow Breeders. I don't know any Breeder among my circle that thinks we are all perfect, far from it.

Crisovar, none of my comments were aimed at you personally so please don't get personal back. There were comments that this sort of thread always dissolves into a shitfight. I'm simply wondering why, as it doesn't help when people get hot headed.

Those who call for a balanced view are those who should continue to speak up, for it is THEIR message that is helping rather than hindering. Those who can't post objectively when someone posts a video such as this are not helping ANYTHING.

[Crisovar]

Who is getting hot headed and personal :laugh: Maybe we just simply shouldn't respond then we could be accused of being apathetic instead of concerned and passionate. Of course Breeders will respond I don't understand how anyone can think they wouldn't.