Amstaff Vs Sbt

[Teebs]

I would go a sbt... And only because they are the best dogs In the world :)

As for a dog park. You wouldn't see me near one, no matter what breed I owned

[chuckandsteve]

Id try staffordshire bull terrier rescue vic. If you get an adult you can be sure they are dog social and that rescue is fantastic.

Totally agree. My beautiful Cougar is from them & she is just so sweet & nice natured. About the weight, Cougar is an older lady & weighs 17kg, but I have put her on a diet, as I don't want to put strain on her legs by being overweight.

How do you go in VIC with the BSL and a rescue? Are they papered or have they passed some sort of "test"? Or are the council people able to come and knock on your door at any stage and take them?

(genuine question)

I rescue staffy xs, i havent actually been asked yet but i keep the release papers from the pound which is after the laws came in.

You can get a vet to testify the dog is not a pitt bull. But it really depends on the council. There are a few i wouldnt rehome to. My council just make me sign a form saying they are not a restricted breed when i register them. I dont think they have ever looked in the back yard as i have 3 dogs and the 3rd is registered to MIL as one is a foster so my small white fluffy is registered to her. The staffys i keep registered to me as it is life and death the registration is right.

[Salukifan]

Harley weights around 29kg, breed standard says between 28-40kg so I wouldn't call them small. They do make fantastic pets, so long as you keep up with training, exercise and socialisation. They aren't really for novice owners though, they need someone who is experienced with dogs which was a mistake I made.

Are you sure you don't mean pounds, not kilos? 40kg is a BIG dog!!!

[juice]

Owning any bull breed means you need to be able to read body language and act on it. I have seen many staffys in dog parks, and what Pav says is smack on, they play hard and rough and don't take well to being told off by other dogs.This can escalate very quickly.

I do take my BT girl to one as she loves to play, as long as no running is involved, boxing and slamming is her thing, and labs are good boxing buddies, however i am very aware that she will never start anything but would finish it, and have left whenever a rude dog continually mounts her.

Also i hear they are very good at destroying stuff if left along time, and the staffys i have fostered could bounce over a 6 ft fence if they wanted too. :laugh:

[Staffyluv]

I think it's totally over- generalising to say the staffys, amstaffs or bull breeds in general are not suitable for dog parks... Depends on the owner, depends on the individual dog, depends on the training and socialisation, depends on the park. Same as with absolutely any breed.

OP, I have no experience owning either breed and have met lovely and horrible examples of both, I think it comes down to personal choice, maybe start looking for breeders of both and see who you click with?

Whichever you go with you know a responsible registered ANKC breeder is essential because of the legislation, and either breed will respond really well to ongoing obedience training, from what I've seen they do much better with effective training, understanding and leadership from their humans.

I can tell you now that it's not an over generalisation and that anyone who is raising an SBT or an Amstaff should be doing so with caution. The SBT should be a gentleman unless set upon and the majority of SBT's will finish what someone else starts. Many dogs find the SBT to be rude and pushy in terms of the way they play and the SBT doesn't readily accept being told to bugger off by another dog.

The best piece of advice I can offer potential new owners, is to socialise your young pups with dogs of known temperament, not in a dog park free for all. Raise your SBT to focus on you and for you to be the best thing in the world. An SBT that is indifferent when it comes to other dogs and one that has a recall is the best and safest to live with.

That is spot on Pav..

I used to let Zig have free reign at the dog park - now he stays on lead, to continue his socialisation (unless there is no one there, then he is off lead and chasing a ball or the regular crew he plays with are there).. Although we were on our own in one section of park yesterday, when some people turned up with a 6 month old stafford pup and she had a ball playing with Zig..

When some others turned up with littlies, we left as we were in their section of park..

Lots of dogs find issue with staffys and the way they play.

[Guest Willow]

I never take my Staffy boy to the dog park...like others have said, he hasn't started anything before (not to say he never would) but he vertainly won't back down if another dog pushes the point. Only with big dogs though.....I have seen him with a JRT hanging off his ear, while he stood patiently and waited for me to remove it. He is very gentle and appropriate with pups, and was an "uncle" to many a foster pup, but if the dog is bigger than him and challenges him, he takes them up on it.

[Purdie]

My neighbours Stafford is an escape artist and was climbing trees and fences to escape when they went to work.They tied him up and he cried all day.They now leave him in when they are at work .I don't like dog parks and i wouldn't let a bull breed or most Terriers off lead let alone around strange dogs.If you are very keen to have a dog off lead in a dog park then consider a breed that is noted for being friendly with other dogs and train to good recall.

[kima]

I have a Stafford (English) and we do go to the off lead park. However he has very good recall and we call him back whenever we see another dog because he does tend to be a bit over enthusiastic and this can be a bit much for some dogs! I think it does depend on the individual dog though, Marlo has been surrounded by dogs since he was 3 months old. If another dog barks or growls at him he will drop and roll or run and hide. He's my big sook.

[chuckandsteve]

I think if dog friendly is really important, id be getting an adult. With any breed you just cant know. And as mentioned stafford rescue vic are great and from them some are papered if thats important too

[ellz]

I have absolutely no illusions that I COULD take my adult male Stafford to a dog park. However, there is no way that I actually WOULD do so!! The problem doesn't lie with my dog, it is the other dogs, or more particularly their owners, that are the issue.

You only need to trawl through the posts here to read about the problems that DOL owners have had with other people and their dogs at dog parks. Why would you subject your dog to it??

[Salukifan]

I think it's totally over- generalising to say the staffys, amstaffs or bull breeds in general are not suitable for dog parks... Depends on the owner, depends on the individual dog, depends on the training and socialisation, depends on the park. Same as with absolutely any breed.

No, not the same as any breed. Statistically, dogs of fighting origin ARE going to be more combative than many breeds developed for other purposes. Dog aggression is something that they have a lower trigger for and if it's on then they'll finish it, ice it and put the little sprinkles on a dog fight. They are also very powerful animals. That DOES NOT make them "bad dogs" - just dogs that need to be managed differently from some other breeds and no amount of training and socialisation will change their hard wiring.

You do see bull breeds that are amiable, social butterflies but I'd never make that assumption about one.

Personally I think ignorance of key breed characteristics creates issues for quite a few breeds. That's what happens when bred by people who neither understand the breed, nor bother to sell them to people that they've vetted thoroughly to ensure that they understand what they're buying.

Don't even get me started on what can happen when you combine different breeds into a very unpredictable and sometimes quite dangerous cocktail of characteristics

Edited November 5, 2012 by Haredown Whippets

[jamie231]

thanks everybody for all the info,

if i can just slightly steer the discussion back towards the original post (not to be rude!!)

I have also had boxers suggested as a breed that would suit me, i like the look of them but have no experience at all with them, can anybody comment?

just to re-iterate the main purposes of this dog;

1- a loyal companion for me, 27yo male, no kids or wife, but i do live with two other guys.

2- daily running/walking partner, happy to keep on leash and would like to go to the nearby park but i can go later in the evening when it is less busy if this is an issue.

3- needs to be able to remain content during the day with him/herself while I'm at uni or work

4- looking at either SBT/american staff/boxer as I like the temperaments of these dogs and prefer the 'bull' type breeds.

5-very happy to assert dominance over a male dog, unsure if i would suit a male or female better (have never owned a female dog before unsure of their differences in temperament??)

thanks again team,

jamie

[Salukifan]

I wouldn't describe Boxer temperament as being like the other two breeds.

What sort of temperament DO you like in a dog - can you describe it?

[Simply Grand]

I think it's totally over- generalising to say the staffys, amstaffs or bull breeds in general are not suitable for dog parks... Depends on the owner, depends on the individual dog, depends on the training and socialisation, depends on the park. Same as with absolutely any breed.

Just wanted to highlight that part of my previous post, seeing as the surrounding sentences have been commented on.

[Aidan3]

I walk daily along an off-leash beach, which is different to an off-leash dog park, but there are similarities. There are several regular SBTs, a couple of AmStaffs, even a Johnson Bulldog (whose owner is very selective about which dogs he plays with). The range of social behaviours varies amongst them but all of these dogs fit in well and I've never seen any trouble. Some of them show excellent self-handicapping and will immediately display cut-off signals if the other dog is getting a bit OTT or shows signs of feeling overwhelmed. Others are a bit rough, but harmless and they pick their play-mates well.

A more "typical" bull breed will front up to a bit of conflict, or might even escalate play to elicit a bit of conflict. So while you can find some highly sociable and more conflict-avoidant bullies, you wouldn't place bets on a pup turning out that way.

[ellz]

I think it's totally over- generalising to say the staffys, amstaffs or bull breeds in general are not suitable for dog parks... Depends on the owner, depends on the individual dog, depends on the training and socialisation, depends on the park. Same as with absolutely any breed.

Just wanted to highlight that part of my previous post, seeing as the surrounding sentences have been commented on.

And I just wanted to reiterate, 99.9% of responsible Stafford owners do not subject their dogs to the free-for-all that is the average local dog park. It simply isn't worth the angst.

And no, it isn't the same as with absolutely any breed. When you own a bull breed, you take on a particular set of responsibilities. Some of these are not placing your dog in a situation that could endanger it, you or those around you. End of story.

[Animal House]

I think a boxer would be better suited if you want to take it to the dog park....I don't like dog parks for all the reasons mentioned, but if you definitely want to do it, a Stafford or Amstaff isn't for you.

As I said before, a male would be better suited, because bitches can be just that.

[Clyde]

Bit hard at short notice LOL

He looks great! How much does he weigh there?

[Aidan3]

5-very happy to assert dominance over a male dog, unsure if i would suit a male or female better (have never owned a female dog before unsure of their differences in temperament??)

Hardly any, and it depends a bit on what you mean by "happy to assert dominance over a male dog"? My old bitch would have had you up against the wall if you'd tried a dominance down on her or something like that :laugh:

It's important to recognise the difference between "asserting dominance" and "earning respect". The latter is done by being consistent, trust-worthy, and using your brain to solve problems with respect for the dog also. The former is something people do when they haven't learned how to form a working relationship with a dog and just want it "back in it's box". No matter which breed you end up with, taking a bit of time to learn how to build that working relationship through reward, consistency, and understanding is well worth your while. Whether you get a male or a female, or a SBT or a boxer, it doesn't really matter.

[ellz]

Whether you get a male or a female, or a SBT or a boxer, it doesn't really matter.

Could I just interject here as a breeder/owner of Staffords and say that I would always recommend a male Stafford over a female as a pet.....whether I've been unlucky or something else, I don't know...but I've always found the males to be a lot more tractable and easily dealt with.

As has been mentioned in this thread, I too believe that the word "bitch" was coined for a female Stafford!!!