Dog Facing Death After Defending His Owner

[BlackJaq]

Did you read both articles?

[Little Gifts]

You know what the reality is though if my SBT was unrestrained in my car and any of my windows were down far enough and she spotted me getting harrassed and acting distressed I know she would come to my defence. The difference is she has not already been declared dangerous, would not be unrestrained in my car, the windows would not be far enough down for her to get out and I would not be placing myself in harm's way - I'd take the rego number and report it to the police.

A lot of little things led to this dog now paying the price for human's bad behaviours.

[Aidan3]

You know what the reality is though if my SBT was unrestrained in my car and any of my windows were down far enough and she spotted me getting harrassed and acting distressed I know she would come to my defence.

Probably wouldn't have put the guy in hospital either. Our old GSD rushed to our defence more than once, and not a single person was ever hurt.

[biglib]

This wasn't on the owners property - you cant justify having a dog capable of that off leash and able to make a decision [ crap] on what IT feels is a threat or provacation to its owner. The owner should have had it restrained and is responsible now for the dog being punished because of his lack of responsibility. We cant all just walk around the street with unrestrained dogs allowing them to decide if we are under threat or not .

Of course not, there is no defence in this case, owner is totally at fault in the circumstances.

Fair enough, but in most areas if a dog even bites a person it's in a hell of a lot of trouble and if it attacks then it's pretty much done for due to law

Not necessarily are dogs in trouble biting someone, they can in certain circumstances, but the problem in most cases is that people don't know how to defend their case properly unfortunately.

Several years ago in a small nsw country town i was sat in a ute with my blue heeler in middle (partner had popped into shop)the lights of vehicle were accidently on, a policeman walked past drivers side & told me lights were on as he put his hand thru open window to turn them off as he did the dog bit him & also tore his sleeve, i was panick stricken, the officer actually said it was his fault & he should have known better ,the dog was defending his property.

[Mrs Rusty Bucket]

My brother once told me not to put my hand into the back of the ute when his dog was there. A bit late now to tell me - I say - as he comes around the corner, to see his dog all blissed out having an ear rub from me. I think I could have taken anything I wanted including the dog.

[m-sass]

A lot of little things led to this dog now paying the price for human's bad behaviours.

I don't see much hope in this owner and dog defending the charge successfully. A declared dangerous dog should be muzzled in a public place inhibiting a bite and if it jumped through a window onto the street, it was at large, not under effective control at the time of the attack. There are two regulation breaches on the owner's part to begin with before we get to the bite it's self. Ideally, a dog needs to be on leash in a public place or in it's own yard/vehicle to bite someone and get away with it in specific circumstances.

[m-sass]

You know what the reality is though if my SBT was unrestrained in my car and any of my windows were down far enough and she spotted me getting harrassed and acting distressed I know she would come to my defence.

Probably wouldn't have put the guy in hospital either. Our old GSD rushed to our defence more than once, and not a single person was ever hurt.

And the training on your dog was pretty good too I imagine :D

[skelp2]

Did you read both articles?

Yes, I did.

[Tralee]

A lot of little things led to this dog now paying the price for human's bad behaviours.

I don't see much hope in this owner and dog defending the charge successfully.

A declared dangerous dog should be muzzled in a public place inhibiting a bite and if it jumped through a window onto the street, it was at large, not under effective control at the time of the attack.

There are two regulation breaches on the owner's part to begin with before we get to the bite it's self.

Ideally, a dog needs to be on leash in a public place or in it's own yard/vehicle to bite someone and get away with it in specific circumstances.

Exactly!

I think it should also have been marked with a clearly visible red and yellow collar.

What the owner of the dog has failed to realise is that the dog needed to be protected, particularly since the dog was clearly under restricted ownership criteria.

Some people must think 'mother nature' can do it all herself.

Maybe once upon a time, but not since Adam bit the apple.

[megan_]

But we still don't know if the dog was declared dangerous, before or after the incident. The owner said it was out of character for the dog, so I have my doubts it was before the incident.

It's okay for a dog to put someone in hospital because the owner is having a screaming match with someone? That sounds like a very unstable temperament. Good guard dogs don't attack at the slightest indication of a threat. They have solid nerves.

This fool of an owner gives all of us a bad name...

[Odin-Genie]

I would put my own dog down if it viciously attacked someone that hadn't laid a violent hand on me.

People should be able to have heated conversations and be angry without a dog jumping through a car window to attack them.

This dog should have been under way more control and is paying for its owner's foolishness.

PTS is a last resort, whatever the circumstances.

I've made that mistake once and I won't be doing it again.

Best you don't raise your voice in anger to someonme with a Maremma in tow.

I have seen it often enough, heard similar stories from others, and appraise all potential puppy owners of the fact.

As I said, its best to have a witness

If my maremma was already on paper as a dangerous dog and then he jumped through the window and viciously attacked someone because they were annoyed with me, he'd be pts. He's protected me on a number of occasions but not once has he gotten physical. Also I did say viciously attack which is what the dog did, I don't consider a bite or two a vicious attack but the dog mauled this person by the sound of it. Its overreaction is scary and the dog should be put down.

Not talking about this particular incident. But if a dog jumps out of a car and attacks someone, whose fault is that? Why is killing the dog the first reaction? Why isn't anyone saying "if my dog jumps out of the car and attacks someone, I should go to prison"!!!

A dog is not responsible for managing itself. We are.

I will never ever automatically PTS my dogs unless they were in severe pain that could not be treated. I would go to any lengths to save my dogs. They are part of my family. But because I care for them so much, I would also go to extremes to ensure they are never put in a position where they could be harmed (including by harming others).

Even if the dog in this story is PTS, the owner should have to spend some time in prison as well. Too often dogs pay the price for their owners' stupidity.

[raineth]

Unfortunately, from the limited information given, I do think the dog should be pts.

The owner has proven to be incapable of managing the dog (judging from the fact the dog had already been declared dangerous even before this incident). The dog may be able to be rehabilitated... but you would need a person with the right skill-set willing to do that, and what are the chances of that? Ultimately aggressive dogs, especially those who have put someone in hospital cannot be ethically rehomed.

Ofcourse the owner is at fault in this, but that doesn't change the fact that there are very few options for this dog that would result in him not being a danger to people.

[Steve]

But we still don't know if the dog was declared dangerous, before or after the incident. The owner said it was out of character for the dog, so I have my doubts it was before the incident.

It's okay for a dog to put someone in hospital because the owner is having a screaming match with someone? That sounds like a very unstable temperament. Good guard dogs don't attack at the slightest indication of a threat. They have solid nerves.

This fool of an owner gives all of us a bad name...

Yep that's my position. Whether it as already declared or not you cant just have dogs on the street who decide for themselves when to attack someone. It is unacceptable.

[Little Gifts]

You know what the reality is though if my SBT was unrestrained in my car and any of my windows were down far enough and she spotted me getting harrassed and acting distressed I know she would come to my defence.

Probably wouldn't have put the guy in hospital either. Our old GSD rushed to our defence more than once, and not a single person was ever hurt.

Exactly Aidan, she'd be beside or in front of me growling and letting the other person know to back off, while looking to me for further guidance on what to do. If the dog attacked on it's own accord then what was the owner doing to encourage or discourage it?

I experienced a home invasion of three men back in 2000 and my SBT's then (now passed) chased the men out of windows and the front door (which was left open) then immediately ran back to protect me and stayed by my side while I ran out the back to call the police. They hadn't been trained in any way and were fast asleep until they heard the untruders, but once they had them out of the house the dogs only concern was me. They did not feel the need to run after the intruders out the front door or hunt them down and attack them. And as far as I know with trained guard dogs (an ex BIL had 2 for his security business) their job is to find and restrain until their handler gets there to take over, but not to chomp and chew. There might be some bite marks during the restraining process (particularly if weapons are involved and the dogs are threatened themselves) but they aren't aiming to expose body organs or lose a person a limb.

Edited October 29, 2012 by Puppy_Sniffer

[Tralee]

But because I care for them so much,

I would also go to extremes to ensure they are never put in a position where they could be harmed

(including by harming others).

Halleluiah!

Finally, someone gets the point behind the story.

It is such a simple concept but obviously too hard to grasp for many people.

Edited October 29, 2012 by Tralee

[m-sass]

=

'Tralee' timestamp='1351454961' post='6002218']

Exactly!

I think it should also have been marked with a clearly visible red and yellow collar.

What the owner of the dog has failed to realise is that the dog needed to be protected, particularly since the dog was clearly under restricted ownership criteria.

Some people must think 'mother nature' can do it all herself.

Maybe once upon a time, but not since Adam bit the apple.

Correct. From what I understand from most of the legislation, a declared dog cannot bite anyone full stop and at all costs the owners of such a dog must protect their declared dog from further incident. Ironically in many duristictions, a protection trained dog if the council are aware of it are declared dangerous also which renders them useless unless they are licenced guard dogs of generally commercial property.

[m-sass]

But we still don't know if the dog was declared dangerous, before or after the incident. The owner said it was out of character for the dog, so I have my doubts it was before the incident.

It's okay for a dog to put someone in hospital because the owner is having a screaming match with someone? That sounds like a very unstable temperament. Good guard dogs don't attack at the slightest indication of a threat. They have solid nerves.

This fool of an owner gives all of us a bad name...

You reckon , most guard dogs of property I know of will bite everyone except their owners, patrol dogs working with a handler are a different story.

A dog is not responsible for managing itself. We are.

No it's not, but the consequence is often PTS for a bite which makes us as owners obligated to provide safe management especially with a dog that can get a bit hostile and flex some muscle.

Edited October 29, 2012 by m-sass

[m-sass]

You know what the reality is though if my SBT was unrestrained in my car and any of my windows were down far enough and she spotted me getting harrassed and acting distressed I know she would come to my defence.

Probably wouldn't have put the guy in hospital either. Our old GSD rushed to our defence more than once, and not a single person was ever hurt.

Exactly Aidan, she'd be beside or in front of me growling and letting the other person know to back off, while looking to me for further guidance on what to do. If the dog attacked on it's own accord then what was the owner doing to encourage or discourage it?

I experienced a home invasion of three men back in 2000 and my SBT's then (now passed) chased the men out of windows and the front door (which was left open) then immediately ran back to protect me and stayed by my side while I ran out the back to call the police. They hadn't been trained in any way and were fast asleep until they heard the untruders, but once they had them out of the house the dogs only concern was me. They did not feel the need to run after the intruders out the front door or hunt them down and attack them. And as far as I know with trained guard dogs (an ex BIL had 2 for his security business) their job is to find and restrain until their handler gets there to take over, but not to chomp and chew. There might be some bite marks during the restraining process (particularly if weapons are involved and the dogs are threatened themselves) but they aren't aiming to expose body organs or lose a person a limb.

This sort of thing can happen and has happened with many people, but more than likely the offenders were scared of the dogs and ran off which is a good thing, dog's did their job, but seriously, I wouldn't rely on untrained dogs for protection if the offenders come back at the dog, that's when they are likely to fall off the plate. Dogs that will protect for real without training are usually stranger aggressive by nature with high levels of defence drive. A few years ago now we knew of a dog that protected it's owner from a home invasion and was hit with a baseball bat and the dog kept on and did some damage to the intruder who was consequenty arrested by police, but the dog was nasty with strangers in the house by nature and if we visited this lady, she always had to lock the dog away for the visitors safety. It was probably the most stranger aggressive dog I have seen which had it's own set of management issues as a pet with the substantial side effects of owning a dog that genuinely protected untrained.

Edited October 29, 2012 by m-sass

[Steve]

there is a difference between a dog defending its turf and its people on its territory to jumping out a car window and attacking people willy nilly when it decides it should.

[minimax]

there is a difference between a dog defending its turf and its people on its territory to jumping out a car window and attacking people willy nilly when it decides it should.

Aren't dogs meant to be restrained when they are in cars anyway?