Rspca Criticised Over Claims Test To Decide Fate Of Dogs Is Misused

[Sheilaheel02]

I have 3 Cattle Dogs and a JRT. All would fail at least a couple of the RSPCA test criteria without being in a high stress environment. If tested in a high stress environment such as at the vet or going into boarding, at least two of the four would likely fail criteria. Incidentally, my cat would also probably fail this test.

S

[Sheridan]

There are some breeds which are bred to have a lot of prey drive, and having ball drive is not a bad thing Can be very useful for training, or even just exercising them and having fun.

Useful for the army, for instance, I would have thought.

[asal]

I have 3 Cattle Dogs and a JRT. All would fail at least a couple of the RSPCA test criteria without being in a high stress environment. If tested in a high stress environment such as at the vet or going into boarding, at least two of the four would likely fail criteria. Incidentally, my cat would also probably fail this test.

S

yes our Indi even went across the road and 'saved' a cut dowon peach tree and brought it home for me to throw for him to fetch

around here fetching sticks and balls is considered a breed standard by indi and his descendants. aussie cattledog incidently. So does that mean if he had ever got lost he wouldnt have had a hope

ummm the wait for you to throw the item brought for you to throw was guaranteed to induce a "high stress environment"

Edited October 11, 2012 by asal

[koalathebear]

Just got the RSPCA "Santa Paws" post on my facebook :) I am wondering what my two dogs would do when confronted by a scary-looking stranger in a red suit and beard.

[Sheilaheel02]

It must be a Cattle Dog thing asal. My old red girl Sheila used to duck dive and retrieve rocks from the bottom of the river. I visited a friends in Nowra years ago to do some tracking training and they were amazed to see her after a pretty hectic morning in the paddocks try to retrieve a telegraph pole from the surf at the beach in the afternoon. And she eventually got it up on the beach believe it or not!!!

KTB, you reminded me of being in the Canberra Day Parade many years ago with ACT CDC. I was having a great day showing off my dogs obedience skills and marching with my club members.....UNTIL IT APPEARED.....and I felt the colour drain from my face. IT was a guy dressed up as a giant butterfly tottering around on stilts, who upon seeing the dogs approach kept coming closer and closer looming over the top of us and flapping his big beautiful wings. A few of us tried to wave him away but it only attracted him more towards us. Sheila saw him and I noticed her stare harden, her body stiffen and then her hackles slowly raise and she let out a low warning growl. The butterfly still didn't get the hint oddly enough and one of his stilts was within grabbing range of us. I think I eventually yelled out something up to him to about moving back. I could just imagine Sheila deciding to negate the threat by grabbing one of his stick legs and felling him like a tall sapling onto the ashphalt in front of the huge crowd. Disaster averted - phew!

A dog who would take out a large butterfly would have to be a massive fail right?

S

ETA: Somewhere here I have some photos of that day, I must dig them out.

Edited October 11, 2012 by Sheilaheel02

[koalathebear]

KTB, you reminded me of being in the Canberra Day Parade many years ago with ACT CDC. I was having a great day showing off my dogs obedience skills and marching with my club members.....UNTIL IT APPEARED.....and I felt the colour drain from my face. IT was a guy dressed up as a giant butterfly tottering around on stilts, who upon seeing the dogs approach kept coming closer and closer looming over the top of us and flapping his big beautiful wings. A few of us tried to wave him away but it only attracted him more towards us. Sheila saw him and I noticed her stare harden, her body stiffen and then her hackles slowly raise and she let out a low warning growl. The butterfly still didn't get the hint oddly enough and one of his stilts was within grabbing range of us. I think I eventually yelled out something up to him to about moving back. I could just imagine Sheila deciding to negate the threat by grabbing one of his stick legs and felling him like a tall sapling onto the ashphalt in front of the huge crowd. Disaster averted - phew!

A dog who would take out a large butterfly would have to be a massive fail right?

Choked on my coffee. Given that so many humans have an aversion to clowns and mimes, I reckon a dog could be forgiven for taking out a giant butterfly on stilts :p

[asal]

Horse too.

Wilson went to do his work out at hawkesbury for Champion Hack.

Except Humphrey B Bear decided to make his appearance.

if it had been points for passage OUT of the showground and HALFPASS passage AT THAT he would have had every sash available.

HO well, he did get a huge round of applause for the dressage display.

Pity the judge wasnt as thrilled as the spectators. sigh................

[Salukifan]

KTB, you reminded me of being in the Canberra Day Parade many years ago with ACT CDC. I was having a great day showing off my dogs obedience skills and marching with my club members.....UNTIL IT APPEARED.....and I felt the colour drain from my face. IT was a guy dressed up as a giant butterfly tottering around on stilts, who upon seeing the dogs approach kept coming closer and closer looming over the top of us and flapping his big beautiful wings. A few of us tried to wave him away but it only attracted him more towards us. Sheila saw him and I noticed her stare harden, her body stiffen and then her hackles slowly raise and she let out a low warning growl. The butterfly still didn't get the hint oddly enough and one of his stilts was within grabbing range of us. I think I eventually yelled out something up to him to about moving back. I could just imagine Sheila deciding to negate the threat by grabbing one of his stick legs and felling him like a tall sapling onto the ashphalt in front of the huge crowd. Disaster averted - phew!

A dog who would take out a large butterfly would have to be a massive fail right?

Choked on my coffee. Given that so many humans have an aversion to clowns and mimes, I reckon a dog could be forgiven for taking out a giant butterfly on stilts :p

My dogs hate Santa

[koalathebear]

My dogs hate Santa

It's ok, they probably wouldn't like the Grinch either ... :D

[Everythings Shiny]

We've sat here today and went through the list - its stupid. All my dogs fail!

[WreckitWhippet]

I do not have a dog here that would pass. Perhaps with the exception of my 4 month old puppy.

They'd all instantly fail on prey drive

[Gertrude139]

For me the biggest issue is that they actively refuse to deal with rescue organisations.

I don't think I know a husky or mally that wouldn't fail based on prey drive alone.

Once a dog has failed the test a breed specific rescue should be allowed to assess and rescue the animal if they believe it can be successfully re-homed. A breed specific rescue organisation will make sure the new owners are suitable for a more demanding dog, if that is the case once they have been properly temp tested outside of a pound environment. They will also have the best idea about which traits being demonstrated are due to the stressful pound environment, which are breed related and which are of concern. Most rescue organisations will give an initial trial period, sometimes with access to a free behavioral trainer to make sure the dog is suitable and settles into the new environment as expected.

I realise that the RSPCA may not be able to achieve better results on their own due to a range of issues, many of which have been listed by others in this topic, but it is clear that there are a lot of rescue groups which are able to but the RSPCA refuses to let them help.

This article is written by the Alaskan Malamute Rehoming Aid Australia's NSW coordinator about her experiences.

http://deathrowpets.wordpress.com/2012/10/09/rspca-nsw-working-with-rescue-groups-or-not/

A no-kill policy is unrealistic but the kill rates from the RSPCA are beyond excessive.

Until the public can be educated about puppy farms, backyard breeders and the responsibility that comes with owning a pet, which is the root of the problem, we will have to work on the band-aid solution. There are some amazing pounds out there doing an incredible job to find homes for the majority of their animals and the RSPCA needs to be pressured to follow suit, starting to deal with well known and reputable rescue groups would surely be the easiest and smartest option for them.

I agree their test sucks but; an organisation their size is always going to have a test and it will never be perfect. Once they have decided that the dog is not suitable for everyday walk-ins to adopt it - that is where a rescue group should be able to step in.

[darlingdog]

For me the biggest issue is that they actively refuse to deal with rescue organisations.

I don't think I know a husky or mally that wouldn't fail based on prey drive alone.

Once a dog has failed the test a breed specific rescue should be allowed to assess and rescue the animal if they believe it can be successfully re-homed. A breed specific rescue organisation will make sure the new owners are suitable for a more demanding dog, if that is the case once they have been properly temp tested outside of a pound environment. They will also have the best idea about which traits being demonstrated are due to the stressful pound environment, which are breed related and which are of concern. Most rescue organisations will give an initial trial period, sometimes with access to a free behavioral trainer to make sure the dog is suitable and settles into the new environment as expected.

I realise that the RSPCA may not be able to achieve better results on their own due to a range of issues, many of which have been listed by others in this topic, but it is clear that there are a lot of rescue groups which are able to but the RSPCA refuses to let them help.

This article is written by the Alaskan Malamute Rehoming Aid Australia's NSW coordinator about her experiences.

http://deathrowpets.wordpress.com/2012/10/09/rspca-nsw-working-with-rescue-groups-or-not/

A no-kill policy is unrealistic but the kill rates from the RSPCA are beyond excessive.

Until the public can be educated about puppy farms, backyard breeders and the responsibility that comes with owning a pet, which is the root of the problem, we will have to work on the band-aid solution. There are some amazing pounds out there doing an incredible job to find homes for the majority of their animals and the RSPCA needs to be pressured to follow suit, starting to deal with well known and reputable rescue groups would surely be the easiest and smartest option for them.

I agree their test sucks but; an organisation their size is always going to have a test and it will never be perfect. Once they have decided that the dog is not suitable for everyday walk-ins to adopt it - that is where a rescue group should be able to step in.

x 2

[Guest Ams]

When I volunteered with the RSPCAs biggest Queensland shelter dogs were black tagged (ie identified as going to be pts) the minute they were sorted from their surrender cages and put into pens. That included puppies, small fluffy dogs, cats and kittens. I don't know what criteria was used other than it seemed to be based on age, health and capacity to house the animals. They certainly weren't behavioured assessed at that point. In the front door, a decision was made and their fate was sealed all in a matter of a morning. I saw this many times with my own eyes. I even took a 3 week pup with a broken leg home to foster because I was told by staff if I didn't take it it would just be pts. She ended up being what appeared to be a well bred SBT and was rehomed to someone I knew and grew to be the most obedient and beautiful natured dog.

I would hope things have changed over the last couple of years regarding how dogs are assessed.

Black tag dogs are not dogs marked for euthanasia. They are cruelty cases and are held pending legal action.

[Andisa]

I do not have a dog here that would pass. Perhaps with the exception of my 4 month old puppy.

They'd all instantly fail on prey drive

Same here, all mine would fail on drive and cats alone - even my pug would fail..it's beyond stupid

One even shows teeth when saying "yuk" to something, if she doesn't like she screws up her nose shows her teeth and walks away. You should see her around smokers . I have had a few dogs who hate the smell of smoke, if someone has been smoking and goes to handle them they don't like it, certainly not aggressive - I suppose that would be a negative reaction too.

Edited October 23, 2012 by Andisa

[Penumbra]

OPINION: Poor rescue groups shame rich RSPCA

EVERY year thousands of companion animal rescue volunteers save thousands of dogs and cats from pounds and shelters across the state.

See your ad here

These community-based rescue groups don't have any of the resources or financial backing that the RSPCA enjoys, yet when they can co-ordinate with a council-run pound the results are magnificent.

In our region alone, Wyong Council Animal Care Facility has a kill ratio of 12 per cent, while Muswellbrook's facility has one of 4 per cent for dogs.

Meanwhile the RSPCA NSW, with an overall kill rate of over 50 per cent, continues to make excuses for ignoring the community's expectations.

The rescue groups re-home thousands of cats and dogs every year, akin to the numbers of the RSPCA. These groups are major players in the companion animal field and have a significant part to play.

So it was extremely disappointing that not one rescue group or representative was accepted on the government's companion animal taskforce.

This taskforce was formed, in part, to try to reduce the number of animals euthanised in this state every year. The organisation that destroys more animals than any other single institution is the RSPCA. Yet it was on this taskforce, whereas rescue groups, the major player in the saving and re-homing of animals, were not.

[m-sass]

But the Principal of Lawyers for Companion Animals, Anne Greenaway, said so-called aggressive behaviours were often exhibited by animals that were "terrified".

What's this crap??, terrified dogs are spook dogs, fear biters, weak nerve WTF would anyone want to bother with dogs like that for, they are sadly duds that take a lot of work and time spent on spooky behaviour where the time spent on a decent dog could be so much more pleasurable with a whole lot more achieved.

[mantis]

But the Principal of Lawyers for Companion Animals, Anne Greenaway, said so-called aggressive behaviours were often exhibited by animals that were "terrified".

What's this crap??, terrified dogs are spook dogs, fear biters, weak nerve WTF would anyone want to bother with dogs like that for, they are sadly duds that take a lot of work and time spent on spooky behaviour where the time spent on a decent dog could be so much more pleasurable with a whole lot more achieved.

Dougie, I am sick of your crap. You are not a dog lover. If you knew anything about dogs, you would know that dogs who are lost & end up in the pound are usually stressed & display totally different behaviour than they would if they were in their own environment.

OK, that's it, not feeding you anymore.

[steamboat]

I am not an apologist for the RSPCA, but I think those numbers are misleading.

If they had done a temp test on 100's of dogs out in the community, different breed and in different socio-economic areas and 50% failed then your stat is valid. But that isn't what the statistic represents.

It represents 50% of dogs that land up at the RSPCA (which is effectively the pound here in Vic, don't know about NSW). I would assume - and I don't have the data to back me up - that the dogs landing up in the pound and remain unclaimed aren't representative of the total pet population.

You can't infer that dogs landing up at the pound are a good representative of the dogs in the community. After all, most dogs in the community don't end up at the pound and remain unclaimed.

I think they can do a better job at rehabilitating some dogs. I think they could spend their money far more wisely (fancy new building in Burwood Vic, but the dogs remain in pens that all face each other, for example).

However, most dogs adopted from the pound aren't going to experienced owners, with "experienced" meaning people who have a good knowledge of dog behaviour and training and know how to apply behaviour modification techniques, not "owned dogs for 20 years". I meet lots and lots of dog owners at the park, at training, on walks etc and the vast majority wouldn't be able to cope with a dog with issues (eg fear aggression).

Most dogs don't go to regular training, they don't have owners who understand body language, they don't get 1 hr + of walking and training every day etc. This means that they need to have stable temperaments, be able to deal with the rough-and-tumble of life, be able to go to a dog park and have an owner who chats with the locals rather than watching them like a hawk etc. This means that there is actually a limited pool of dogs that can be safely rehomed through a pound system.

Of course there are many people looking for different dogs (eg sports homes). However, if someone has specific requirements they often are looking for a dog from proven lines, willing to wait years for the right pup to come along and they're not rocking up to the local RSPCA on a Saturday afternoon.

What a great post,

Concise, precise, nonjudgemental, unhysterical.

A breath of fresh air.

Congratulations.

[m-sass]

But the Principal of Lawyers for Companion Animals, Anne Greenaway, said so-called aggressive behaviours were often exhibited by animals that were "terrified".

What's this crap??, terrified dogs are spook dogs, fear biters, weak nerve WTF would anyone want to bother with dogs like that for, they are sadly duds that take a lot of work and time spent on spooky behaviour where the time spent on a decent dog could be so much more pleasurable with a whole lot more achieved.

Dougie, I am sick of your crap. You are not a dog lover. If you knew anything about dogs, you would know that dogs who are lost & end up in the pound are usually stressed & display totally different behaviour than they would if they were in their own environment.

OK, that's it, not feeding you anymore.

Who's Dougie

I know that dogs terrified by the inablilty to handle the stress of environmental change have a nerve issue, one of the primary factors that will fail a police dog candidate, inefficient stability. The event of the stress encountered by the lost dog at the pound reveals the true character of the dog under pressure and it fails the test of temperament stability. Too many excuses for dogs of poor temperamemt.

Edited October 25, 2012 by m-sass