Prong Collar Banning

[Yorto]

So all states bar VIC is legal to use them ? But can't import into Australia ? hmmm. Would it be illegal to buy this in VIC ?

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/281048887858?ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1555.l2649#ht_500wt_1226

[Nekhbet]

you can own them and buy as many as you want, you just cant use them.

By the way, stay away from the chrome plated HS collars they're rubbish, go the solid stainless in all of the HS range and you wont regret it.

[Yorto]

you can own them and buy as many as you want, you just cant use them.

By the way, stay away from the chrome plated HS collars they're rubbish, go the solid stainless in all of the HS range and you wont regret it.

Looking for friend who is in VIC.... Stainless steel would only really be beneficial if you are using it around water all the time....

[Erny]

you can own them and buy as many as you want, you just cant use them.

By the way, stay away from the chrome plated HS collars they're rubbish, go the solid stainless in all of the HS range and you wont regret it.

Looking for friend who is in VIC.... Stainless steel would only really be beneficial if you are using it around water all the time....

I don't like chrome plated stuff. Over time it chips off and can irritate skin. Go the quality stuff.

I haven't read the posts in this thread but no, they are not banned Australia wide. In Victoria their use is banned. Political stunt to ban them, if you ask me - certainly not based in any sound reasoning of evidence.

[Erny]

Why do people use it? Its such a vicious looking implement.

Like all equipment, one should learn about it before judging it. Many people blindly use the head-collar without any thought to learning about it and getting some tuition in its use - but it looks nice and soft, so it would be, wouldn't it.

Nup.

[Erny]

Nobody has yet answered my question about why people use them. Under what circumstances are these collars used - a pretty simple question. What is the basic premise around their effectiveness as opposed to the other collars mentioned?

Reasons for use vary. The dog. The exercise being trained for (or against).

The blunt prongs are shaped/bent in such a way that when leash tension is activated, the links of the collar move in such a fashion that the prongs squeeze in towards each other. More a side-ways movement. This causes a pinch on the skin.

The skin is an organ that is well-endowed with nerve endings. Nature made it that way as what's the point of feeling things so minutely and quickly once something has gone beyond skin and struck upon vital organs? The skin is our source of the "touch and feel" sensation. The PPCollar makes use of this and it means that a lesser correction achieves a greater impact from the point of view of what the animal feels - rather than a greater impact with potential damage to muscle and skeletal accompanying the correction.

This makes a corrective message vastly clearer to the dog as well and with clearer messages dogs learn faster. They learn faster, means less corrections than it might receive via some other forms of training restraints and tools.

Also, because of the above, the handler can 'talk' through the leash more quietly (ie with the least of body movement and effort) and this in itself helps in training. Excessive movement can send a signal to a dog contrary to the one we intend, and/or it can be a distraction.

That the use of the PPCollar has been banned in Victoria is a crying shame and the fact that it was banned WITHOUT any evidence of harm being recorded (this isn't so for the tools so widely embraced and heralded by some orgs such as RSPCA and APDT) only points to it being for political reasons. IMO.

Edited January 18, 2013 by Erny

[Nekhbet]

no the sprenger stainless is not just a coating, chrome chips and is a much lesser quality like Erny said. Chrome doesnt have to be near water to corrode and break down either, you get a better quality product avoiding it.

I haven't read the posts in this thread but no, they are not banned Australia wide. In Victoria their use is banned. Political stunt to ban them, if you ask me - certainly not based in any sound reasoning of evidence.

Yup just like most of our BS laws can't do this, can't do that, and yet we have one heck of a major dog problem which is only going to get worst with restrictions on equipment and training.

[Erny]

Oh KTB I totally understand what you are saying and I agree! I would happily use a prong collar on my dog if I felt it would work the best. I was addressing a separate point which is the reality is that some people don't have the inclination to put lots of hours of training into their dogs and that doesn't mean the dog is neglected or unloved or that the owners are bad dog owners.

I agree. To be honest, because of the potential for misuse, I'd never actually recommend a prong to someone who hadn't gone to see a behaviourist first for training in its use.

I don't recommend any corrective tool to anyone if they're likely to abuse it through gross mishandling.

I think education (at least some basics) should be mandatory for anyone taking up the use of corrective tools, but it always seems to be the PPCollar that is the highlight of this suggestion. What about the head-collar use, for example?

Also, people do have the tendency to think PPCollars are only about "control" and generally think of them as only for the stronger large breed dogs. I don't agree with this. A 'bang' or pulling on the end of the lead attached to a flat collar can do some harm and jerk the bones of a neck around for them too.

[Erny]

Personally from my own experience and others, I don't feel prong collars are hard to learn how to use correctly.

I agree, Huski. It takes less to apply the correction and therefore I find owners are able to cope with them more easily.

I also don't think they are high risk especially once the owner has been shown how to use one correctly.

Given that there is no recorded evidence of harm, I'd even go further and suggest they were low risk. Yet as I mentioned, that's not the case for some of the other more widely accepted and embraced training tools.

The collar was easily banned because people gasped in horror at the LOOK of it. Gross assumption.

But of course, the RSPCA said it should be banned, so ..............

Edited January 18, 2013 by Erny

[Sparassidae]

no the sprenger stainless is not just a coating, chrome chips and is a much lesser quality like Erny said. Chrome doesnt have to be near water to corrode and break down either, you get a better quality product avoiding it.

Chrome plating is actually used a lot in yachting now - these are boats that are almost permanently in the ocean.

Good chrome plating can last a bloody long time, it's come a long way. Cheap chinese knock offs use decorative chrome plating, compared to hard chrome plating. I wouldn't be concerned with using chrome plated supplies assuming they're a decent brand, and use proper hard coating techniques which HS do use.

Hard chromium plating was specifically designed to prevent oxidisation from occuring - the part of stainless steel that prevents it from rusting is the chromium content which is usually around 10%.