mixeduppup Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 (edited) A dog does have to have a predisposition toward aggression in the first place though. Yes, I agree that it's the people's fault, but the dogs are the monsters of their breed because they have been mismanaged/bred and/or raised by people to be just that. However, the dog has to naturally have a propensity toward aggressive behaviour when left to its own devices, many breeds would not do this if raised in the same or similar circumstances. I believe it's the lines of dogs of this particular group being bred now, temperament is being replaced by looks and I blame this solely on proper APBT breeders (who know the breed and what they're doing) being banned. BSL is only helping to create unstable dogs being bred underground and sold to people who have no idea how to raise a badly bred bull breed. This could all be avoided if BSL were abolished and proper breeders brought back in. Edited October 31, 2012 by mixeduppup Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salukifan Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 A dog does have to have a predisposition toward aggression in the first place though. Yes, I agree that it's the people's fault, but the dogs are the monsters of their breed because they have been mismanaged/bred and/or raised by people to be just that. However, the dog has to naturally have a propensity toward aggressive behaviour when left to its own devices, many breeds would not do this if raised in the same or similar circumstances. I believe it's the lines of dogs of this particular group being bred now, temperament is being replaced by looks and I blame this solely on proper APBT breeders (who know the breed and what they're doing) being banned. BSL is only helping to create unstable dogs being bred underground and sold to people who have no idea how to raise a badly bred bull breed. This could all be avoided if BSL were abolished and proper breeders brought back in. Don't know how you figure this will solve the issue. "Proper" APBT breeders bred dog aggressive dogs - indeed, they didn't see it as an issue and said as much in their BSL submissions. I see a lot of assumptions about these dogs being mistreated, poorly managed or raised to be aggressive. I don't see a shred of evidence that would support any of those assumptions. The only thing we know for sure is that these dogs escaped their yard and attacked another dog, maiming its owner in the process. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mixeduppup Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 Dog aggression should never turn in HA which is what this did. Even in a game pitbull that is a huge no no Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salukifan Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 (edited) Dog aggression should never turn in HA which is what this did. Even in a game pitbull that is a huge no no You don't even know there WAS HA. Many people get themselves injured intervening in dog aggression incidents by getting their bodies in their dogs teeth. No aggression may have been intended. We simply don't know. Edited October 31, 2012 by Haredown Whippets Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dame Aussie Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 Dog aggression should never turn in HA which is what this did. Even in a game pitbull that is a huge no no You don't even know there WAS HA. Many people get themselves injured intervening in dog aggression incidents by getting their bodies in their dogs teeth. No aggression may have been intended. We simply don't know. Yeah this is very true, It's quite easy to get bitten when intervening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mixeduppup Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 He wasn't bitten, he was mauled from the legs up and then had his ear ripped off. I consider that HA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LisaCC Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 Just saw the ads on tv, 6:30 tonight on Channel Seven Sydney news, they are interviewing the boy who was attacked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cosmolo Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 The predisposition for dog aggression needs to be addressed and carefully managed by responsible owners. Part of the problem is people (and by people i mean owners, breeders, the dog owning public) believing that dog to dog aggression is a minor issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salukifan Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 (edited) He wasn't bitten, he was mauled from the legs up and then had his ear ripped off. I consider that HA. Not bitten? Did they maul him with their paws?? Unless you've seen the injury report and eye witness reports, how can you categorically state that these injuries cannot be explained by someone being bitten protecting their dog? How's this for a scenario. Legs injured by dogs biting boy while he held the dog and then once he was on the ground, the ear was bitten in a similar manner. All you have to be is between a dog and it's intended target. I'm not ruling out HA or transferred aggression but the fact is we simply don't know what the dogs' motivation was and frankly I don't really think it matters all that much. Fact is you cannot label these dogs as monsters and it's actually not very helpful at all. The moment you do it, you can differentiate these dogs from your average suburban dogs - and that's not a good move at all. Edited October 31, 2012 by Haredown Whippets Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salukifan Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 (edited) The predisposition for dog aggression needs to be addressed and carefully managed by responsible owners. Part of the problem is people (and by people i mean owners, breeders, the dog owning public) believing that dog to dog aggression is a minor issue. Or that only "monster" or poorly raised or abused dogs demonstrate it. Nice owners who carefully raise and train their pups can STILL have aggressive dogs and folk who don't believe that are completely underestimating the importance of genetics in dog temperament. Edited October 31, 2012 by Haredown Whippets Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raz Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 He wasn't bitten He wasnt bitten? What ripped his ear off then - a faery wand? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mixeduppup Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 I can label these dogs monsters and I have done so. As far as I'm concerned they are monsters of their breed whether human created or genetically predisposed. Yes the human created them and it is their fault but they are monsters regardless because of what they have done. If I can call nice dogs "cuddle bunnies" then I can call crappy dogs "monsters". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mixeduppup Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 He wasn't bitten He wasnt bitten? What ripped his ear off then - a faery wand? I mean bitten as in singular bite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 He wasn't bitten He wasnt bitten? What ripped his ear off then - a faery wand? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mantis Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 Dog aggression should never turn in HA which is what this did. Even in a game pitbull that is a huge no no You don't even know there WAS HA. Many people get themselves injured intervening in dog aggression incidents by getting their bodies in their dogs teeth. No aggression may have been intended. We simply don't know. Yeah this is very true, It's quite easy to get bitten when intervening. Exactly, when an offload GSD attacked my dog,, while I was making sure that he only held the dog down & not hurt it, the GSD took a chunk out of my calf, I ended up in hospital, requiring 27 stitches. What really irked me, the idiot owner rang the council the next day, saying I shouldn't have a dog like that out in public. The ranger who knew my boy told her it was her fault & if I wanted to make a complaint, she could be fined & her dog PTS. Naturally I didn't, because I didn't want the poor dog to suffer because of the idiot owner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 How's this for a scenario. Legs injured by dogs biting boy while he held the dog and then once he was on the ground, the ear was bitten in a similar manner. All you have to be is between a dog and it's intended target. <b><br style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: verdana, tahoma, arial, sans-serif; line-height: 17.600000381469727px; background-color: rgb(238, 242, 247); "></b><br style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: verdana, tahoma, arial, sans-serif; line-height: 17.600000381469727px; background-color: rgb(238, 242, 247); ">I'm not ruling out HA or transferred aggression but the fact is we simply don't know what the dogs' motivation was and frankly I don't really think it matters all that much. Fact is you cannot label these dogs as monsters and it's actually not very helpful at all. The moment you do it, you can differentiate these dogs from your average suburban dogs - and that's not a good move at all. *looks at scars on hand and arm from being careless and getting in the way of a fight , with two dogs who went on to be guide dogs.* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Purdie Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 ''shouldn't own a dog like that'' I've heard that before.Out walking my Bully x when a man with a big black dog comes around the corner.His dog starts barking and lungeing and nearly pulls the guy over.I take my dog onto the grass and turn her away from the dog .Man stands there with dog still barking untill my dog gets fed up and wants to bark back i hold her and keep her away.The man makes no attempt to correct his still lungeing dog.Instead he abuses me for ''having a dog like that''. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mantis Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 ''shouldn't own a dog like that'' I've heard that before.Out walking my Bully x when a man with a big black dog comes around the corner.His dog starts barking and lungeing and nearly pulls the guy over.I take my dog onto the grass and turn her away from the dog .Man stands there with dog still barking untill my dog gets fed up and wants to bark back i hold her and keep her away.The man makes no attempt to correct his still lungeing dog.Instead he abuses me for ''having a dog like that''. It's because our dogs are "monsters" apparently & all other dogs are innocent "angels". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LizT Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 The predisposition for dog aggression needs to be addressed and carefully managed by responsible owners. Part of the problem is people (and by people i mean owners, breeders, the dog owning public) believing that dog to dog aggression is a minor issue. Or that only "monster" or poorly raised or abused dogs demonstrate it. Nice owners who carefully raise and train their pups can STILL have aggressive dogs and folk who don't believe that are completely underestimating the importance of genetics in dog temperament. Sometimes that scenario is the BIGGER problem. So many people could not imagine their nice friendly dogs could display any type of aggression under any circumstances. Comes as a serious shock when things go awry. Really, the bottom line is WE ALL should expect that they can and be prepared to intervene and prevent as appropriate with a FULL understanding of the consequences. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aussielover Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 Even very well trained and supposedly well bred dogs get involved in dog fights. It is sometimes just what dogs do, no matter how well trained they are. I've seen a few cases of service dogs (customs, police and guide dog labradors- a breed which people generally seem to think have lower incidences of DA) getting into fights and their handlers being bitten trying to separate them. However, being bitten multiple times and having an ear ripped off, is not simply getting in between 2 fighting dogs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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