smisch Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 I had a thought recently as we just finished chipping a litter of pups. Why does microchip paperwork not allow a space for pedigree name or breeder details. As a newer person to the breeding world but I KNOW that if a pup I'd bred ended up in the pound I would want to know so I can do what I can to rescue the dog and rehome it myself. I was just saying to OH that if we have a litter we should see if we can microchip the pups in their pedigree names so in that event we may .be able to be traced back to our pups. Anyone else got any thoughts on this idea Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mixeduppup Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 It has "Company name" that's where I put my stud name. I know what you mean though, they need more character boxes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jed Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 I think that is a very good idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swizzlestick Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 Not sure if you're talking about Central Animal Records or another registry, but the CAR forms for breeders have a spot for "kennel name" at the top. Link Here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 (edited) We have been petitioning for years to have the breeder name entered as this way proper stats can be kept if they are dumped. Pet shops don't want this as the deal they have is the breeder stays anon and they sit in on all committees. They can take puppies and not chip them until they go to the new owner so the breeder and the pet shop never show up. Edited October 16, 2012 by Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christina Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 RSPCA won't let you have the dog if it ends up there, I asked & was told no its ours if it ends up here. Not sure about other pounds. I put myself as 2nd contact & write a note across the top of the form asking please do not PTS & to contact me. Can't think of anything else that could be done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
butterup Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 The idea of dogs being returned to the breeder is a good one but most rescue groups and pounds wont allow the dog to be returned to the breeder and they use the information they have about the terrible breeder who doesn't screen their puppy buyers well enough (and of course who doesn't care) that the dog they bred came into rescue as a way of belting into the breeder.They have been collecting information from pedigree papers to do this now for some time and good luck to any breeder who has a dog land in a surrender situation who is given a chance to take it back.That is why it wont ever be compulsory because animal rights blame the breeder and only registered purebred breeders are in the firing line now because of the papers.If the world wants breeders to take back their dogs they need to make it easier to allow them to take them back and not punish the breeder when their puppy buyer turns out to be a mongrel.Taking back a dog is good if the puppy buyer comes to the breeder and tells them they cant keep it but there are lots who don't go back to the breeder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dame Aussie Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 The idea of dogs being returned to the breeder is a good one but most rescue groups and pounds wont allow the dog to be returned to the breeder and they use the information they have about the terrible breeder who doesn't screen their puppy buyers well enough (and of course who doesn't care) that the dog they bred came into rescue as a way of belting into the breeder.They have been collecting information from pedigree papers to do this now for some time and good luck to any breeder who has a dog land in a surrender situation who is given a chance to take it back.That is why it wont ever be compulsory because animal rights blame the breeder and only registered purebred breeders are in the firing line now because of the papers.If the world wants breeders to take back their dogs they need to make it easier to allow them to take them back and not punish the breeder when their puppy buyer turns out to be a mongrel.Taking back a dog is good if the puppy buyer comes to the breeder and tells them they cant keep it but there are lots who don't go back to the breeder. When I worked in a pound we would always call the breeder if we had their details. If we could get onto them and they wanted the dog they would come and get it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christina Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 The idea of dogs being returned to the breeder is a good one but most rescue groups and pounds wont allow the dog to be returned to the breeder and they use the information they have about the terrible breeder who doesn't screen their puppy buyers well enough (and of course who doesn't care) that the dog they bred came into rescue as a way of belting into the breeder.They have been collecting information from pedigree papers to do this now for some time and good luck to any breeder who has a dog land in a surrender situation who is given a chance to take it back.That is why it wont ever be compulsory because animal rights blame the breeder and only registered purebred breeders are in the firing line now because of the papers.If the world wants breeders to take back their dogs they need to make it easier to allow them to take them back and not punish the breeder when their puppy buyer turns out to be a mongrel.Taking back a dog is good if the puppy buyer comes to the breeder and tells them they cant keep it but there are lots who don't go back to the breeder. As most of the pups & dogs that end up in these places aren't pedigree dogs from registered breeders I don't think that is the reason. What the reason is I have no idea Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tobie Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 The pounds I have worked at we always went out of our way to try and contact a breeder as we would prefer the dog to go back to the breeder. Just because the owner dumped the dog does not mean that a breeder was bad in anyway. People can seem like wonderful owners but things can change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 (edited) the reality is that once a puppy changes hands it is no longer the breeder's property and the breeder has no right to make decisions regarding its life. There are only about 6000 registered ANKC breeder left Australia wide and based on what Ive seen most of them wouldn't be interested in taking their puppies back . There are many many more breeders who are breeding cross bred mutts and BYB litters who also wouldnt be interested in being responsible for the pup after its gone home. Pet shops want to be able to provide anonymity because without that no one would sell to them, even if you dont take into account places like the RSPCA who wont allow a breeder to take the pup back thats a lot of stakeholders and numbers who dont want to see this happen . Back in the beginning when chips were being made compulsory in NSW a big deal was ensuring that info wasn't handed around and privacy maintained. Id be surprised if anything was done to erode that at law. Edited October 16, 2012 by Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asal Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 (edited) the reason many now chip the pups directly into the new owners name has nothing to do with "hiding" it is all to do with not having to issue double paperwork per pup and if the new owner does not pay the registration the councils may take from 5 to 7 years to notice and who has to tell them where that pup they bred that long ago now is? with no informtion bar the chip number to go on? I well remember the panic of one friend sent a list of some 14 dogs and trying to find 5 to 7 year old record books n the chips are not in numerical order. in my case i took 3 hours over the deadline to advise the dog with that number was dead. so copped a 168 fine for dog that had died 6 years before.no ifs buts or appeal either.... so keep your records where you can find them no matter how old. i have never put any but the owner ever since. be it a buyer or me if i kept it. Edited October 17, 2012 by asal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darlingdog Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 (edited) The idea of dogs being returned to the breeder is a good one but most rescue groups and pounds wont allow the dog to be returned to the breeder and they use the information they have about the terrible breeder who doesn't screen their puppy buyers well enough (and of course who doesn't care) that the dog they bred came into rescue as a way of belting into the breeder.They have been collecting information from pedigree papers to do this now for some time and good luck to any breeder who has a dog land in a surrender situation who is given a chance to take it back.That is why it wont ever be compulsory because animal rights blame the breeder and only registered purebred breeders are in the firing line now because of the papers.If the world wants breeders to take back their dogs they need to make it easier to allow them to take them back and not punish the breeder when their puppy buyer turns out to be a mongrel.Taking back a dog is good if the puppy buyer comes to the breeder and tells them they cant keep it but there are lots who don't go back to the breeder. [/quot I participate in breed rescue and I can assure you that if we know who the breeder is of any dog we get into rescue we ALWAYS contact the breeder as the first port of call. Sadly we have encountered some breeders who just are not interested but we do always ask. If a dog is in a shelter though it is very very hard to get that shelter to tell us if they know the breeding details of the dog....we find that very frustrating. A lot depends on the particular humans running a particular shelter as to how much information they will give us so yes this needs to change. Edited October 17, 2012 by darlingdog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdierikx Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 The idea of dogs being returned to the breeder is a good one but most rescue groups and pounds wont allow the dog to be returned to the breeder and they use the information they have about the terrible breeder who doesn't screen their puppy buyers well enough (and of course who doesn't care) that the dog they bred came into rescue as a way of belting into the breeder.They have been collecting information from pedigree papers to do this now for some time and good luck to any breeder who has a dog land in a surrender situation who is given a chance to take it back.That is why it wont ever be compulsory because animal rights blame the breeder and only registered purebred breeders are in the firing line now because of the papers.If the world wants breeders to take back their dogs they need to make it easier to allow them to take them back and not punish the breeder when their puppy buyer turns out to be a mongrel.Taking back a dog is good if the puppy buyer comes to the breeder and tells them they cant keep it but there are lots who don't go back to the breeder. Reputable rescues will ALWAYS notify the breeder of a purebred dog of it's situation and offer to let them take it back. Reputable rescues will also notify the breed club or breed rescue of said dog if the breeder can't take it in. Please don't tar all rescues with the ugly brush... we're not all cowboys... T. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 The idea of dogs being returned to the breeder is a good one but most rescue groups and pounds wont allow the dog to be returned to the breeder and they use the information they have about the terrible breeder who doesn't screen their puppy buyers well enough (and of course who doesn't care) that the dog they bred came into rescue as a way of belting into the breeder.They have been collecting information from pedigree papers to do this now for some time and good luck to any breeder who has a dog land in a surrender situation who is given a chance to take it back.That is why it wont ever be compulsory because animal rights blame the breeder and only registered purebred breeders are in the firing line now because of the papers.If the world wants breeders to take back their dogs they need to make it easier to allow them to take them back and not punish the breeder when their puppy buyer turns out to be a mongrel.Taking back a dog is good if the puppy buyer comes to the breeder and tells them they cant keep it but there are lots who don't go back to the breeder. Reputable rescues will ALWAYS notify the breeder of a purebred dog of it's situation and offer to let them take it back. Reputable rescues will also notify the breed club or breed rescue of said dog if the breeder can't take it in. Please don't tar all rescues with the ugly brush... we're not all cowboys... T. You sure about that ? So if they have a policy of not allowing the dog to go home to the breeder do we assume they are not reputable? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo Baggins Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 As a Rescue organization we cannot get the original owner details from the registries ie the one who chipped them. As breeder I would love my details to be upfront and central. But as Steve states it has not happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdierikx Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 The idea of dogs being returned to the breeder is a good one but most rescue groups and pounds wont allow the dog to be returned to the breeder and they use the information they have about the terrible breeder who doesn't screen their puppy buyers well enough (and of course who doesn't care) that the dog they bred came into rescue as a way of belting into the breeder.They have been collecting information from pedigree papers to do this now for some time and good luck to any breeder who has a dog land in a surrender situation who is given a chance to take it back.That is why it wont ever be compulsory because animal rights blame the breeder and only registered purebred breeders are in the firing line now because of the papers.If the world wants breeders to take back their dogs they need to make it easier to allow them to take them back and not punish the breeder when their puppy buyer turns out to be a mongrel.Taking back a dog is good if the puppy buyer comes to the breeder and tells them they cant keep it but there are lots who don't go back to the breeder. Reputable rescues will ALWAYS notify the breeder of a purebred dog of it's situation and offer to let them take it back. Reputable rescues will also notify the breed club or breed rescue of said dog if the breeder can't take it in. Please don't tar all rescues with the ugly brush... we're not all cowboys... T. You sure about that ? So if they have a policy of not allowing the dog to go home to the breeder do we assume they are not reputable? Most of the reputable rescues I deal with have no qualms about returning a pedigreed dog back to its breeder - if the breeder wants it back... Why would a reputable rescue have a policy of NOT contacting a reputable breeder (if known) to see if they want the dog back? *NB: I don't class the RSPCA as a reputable rescue... *grin* So - yes - I'd suppose I'd say any rescue that has a POLICY of refusing to work with a reputable breeder in the interest of the dog in question is NOT a totally reputable rescue... but then that would be MY opinion... T. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plan B Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 As a Rescue organization we cannot get the original owner details from the registries ie the one who chipped them. Nobody can, including ACO's. All that is on the system is the current ownership details. Nothing prior. Breeders can put their contact as 'second contact' and hope the new owner keeps that or the dog doesn't change ownership. Reputable rescues will ALWAYS notify the breeder of a purebred dog of it's situation and offer to let them take it back. Reputable rescues will also notify the breed club or breed rescue of said dog if the breeder can't take it in. T is correct. No reputable Rescue would refuse the original reputable, registered breeder. It is one of the THE best outcomes for a dog in need. And can I just add, enough with the 'MOST Rescues wouldn't...' crap. There are a hell of a lot of brilliant Rescue Groups that do amazing work and work with brilliant breeders (who, might I add, also don't want to be tarred with unsavoury breeders so, really). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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