Agility Tunnel

[kayla1]

I'm setting up a mini agility course for my younger dogs, just for fun at this stage, and we are starting with a tunnel. I've searched on here already, but could someone tell me please, is there a 'correct' way to teach the dogs how to use the tunnel? I don't want to teach them something 'incorrectly' only to have it affect them later on if I take them further. Thanks.

[Zug Zug]

OK I'm a bit of a novice but given you're still waiting on a response...

I have taught it to my dog by initially scrunching up the tunnel so it's quite short, but still making sure it's securely held and not moving around - so safely pegged or bagged into place.

Then get someone to hold your dog at the far end of the tunnel looking into it, and go to the other end and try to lure him through. At this stage he should be quite close to you. A lot of dogs are hesitant at this point - don't force them, just encourage them and reward every step towards and into the tunnel. If you're patient and have yummy rewards, pretty soon they'll usually walk through the short tunnel for the first time, and you can have a big party in their honour. This would probably be a happy, high energy kind of reward party, rather than a low key kind of treat which would be less rewarding for many dogs (but it does depend on your dog).

After they've gone through the first time, things often start to progress quite quickly.

So you might initially do this with the tunnel scrunched up to approx 4 feet long, but making sure the cloth isn't so scrunchy that it's blocking the tunnel too much (this is a bit of an art - you want a nice clear round opening for the dog to look into and run through). But keeping the tunnel straight, so the dog has clear line of site from one end to the opening at the other end.

Then you gradually make the tunnel a bit longer, piece by piece, until the dog is running through the whole tunnel.

You also need to teach them to enter the tunnel when you want them to (and not just whenever they feel like it) and from both sides of you (i.e. pointing them in there from your right side as well as your left side). Then you will gradually put a curve into the tunnel so they can see less and less daylight as they enter, but get used to running through it anyway. If you do this gradually, they should be comfortable - don't make the curve too sharp initially. Let them see some daylight for a while until they get the idea.

Don't progress too much until they are running happily through each time, at a pace you are happy with, then coming back to you at the far end for their reward. Then you start sending them from distances, from different angles etc.

My dog loves tunnels. My biggest task is getting him to think about other things when there are tunnels around. I gather this is a pretty common experience - dogs like him are called 'tunnel suckers' because as soon as he sees a tunnel it seems to suck him into it. So at this point the focus of his training is actually about getting him to run past tunnels without going in, focus on me around tunnels, stay calm when other dogs are running through tunnels (he can't do this yet but we're working on it), and then when he's being good he can run through a tunnel as his reward, which he considers to be incredibly awesome.

I hope that helps get things started (and some others pop in soon to add their experience and suggestions, because I'm really a beginner at this)

[kayla1]

Thanks Zug Zug, I appreciate the reply. :)

Re no responses, did I ask a silly question? Sorry if it was a silly question, I don't know much at all about agility.

Despite all the work I have done with Annie's recall training, I'm still not confident it is good enough to start agility classes. But I don't want her to miss out, which is why I'm setting up something that we can do outside of classes in a safe environment.

That info is really helpful, thank you. Do you use a verbal cue, like 'tunnel' or something else?

[megan_]

Not a silly question - lots of people are out trialling and training on the weekend.

FWIW, while recall is important, my belief is that if you need to recall your dog during agility then something is going wrong. Yet, it is the thing that most instructors harp on about! I'd focus on working on engagement and getting her wanting to work with you, even under distraction, then you'll never need to use that recall.

There are lots of games you can play to help build this (2 food game etc, just search this forum). Also look at the foundation stuff - this helps you both learn skills and build a good working relationship.

The other thing is to keep the rate of reinforcement very, very high. Greg Derret said something like a reward every 2 seconds when you're working on something. Most handlers are really stingy with rewards and so the dog lands up getting the same amount of rewards if they do the right thing vs doing the wrong thing. Throw away the food bowl and let her earn all her food working with you. This doesn't need to be 1 hr of training every day, just a few minutes. You'll have an eager, engaged dog that isn't interested in faffing around with other dogs when training.

Oh, and the tunnel, as Zug Zug says start with 2 people and a short tunnel. Call her through and praise. Then make it longer. However, unless it is a very good quality tunnel and it is 100% properly secured I'd leave it at that. Why? Because flimsy tunnels move around when dogs run in them, which means that they tend to run slower in them. You don't want to encourage that!

ETA: I sometimes use a verbal cue, but it it is in front of them then they should take it without me saying anything.

Edited November 26, 2012 by megan_

[kayla1]

Thanks for the reply megan, that's really helpful. :)

This is the tunnel I got here. I looked around online and some looked pretty flimsy, and I don't think they would have withstood Maxie, but this one seems like good quality and was cheaper than the one on the ADAA website. Although I totally forgot until I read Zug Zug's reply about something to secure it down with! I'll have to jump back on the website to see what there is.

Re speed through the tunnel, that's one of the things I was wondering about with how to start them off, but if the tunnel is secure then I guess their speed will improve as they become more confident, and then hopefully be able to enter the tunnel whilst running.

[megan_]

that is a good one - it is like the one they have in comps.

If you get some green bags from coles/woolies, tie the handles together (ie join 2 bags) and fill them with sand you can use these to stabilise the tunnel (like in the pic you linked to). A few of these would keep it nice and secure.

[kayla1]

Oh great idea, thanks!!

[Tumbleweed]

Re no responses, did I ask a silly question? Sorry if it was a silly question, I don't know much at all about agility.

The only thing that is a silly question - is NOT asking! Asking questions is the only way we learn :)

I totally agree with Zug Zug and Megan on this one - building confidence is really important and most dogs end up in LOVE with tunnels. If you use a collapsible tunnel (chute) you basically use the same process Zug Zug described, except hold the chute fabric up for the first few runs, then slowly let it touch the dog's back on the way out, then finally allow the dog to push through it. I did this recently with my young agility dog and within 10 minutes was really comfortable with it. Was worth doing it slowly for 10 minutes to create confidence instead of risking a dog being scared and then re-training.

In regard to securing your tunnel - there are two options. 1) Tunnel bags (as descirbed you can make them or buy them) or 2) tunnel snugglers (I got mine from airdogs.com.au) which you secure with tent pegs. I love the tunnel bags but the snugglers take up less room so choose what suits you best.

Good luck!

[kayla1]

Re no responses, did I ask a silly question? Sorry if it was a silly question, I don't know much at all about agility.

The only thing that is a silly question - is NOT asking! Asking questions is the only way we learn :)

I totally agree with Zug Zug and Megan on this one - building confidence is really important and most dogs end up in LOVE with tunnels. If you use a collapsible tunnel (chute) you basically use the same process Zug Zug described, except hold the chute fabric up for the first few runs, then slowly let it touch the dog's back on the way out, then finally allow the dog to push through it. I did this recently with my young agility dog and within 10 minutes was really comfortable with it. Was worth doing it slowly for 10 minutes to create confidence instead of risking a dog being scared and then re-training.

In regard to securing your tunnel - there are two options. 1) Tunnel bags (as descirbed you can make them or buy them) or 2) tunnel snugglers (I got mine from airdogs.com.au) which you secure with tent pegs. I love the tunnel bags but the snugglers take up less room so choose what suits you best.

Good luck!

Thanks Tumbleweed.

Yes definitely re confidence building, Annie has a fairly long recovery time when startled so the last thing I want is for her to be frightened of the tunnel. I really want to get it right from the outset.

I couldn't see the snugglers on air dogs, but that's ok because I'll try the bags first anyway. Thanks for the tips! :)

[Tumbleweed]

I couldn't see the snugglers on air dogs, but that's ok because I'll try the bags first anyway. Thanks for the tips! :)

Hmm, they refer to them on their tunnel page but they don't seem to have them listed to buy.

This is the reference for them on clean run is http://www.cleanrun.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=product.display&Product_ID=516&ParentCat=628

[kayla1]

I couldn't see the snugglers on air dogs, but that's ok because I'll try the bags first anyway. Thanks for the tips! :)

Hmm, they refer to them on their tunnel page but they don't seem to have them listed to buy.

This is the reference for them on clean run is http://www.cleanrun.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=product.display&Product_ID=516&ParentCat=628

Ah ok, I'll definitely keep them in mind. Thanks!

[Tassie]

I do tunnel stuff with the yellow tunnel like yours in puppy class at dog club (when I can get the tunnel) - did it Sunday. As has been said, scrunch it right up, make it secure, and then get a helper to do a restrained recall through the tunnel - I hold the pups and have the handler go to the other end - and if necessary alost crawl into the tunnel - luring with food. I ask them to have a big party as the dog comes out of the tunnel, and feed/play when the dog feet are on the grass.

Usually after a couple of goes, I get the handler to rund back down to the end of the tunnel calling the pup, as soon as they've given the pup to me - some of the pups were already beating the handler to the end :D

A couple of runs at the short length, and if that goes well, then gradually lengthen the tunnel - about 3/4 metre/1 metre at a time - still straight.

Caution! While it's heaps of fun and the dogs love it - be careful not to do too many at a time - or you'll create the dreaded tunnel suck.

megan_ had great advice. The key thing in agility is the foundation training - Greg Derrett describes agility as running with your dog - the obstacles are just that - speed bumps to be negotiated. I worry that people get so fixated on having their dogs play with the obstacles, that they're not prepared to put in the essential foundations, and the dogs will never be as good as they could be. People also are not prepared often to do the foundation jumping work, which creates an independent, thinking jumper.

There are some great foundation training dvds out there - Mary Ellen Barry - Foundation Fundamentsls, The Focussed Puppy, the Moe Strenfel one, Susan Garrett's 2x2 weaves, and the Susan Salo jumping ones - just to name a few of my favourites.

Not sure how young your dogs are, but they need to be about 12 months IMHO before they're doing much on the equipment, other than on the ground contact trainers.

I should have prefaced this by saying that I tend to be a bit super-cautious. I want my dogs competing and able to enjoy their agility for a long time - my BC girl is still competing well in Masters at 10 and 3/4. :D We've been lucky.

[kayla1]

Thanks Tassie! :)

Sorry, I say younger dogs out of habit because they are younger than my other dogs. Annie is actually about 5 1/2 yrs.

Thanks for those suggestions. I looked at some DVDs and books online and there are just so many of them, it's quite overwhelming!

What is the disadvantage of the tunnel suck, is the problem that you lose the dog's focus?

[Tassie]

Lol ..about the 5.5 year old youngster.

Tunnel suck is what agility competitors face when dogs have such high value and strong reward history for the tunnel that they will take it whenever they can, regardless of what ths handler is indicating :-). Some dogs have contact suck (mine ;-) .

[kayla1]

Lol ..about the 5.5 year old youngster.

Yeah...I don't know where all the years have gone. I'm sure she was young not that long ago. :laugh:

[The Spotted Devil]

Lol ..about the 5.5 year old youngster.

Tunnel suck is what agility competitors face when dogs have such high value and strong reward history for the tunnel that they will take it whenever they can, regardless of what ths handler is indicating :-). Some dogs have contact suck (mine ;-) .

Funny :laugh: In Em's early training she would blind cross me for the weaves!

I've been fortunate to have great foundation training for my dogs so they are now "handler sucks." The slightest hesitation or poorly timed cue on my part sends them off course. That's a lot of pressure :laugh:

[Tassie]

Lol ..about the 5.5 year old youngster.

Tunnel suck is what agility competitors face when dogs have such high value and strong reward history for the tunnel that they will take it whenever they can, regardless of what ths handler is indicating :-). Some dogs have contact suck (mine ;-) .

Funny :laugh: In Em's early training she would blind cross me for the weaves!

I've been fortunate to have great foundation training for my dogs so they are now "handler sucks." The slightest hesitation or poorly timed cue on my part sends them off course. That's a lot of pressure :laugh:

:laugh: TSD - Kirra used to be a real weave suck - now it's contacts :D . And I so know what you mean about the pressure. She's still hair trigger - a fraction early and she'll come off an obstacle and cop a refusl - or pull a bar - a fraction late and she'll off course, or drop a bar ..... and it's all my fault, bless her. And just to add to the pressure of her expectations, if I'm handling really poorly, she'll nip me to prompt me to get my act together. Love my little feral!