Parvo Story In Today's Smh

[Sandra777]

"Furthermore, 28% of vaccinated puppies still get the disease"

Huh? 28% of puppies with Parvo have been vaccinated is NOT the same as 28% of vaccinated puppies get Parvo

Scare tactics & sloppy.

not entirely, Ive always had my puppies vaccinated from 6 to 8 weeks, and the recommended 3 vaccinations, yet have still had 3 get parvo at around the 4 to 6 month mark. so it happens all right.

I don't think you're taking what I wrote in the way I meant it.

The article says at the beginning that 28% of pups with Parvo have been vaccinated. No idea if this is an accurate figure or not because one parvo shot at 6 weeks could well be reported as "puppy was vaccinated" when the reality is that no sensible person would have believed it to be immune on this basis. I would have no problems with accepting this statistic though because sometimes vaccination simply doesn't work whether this is because of the vaccine itself, maternal immunity, "wrong" strain, pup was already infected or whatever

At the end of the article it says that 28% of vaccinated puppies will get parvo which is a mis-representation of the original statistic.

28% of parvo cases are vaccinated is a totally different statistic to 28% of vaccinated pups will get Parvo. The latter suggests that if you vaccinate your pup you have 28% chance of it catching parvo which is what I was referring to as 'scare tactics'.

Edited November 28, 2012 by Sandra777

[Maddy]

Vaccine are not 100% effective in preventing diseases like Parvo, due to poor timing of vaccination or a faulty immune system some animals will not seroconvert and despite being vaccinated will have no immunity. What vaccination does best when high numbers of pets are vaccinated is create herd immunity, which mean large numbers of vaccinated individuals that provide like a a safety buffer slowing transmission of disease to the entire community. Whilst Parvo is always present when herd immunity is low we see the terrible outbreaks that put more and more animals at risk.

Put simply the more vaccinated animals in the population the better.

This.

who cares about percentages? your pet isnt a percentage to you.

If you don't vaccinate your dogs, that percentage will be much higher and rather than just being an unfortunate accident, their deaths will be entirely your own fault. It's bad enough losing a pet to a preventable disease, nevermind also carrying the extra guilt of knowing it was your fault.

Arguing that it didn't work once and therefore it doesn't work in general is just throwing the baby out with the bath water and refusing to listen to reason.

I never said that, I did say I have over the years lost 3. in each case was told it was sheer bad luck.

then this article states is approx 28 percent. at least knowing that would have been better than thinking how unlucky can you get losing 3.

helps put into perspective.

I always vaccinate , gee

As Sandra has pointed out..

28% of puppies with Parvo have been vaccinated is NOT the same as 28% of vaccinated puppies get Parvo

In your case, it was just bad luck.

[Brookestar]

All pounds have parvo, although they generally don't like to talk about it. What does happen is that puppies come into pounds, pick up parvo from the pound because it is so intransigent in the environment, stay their week or so, and go into rescue, at which point they get sick because the incubation period is 7-10 days. Even parvaccing at the point puppies come into the pound (which some of the good pounds do) doesn't protect them much, because they might have low immunity already due to poor nutrition/worm load, etc, or there hasn't been enough time for the vaccine to work.

It is parvo season now and many dogs arrive in pounds already sick. I wonder if there is a slump in euth rates during parvo season because so many young dogs die of it. Or maybe there is a rise as impounded dogs who are ill need to be put down due the suffering? I find parvo to be a bit of a no no topic in pounds and shelters. Nobody likes to answer questions about what happens to animals that come in infected.

Most pounds/shelters do now vaccinate dogs when they come into the shelter. They are also wormed, bathed, flea treated, etc. Vaccines take a minimum of 7-10 days to take effect, and they need at least 2 vaccines for them to be effective anyway, usually about 4 weeks apart. The ONLY thing that can kill parvo is bleach and most shelters/pounds do use bleach to clean on a regular basis and legislation usually requires them to be bleached at least every 7 days and when any animal is moved out of the pen.

It takes a week or more of intensive care, on drips and the like to have ANY chance of keeping a dog or puppy with parvo alive. There is no treatment for parvo, it is simply about keeping the dog alive, but when they cannot keep any food or water down then it has to be on drips, until the body is able to fight the infection itself. With a dog in bad condition, due to worm infestations, fleas, poor nutrition, etc, it becomes even more difficult. It costs thousands of dollars. And even with that, there is only a 50% chance of survival. Most of those that do survive will not live long lives and will be quite weak throughout life. Pounds and shelters do not have this type of money and yes, unfortunately most such dogs are going to be euthanised. It is the best chance they have of getting rid of the disease, and ensuring that other dogs are not infected as well. In many cases it is also the kindest thing to do, due to the amount of suffering the dog is in.

Parvo can transfer on anything at all. Walk on a footpath wherea dog with parvo has been in the last year and you will pick it up on your shoes and take it into your home. It is spread so easily and so rapidly. It stays for up to a year and the only thing that can erradicate it is bleach, and not everything can be bleached. Snow can freeze it over and enable it to survive for longer.

Most shelters/pounds do give out statistics on numbers of animals that were euthanised due to different reasons, health, temperament, etc.

[tarope]

So Dr Kelman blames the poor people for Parvo,I would have thought it was 1. Ignorance 2. people who just don't care.

We all know some people don't even vaccinate their kids, some peoples attitudes will never change.

[Aphra]

I'm not questioning your own experience but in the pounds I deal with only a tiny percentage vaccinate upon arrival and I've never had a pound deflea, worm or wash a dog.

Most pounds/shelters do now vaccinate dogs when they come into the shelter. They are also wormed, bathed, flea treated, etc.

[Rebanne]

Most pounds/shelters do now vaccinate dogs when they come into the shelter. They are also wormed, bathed, flea treated, etc. Vaccines take a minimum of 7-10 days to take effect, and they need at least 2 vaccines for them to be effective anyway, usually about 4 weeks apart. The ONLY thing that can kill parvo is bleach and most shelters/pounds do use bleach to clean on a regular basis and legislation usually requires them to be bleached at least every 7 days and when any animal is moved out of the pen.

you only need one C3 after 12 weeks of age. Then the dog is fully covered for the next 12 months.

[SnoPaws]

I had a 3 1/2 month old fully vaccinated (last vaccine was given exactly 2 weeks before the show) puppy contract Parvo at his first show.

Unfortunately it was one of those one in a million sheer bloody bad luck things.

Thankfully I had the best ever vet and breeder to support me but it took 24 hourly round the clock nursing at the vet for two weeks and then at home for another two weeks at home for him to survive. Then probably another 4ish months of nursing to get him to full health again. It was one of the worst things I have been through.

In my dogs case he most certainly isn't weak and I don't expect him to have a short life at all. Three and half months after contracting parvo he took his first Puppy In Show as a minor and now as a two year old he has taken multi class in shows, won a Royal bob and a rdcc at a speciality show. He is also is in training for his first 'performance' (shhh top secret) title...........but of course time will tell whether contracting parvo as a puppy has any long term effects.

It makes me sick when I see 8, 10 week old puppies at a show for socialisation before they are FULLY vaccinated, my two current puppies weren't allowed anywhere until they were almost 4 months, even now at the age of 6 months they have both only been to a handful of shows and both have been out only a couple of times. Call me paranoid! Their is plenty of time for them.

To say it only happens to ignorant people or those that don't care is very harsh.

Edited December 3, 2012 by SnoPaws

[Brookestar]

I had a 3 1/2 month old fully vaccinated (last vaccine was given exactly 2 weeks before the show) puppy contract Parvo at his first show.

Unfortunately it was one of those one in a million sheer bloody bad luck things.

It makes me sick when I see 8, 10 week old puppies at a show for socialisation before they are FULLY vaccinated, my two current puppies weren't allowed anywhere until they were almost 4 months, even now at the age of 6 months they have both only been to a handful of shows and both have been out only a couple of times. Call me paranoid! Their is plenty of time for them.

To say it only happens to ignorant people or those that don't care is very harsh.

No vaccine will ever be 100%. And like you said it is bloody bad luck.

I do take my dogs out before they are fully vaccinated, BUT I NEVER allow them near other dogs I do not know very well and which I do not know for sure are not fully vaccinated, and nor do I allow them where other dogs congregate, like parks, shows or the like.

Socialisation does not mean dragging a dog everywhere you can. It does mean creating very carefully planned incremental experiences, of short duration. A dog does not need to be a dog show for socialisation, and nor do they need to be at dog parks for it. I do believe in socialisation, but it does have to be very carefully managed. It also has to take into account what you want from the dog in the future. Most things can also be done after the second vaccination at about 12 weeks, which increases the level of coverage that the dog has.

[Sheridan]

Regardless of how canine parvovirus originated, it is well accepted that it is a man-made disease and it is the result of vaccination, either for canine distemper or FPV. This much is obvious because the outbreaks were sudden and massive and they first surfaced in countries that regularly vaccinated dogs and cats.

There's something wrong with this argument.

[Maddy]

Regardless of how canine parvovirus originated, it is well accepted that it is a man-made disease and it is the result of vaccination, either for canine distemper or FPV. This much is obvious because the outbreaks were sudden and massive and they first surfaced in countries that regularly vaccinated dogs and cats.

There's something wrong with this argument.

Just a bit.

Ebola virus was first seen in humans in 1976. HIV was first observed in 1981. And so on and so forth.

When a disease first appears, the results usually are very severe as the host has not had a chance to develop any natural resistance. Rabbit calicivirus is a good example- when first introduced to Australia, it killed a lot of wild rabbits. However, enough survived to develop resistances and so rabbit populations recovered. Ditto myxomatosis. The difference with dogs is that their populations and breeding are controlled by humans so dogs are vaccinated, rather than simply being left to live or die with the disease. If we were willing to suffer massive loses for a few decades, dogs would probably develop some resistance but we'd risk losing entire breeds in the process and there's still no guarantee of resistance sufficient to protect dogs from the disease. So, vaccination is the best option until we come up with something else (which probably won't be any time soon).

[Chocolatelover]

I read up a lot about this when I was working out when to vaccinate my pup. After losing two dogs very close together (not from parvo) I wasn't taking any chances. My vet swore that my pup only needed two vaccinations - the one at six weeks with the breeder and then another at twelve weeks. The company that supplied that vaccination was so confident of their protection that if a dog contracted parvo after following this schedule they would cover care costs.

I did a lot of reading and discovered that the timing of the vaccination is critical - the reasons being both maternal antibodies and maturity of the immune system. If a dog is only going to ever have one vaccination for parvo, it should be after 16 weeks of age as a very high percentage (can't remember exact figure) will seroconvert at this age compared to when given at twelve weeks or younger. For that reason I choose to do the three vaccinations with the third being after sixteen weeks of age. I later read a very sad story on here where a lady lost her young labrador and golden retriever pups to parvo - from memory they had received only the two vaccinations.

I think misinformation regarding vacccinations is a very dangerous thing. Vaccinations have saved more lives than any other medical procedure.

[Rainers]

I read up a lot about this when I was working out when to vaccinate my pup. After losing two dogs very close together (not from parvo) I wasn't taking any chances. My vet swore that my pup only needed two vaccinations - the one at six weeks with the breeder and then another at twelve weeks. The company that supplied that vaccination was so confident of their protection that if a dog contracted parvo after following this schedule they would cover care costs.

I did a lot of reading and discovered that the timing of the vaccination is critical - the reasons being both maternal antibodies and maturity of the immune system. If a dog is only going to ever have one vaccination for parvo, it should be after 16 weeks of age as a very high percentage (can't remember exact figure) will seroconvert at this age compared to when given at twelve weeks or younger. For that reason I choose to do the three vaccinations with the third being after sixteen weeks of age. I later read a very sad story on here where a lady lost her young labrador and golden retriever pups to parvo - from memory they had received only the two vaccinations.

I think misinformation regarding vacccinations is a very dangerous thing. Vaccinations have saved more lives than any other medical procedure.

I also did a lot of research as we used Nobivac on Noah and they were the ones who insisted that their vaccination would override maternal antibodies and so they'd only need two shots.

I had Noah titre tested 7 days after his vaccination and he had not seroconverted. I talked to Nobivac about it and they offered to pay for another titre test 14 days after the initial one, as they were

eager to see if it had worked. It did, but the key here is that the vaccination took the FULL 14 days to work, and previous to that he was completely vulnerable to the virus. I think so many people think a few days or a week is fine to take them out, but sometimes it takes longer than that.

[Horsegal98]

We lost a puppy to parvo earlier this year and it was heart breaking, and all the more so because if her first owner had vaccinated her, it wouldn't have happened.

Canine parvovirus first appeared in 1967, possibly as a mutation of feline parvovirus (feline distemper). It mutated and a new strain appeared in the late 70s which was highly infectious.

I was interested in the line in the article which says if proper vaccination is undertaken across the canine population we could eliminate parvo. Even distemper seems to be making something of a comeback in populations of dogs in poor areas.

I never knew anything about the history of parvovirus, thanks for sharing.