Cosmolo Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 It is VERY unrealistic to assume that dogs in shelters receive proper enrichment and exercise. I would rather have a dog in a quiet pet supply store, given sufficient stimulation, exercise and enrichment than have the same dog in a shelter which provides none of the above. Screening processes should be in place in the same way as a shelter and if you think that impulse buying does not happen in shelters- think again. There are plenty of people who come for 'just a look' and feel so sad about the animals situation that they adopt and take one home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Flying Furball Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 The little staffy I saw in Dubbo had the RSPCA morning visit as I arrived in store, the salesgirl had taken him for a run in the early morning, and it was very spacious, 'not cage-like' enclosure with a very high ceiling and natural light. He had a kennel and open space in there. There were three runs but just one dog in one. Poor little thing was stressed but I bet he's got a home by now...he had no competition. There were a few cats as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dame Aussie Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 Exactly right Cosmolo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AussieDog Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 It is VERY unrealistic to assume that dogs in shelters receive proper enrichment and exercise. I would rather have a dog in a quiet pet supply store, given sufficient stimulation, exercise and enrichment than have the same dog in a shelter which provides none of the above. Screening processes should be in place in the same way as a shelter and if you think that impulse buying does not happen in shelters- think again. There are plenty of people who come for 'just a look' and feel so sad about the animals situation that they adopt and take one home. Exactly. When i got my RSPCA dog six years ago i could have easily taken home more than one if i had the room and funds. Dogs in shelters tug on my heart strings more than dogs at Pet Shops. As for the process i wasn't allowed to take Kobi home the day i picked him. I had to go home and think about it overnight before they would let me buy him. The Fountain Gate Pet Barn sell dogs (partnered with Lort Smith). I actually rarely see dog's in the pens there - maybe every second or third visit. The pens are spacious and always clean. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linda K Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 (edited) But wit a minute, rescue groups also jump all over the impulse buy things with pet shops, and make themselves out as the paragons of virtue that they do such onerous checks and balances to ensure they are homing to the right home. So once again, we are hearing it is OK for them to sell to impulse buyers, same as it is perfectly OK for them to sell in petshops, but not anyone else. I give up, yes of course these are such wonderful places for animals to be, far better than being raised in a breeders home and being exposed to the hustle and bustle of just what a home is, as so many's peoples homes are just like a shop. Oh wait a minute, that's right, they're not........... Edited October 5, 2012 by Linda K Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minimax Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 (edited) I give up, yes of course these are such wonderful places for animals to be, far better than being raised in a breeders home and being exposed to the hustle and bustle of just what a home is, as so many's peoples homes are just like a shop. Oh wait a minute, that's right, they're not........... These are dogs in SHELTERS being sold in PET SHOPS. This has nothing to do with being raised in a breeders home, what are you on? Your comments make no sense in relation to what is being discussed. Edited October 5, 2012 by minimax Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dame Aussie Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 (edited) But wit a minute, rescue groups also jump all over the impulse buy things with pet shops, and make themselves out as the paragons of virtue that they do such onerous checks and balances to ensure they are homing to the right home. So once again, we are hearing it is OK for them to sell to impulse buyers, same as it is perfectly OK for them to sell in petshops, but not anyone else. I give up, yes of course these are such wonderful places for animals to be, far better than being raised in a breeders home and being exposed to the hustle and bustle of just what a home is, as so many's peoples homes are just like a shop. Oh wait a minute, that's right, they're not........... Linda, not one person has said that they wouldn't prefer the dog to come from a good breeder. I actually said that exact thing! All we are saying is that a shelter like RSPCA, Lort Smith etc is not a great environment for the animal to be in and the pet shops aren't any worse. Edited October 5, 2012 by Aussie3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
megan_ Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 Linda - the ones I know DO NOT allow someone to buy the dog then and there. They're in the shop for a few hours to get visibility. Why do you assume they're sold to the first person with the $$$? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cosmolo Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 Impulse buying is bad. Impulse buying can occur in shelters, pounds, from breeders and in pet shops. What stops impulse buying? Proper screening processes. Proper screening processes can occur in a pound, shelter, from breeders or pet shops. I realise this is not the only issue but this seems to be the one put forward. Would i prefer that programs like this were not needed- yes. Would i prefer for perfectly normal, healthy, happy animals to be housed appropriately in pet supply stores to be rehomed rather than die because the shelter has 'no room'? Yes. It's the definition of housed appropriately that needs examination. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Flying Furball Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 I give up, yes of course these are such wonderful places for animals to be, far better than being raised in a breeders home and being exposed to the hustle and bustle of just what a home is, as so many's peoples homes are just like a shop. Oh wait a minute, that's right, they're not........... These Petbarn dogs lost their home for some reason so they don't have one to go to. That's the problem. Shelter or pound is not ideal, just finding the next home to go to. I do believe that the pund or shelter would still be processing as normal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linda K Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 why do I assume impulse buy - I don't, however if people bothered reading the posts above mine that everyone is quoting, they will see that (I think it was Cosmolo? but could be wrong) someone else had just made this point in this thread, saying that impulse buying went on in shelters, and if I didn't think it occured I should think again. The point I was making which seems to have been lost in translation, and was made in the very first post in this whole thread, and that I totally agree with, is it does not matter where the animal has come from, it should not be for sale in a pet shop. The 2nd point I was making is that to me it does not all of a sudden make it OK for animals to be in pet shops for sale just because they are from a shelter. By all means, have adds for them in the pet shops, but not the animals themselves. I am just staggered how many people think it is all of a sudden OK for it to be done if they come from a shelter or rescue group. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 why do I assume impulse buy - I don't, however if people bothered reading the posts above mine that everyone is quoting, they will see that (I think it was Cosmolo? but could be wrong) someone else had just made this point in this thread, saying that impulse buying went on in shelters, and if I didn't think it occured I should think again. The point I was making which seems to have been lost in translation, and was made in the very first post in this whole thread, and that I totally agree with, is it does not matter where the animal has come from, it should not be for sale in a pet shop. The 2nd point I was making is that to me it does not all of a sudden make it OK for animals to be in pet shops for sale just because they are from a shelter. By all means, have adds for them in the pet shops, but not the animals themselves. I am just staggered how many people think it is all of a sudden OK for it to be done if they come from a shelter or rescue group. I get it. Just cant see how its O.K. to have it both ways - for me its black and white if live animals shouldn't be sold in pet shops then live animals shouldn't be sold in pet shops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rubiton Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 Ok Ill put in this opinion just aside from the impulse vs handing over your first born extremes. We were looking for a second dog for ages. The problem with actually going out to the shelters was that there were rarely one that appealed to us online and even then they were only open up to a week later at a time we coudl make it in there (ie they load them up on a Monday updating the page then and we'd only be able to go during say their Sunday opening times). We ended up finding a second dog via Pet Rescue with a group that we pretty much volunteered the relevant information to them (and no we didnt need a yard check but he's only chosen to eat/destroy the same things the older dog did when she was young and digs like the older one did when young, etc etc) - we then met the dog and then our other dog got to meet him before we took him home. Now had he been in a shelter we would never have ended up with him as by the time we could have seen him he would have been gone to a different home but the fact was he was accessible to see and contact them about. A shop like Pet barn would be a lot easier to drop in after work to see the dogs and meet them than trying to get to a short gap on a weekend and the dog is there in front of you to meet. Bit like SA Dog Rescue with their rescue dogs at the Adelaide Royal - you got to meet and see what they were like first hand and the dogs get to interact with you so if you have been looking casually for a dog needing to be rehomed and you know the type you want to be able to see them somewhere is much more motivating to actually do something about adopting one than just a face on a website that you cant do anything about seeing for a week or so (and its not like you can put a hold on them for a week til you can get there as thats unfair all round). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flick_Mac Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 I'd just like to add for those who are interested that at the Petbarn I worked at the RSPCA volunteer was there (more often than not NOT doing an adoption) and was sitting, cudding and playing with kittens. Very valuable enrichment. These kittens also got pats and cuddles from interested children (with no pressure to adopt). I see it as making the best of a bad situation. Selling desexed pets to the public who might otherwise buy undesexed, dubiously sourced petshop puppies and kittens will contribute to decreasing the unwanted pet problem. Yes, it's not ideal to have them in a petshop, but there is a massive shortage of foster carers, and space in the shelters themselves. The only other option is PTS which I'd rather not happen if the price of living is a few days or maybe a couple of weeks in a petshop being cared for as I've seen over an extended period of time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
♪♫LMBC♫♪ Posted October 5, 2012 Author Share Posted October 5, 2012 Impulse buying might sometimes happen in shelters. But as most shelters are not situated in shopping centres they probably don't get as many people coming through 'just to have a look' as you would get in a pet shop. I can't remember who said it but an earlier poster mentioned that they were made to wait overnight before decided to purchase from a shelter. Call me pedantic but I don't think overnight is really long enough, especially if you've just walked into a pet shop at random with no previous intention of buying an animal. And as I have said before, I have had first hand experience of the so called 'screening process' at our local RSPCA and I can't say it was particularly impressive. Anyway, the way pet barn is doing things might be different but the fact that they still haven't responded to my email asking about their screening process does not fill me with confidence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squidgy Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 why do I assume impulse buy - I don't, however if people bothered reading the posts above mine that everyone is quoting, they will see that (I think it was Cosmolo? but could be wrong) someone else had just made this point in this thread, saying that impulse buying went on in shelters, and if I didn't think it occured I should think again. The point I was making which seems to have been lost in translation, and was made in the very first post in this whole thread, and that I totally agree with, is it does not matter where the animal has come from, it should not be for sale in a pet shop. The 2nd point I was making is that to me it does not all of a sudden make it OK for animals to be in pet shops for sale just because they are from a shelter. By all means, have adds for them in the pet shops, but not the animals themselves. I am just staggered how many people think it is all of a sudden OK for it to be done if they come from a shelter or rescue group. I get it. Just cant see how its O.K. to have it both ways - for me its black and white if live animals shouldn't be sold in pet shops then live animals shouldn't be sold in pet shops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
♪♫LMBC♫♪ Posted October 5, 2012 Author Share Posted October 5, 2012 These kittens also got pats and cuddles from interested children (with no pressure to adopt). Isn't it a bit risky allowing everyone to play with unvaccinated kittens? Genuine question, I really don't know how risky it is but how would you know that the people coming in weren't going to pass on some disease from their pets at home? Also don't most pet barns allow people to bring their dogs in to the store? That would be even more of a risk wouldn't it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flick_Mac Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 They are vaccinated before they come to us - they're ready to go to their home. People are also asked to disinfect their hands before and after and it's not millions of people, it's a few throughout the day (less than 5 probably). The dogs in the store are fine - the cats are well secured and there isn't much interaction. The majority of the dogs aren't interested at all in the cat or are only marginally interested. In my opinion it's quite good for the kittens to get used to seeing dogs. From a medical point of view it's more risky to be at a shelter where it is very likely they will contract ringworm or flu or even both. I don't think it's perfect, but like i said, I think it's the best of a bad situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 Ok Ill put in this opinion just aside from the impulse vs handing over your first born extremes. We were looking for a second dog for ages. The problem with actually going out to the shelters was that there were rarely one that appealed to us online and even then they were only open up to a week later at a time we coudl make it in there (ie they load them up on a Monday updating the page then and we'd only be able to go during say their Sunday opening times). essible to see and contact them about. A shop like Pet barn would be a lot easier to drop in after work to see the dogs and meet them than trying to get to a short gapNow had he been in a shelter we would never have ended up with him as by the time we could have seen him he would have been gone to a different home but the fact was he was acc on a weekend and the dog is there in front of you to meet. Bit like SA Dog Rescue with their rescue dogs at the Adelaide Royal - you got to meet and see what they were like first hand and the dogs get to interact with you so if you have been looking casually for a dog needing to be rehomed and you know the type you want to be able to see them somewhere is much more motivating to actually do something about adopting one than just a face on a website that you cant do anything about seeing for a week or so (and its not like you can put a hold on them for a week til you can get there as thats unfair all round). But these are the same arguments which can be used about people buying any dog from any source especially from breeders. Buying a dog from a pet shop made it easier for you to source and see the dog first any breeder selling puppies to pet shops could and do use the same argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 They are vaccinated before they come to us - they're ready to go to their home. People are also asked to disinfect their hands before and after and it's not millions of people, it's a few throughout the day (less than 5 probably). The dogs in the store are fine - the cats are well secured and there isn't much interaction. The majority of the dogs aren't interested at all in the cat or are only marginally interested. In my opinion it's quite good for the kittens to get used to seeing dogs. From a medical point of view it's more risky to be at a shelter where it is very likely they will contract ringworm or flu or even both. I don't think it's perfect, but like i said, I think it's the best of a bad situation. If this is true and I believe it is and Im assuming these animals have come from a shelter to get to the pet shop you could be taking animals which are incubating these things to a pet shop and spreading that everywhere. you see my problem is that different words but still the same type of things said for and against puppies from breeders being sold in pet shops. Rescue talk about germs in pet shops from breeder puppies when there is as much risk - if not more from shelter dogs in pet shops. rescue talk about how its better for a dog to be in a pet shop than a shelter but surely if these breeders are so terrible surely these dogs would be better off in a pet shop than their kennels, if animals are sold via impulse which come form breeders who sell to pet shops so they can be sold with a greater risk because they are being saved from death if they are rescue dogs. I am more than happy to see people in petshops promoting rescue dogs or breeders dogs but the dogs which are there for a promo should not be dogs which are actually for sale. I'm happy for photos of actual dogs, profiles of actual dogs etc being thrown around in pet shops but no live animal should be on display or sold via a pet shop and if someone sees a photo or meets a dog which previously was in shelter and if they have to then go out of their way to actually meet the dog they may like to take home then that's exactly what is being pushed in advice to people buying from breeders. in my opinion its simply unacceptable - it conveys a double message and no live animals should be sold in pet shops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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