minimax Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 Sail away, I just had another look at the Barf Big Dog Kangaroo ingredients list & as far as I can see it doesn't have any preservatives in it Maybe there is a something on the list I am missing. I would prefer my dogs to have the least amount of preservatives too. Gosh this whole best diet for our dogs can do your head in I am only assuming it has preservatives in it because it is 'packaged' there is no way it can be 'fresh' and then just frozen meat... I know a couple of people that tried it and their dogs came up in hives! I have Ian Billinghurst's book "Give your dog a bone" here somewhere but we just moved and are still unpacking so no idea where it is. I know what you mean though, there are SO many options out there and everyone has a different opinion on what works best and then all dogs are different... I just try to avoid 'commercial' food where possible and just use fresh ingredients... I didn't really want to go onto dry food but I think a small amount each day of good quality brand should be ok... So you don't freeze your own meat for human consumption as a way of preserving it? I mainly feel that companies that 'mass produce' pet products would have to add some preservative to the meat in order for it to keep until sold... apparently Australian law has loop holes for labelling on pet food and Sulphur Dioxide is not required to be shown on the ingredients list... anyway, I have no proof of there being preservatives in the BARF mix, I am just sceptical... I will most likely just make my own bones/meat/veg mix anyway. Very interesting topic though! I think it's hilarious you won't feed BARF as it's apparently got preservatives, so you're going for a dry food instead Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sail_Away Posted October 1, 2012 Author Share Posted October 1, 2012 Sail away, I just had another look at the Barf Big Dog Kangaroo ingredients list & as far as I can see it doesn't have any preservatives in it Maybe there is a something on the list I am missing. I would prefer my dogs to have the least amount of preservatives too. Gosh this whole best diet for our dogs can do your head in I am only assuming it has preservatives in it because it is 'packaged' there is no way it can be 'fresh' and then just frozen meat... I know a couple of people that tried it and their dogs came up in hives! I have Ian Billinghurst's book "Give your dog a bone" here somewhere but we just moved and are still unpacking so no idea where it is. I know what you mean though, there are SO many options out there and everyone has a different opinion on what works best and then all dogs are different... I just try to avoid 'commercial' food where possible and just use fresh ingredients... I didn't really want to go onto dry food but I think a small amount each day of good quality brand should be ok... So you don't freeze your own meat for human consumption as a way of preserving it? I mainly feel that companies that 'mass produce' pet products would have to add some preservative to the meat in order for it to keep until sold... apparently Australian law has loop holes for labelling on pet food and Sulphur Dioxide is not required to be shown on the ingredients list... anyway, I have no proof of there being preservatives in the BARF mix, I am just sceptical... I will most likely just make my own bones/meat/veg mix anyway. Very interesting topic though! I think it's hilarious you won't feed BARF as it's apparently got preservatives, so you're going for a dry food instead I was waiting for that comment... I see how it sounds conflicting but I realise you can't always completely avoid preservatives and I'm still not certain if I'll even feed any dry food, if I did it would be the smallest amount as a staple. The dogs diet will be minimum 80% raw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kayla1 Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 I don't think there is a discerning risk of poisoning with dry foods at all. With Orijien it was the irradiation which caused the issues for the cats. I know some companies recalled their products earlier this year though... Ideally Australian made would be best... Black Hawk is the only one I'm aware of made here but I'm not sold on it. Earthborn Holistic wasn't involved in those recalls, if that's something you are considering. I haven't tried the grain free variety but my guys are doing really well on the Ocean Fusion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BC Crazy Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 I like EB grain free too as I posted earlier. We have to have grain free here as my boy is grain intolerant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dancinbcs Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 (edited) Thank you both for your comments - I would like to steer away from the premade BARF mixes as I think there are too many preservatives in it - I heard of another dog the same breed as mine, having a bad reaction to it. Although I do realise that dry food is probably no better in some cases... I really would love to stick to 100% raw if at all possible (meat & veg) however, I thought as a supplement/filler one meal a day (while pup is on 3/day) grain-free dry would be ok... I just spoke with the breeder who is currently feeding raw and small portion of dry (Advance)... So many decisions I would follow what the breeder tells you so long as it is working for their dogs. This is especially important with a large breed. If you want to go all raw, make it yourself but first buy the books "Give Your Dog a Bone" and Grow You Pups with Bones". So called BARF patties do not follow the original idea of a raw diet at all. If you need to add a grain, use a small amount of cooked barley to the vege mix. Most dogs digest it very well and it balances the "coldness" of a raw diet according the principals of Chinese Medicine. Edited October 1, 2012 by dancinbcs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maddy Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 Mine found the Ziwipeak way too rich - but it makes for great training treats (the actual food, not their training treats which are much more expensive but seem like the same thing). I tried ToTW but mine had the worst farts ever when they went on it. Ever. I had to leave the room gagging. Never again... IF you're after Australian made then I'd use Nutro. The only reason I don't use it is the size of the kibble (I use kiddle on walks so like tiny kibble so I can give my dogs a high rate of re-inforcement). I tried ToTW to supplement our grey pup's diet and found the same thing. Made even worse by the fact he sleeps on the floor by my side of the bed and the horrific dog farts were actually waking me up several times a night. Also, the size of his stools on ToTW were unbelievable- if it weren't for the fact he toilets in an area the adult dogs can't access, I would've assumed it was theirs and someone had been sneak-feeding them Pal or something. Also tried BlackHawk and found it made him hyperactive. Currently, we're back to entirely raw for him and he's looking great. It is possible to raw-feed puppies but definitely something to research very thoroughly and be prepared to make changes/compromises. Personally, I wouldn't feed commercially prepared "raw" either, I source my meat from a local producer who will actually slaughter to order so everything is fresh and has absolutely nothing added. The downside to this is that the meat doesn't have the same shelf-life of even supermarket meat for humans but.. judging from the texture, smell and look of it, the dogs are probably eating better than I am :p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luvsdogs Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 If you want to follow a true Raw Meaty Bone diet you do not need to feed veggies or grains at all. http://www.rawmeatybones.com/articles.php Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tilly Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 We feed Canidae PureSea, Canine Country BARF and raw. My youngest is sensitive to beef and grains ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BC Crazy Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 (edited) My girl who normally eats whatever is put in front of her has decided as of yesterday that she is not going to eat Barf & has turned her nose up at it again this morning, so she is back to human grade Kangaroo mince which she had decided she much prefers. Must be this thread. or I have jinxed myself LOL. Or maybe it's just Stella being a little b," I'll show you what l like & what I don't “ :) Edited October 2, 2012 by BC Crazy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aso Posted October 2, 2012 Share Posted October 2, 2012 Thank you both for your comments - I would like to steer away from the premade BARF mixes as I think there are too many preservatives in it - I heard of another dog the same breed as mine, having a bad reaction to it. Although I do realise that dry food is probably no better in some cases... I really would love to stick to 100% raw if at all possible (meat & veg) however, I thought as a supplement/filler one meal a day (while pup is on 3/day) grain-free dry would be ok... I just spoke with the breeder who is currently feeding raw and small portion of dry (Advance)... So many decisions I would follow what the breeder tells you so long as it is working for their dogs. This is especially important with a large breed. If you want to go all raw, make it yourself but first buy the books "Give Your Dog a Bone" and Grow You Pups with Bones". So called BARF patties do not follow the original idea of a raw diet at all. If you need to add a grain, use a small amount of cooked barley to the vege mix. Most dogs digest it very well and it balances the "coldness" of a raw diet according the principals of Chinese Medicine. If you're after a "filler", I used to use grated vegetables, mainly finely grated carrots. I use it when I feed the "misc" rations of egg, occassional sardines (when I can't find raw large raw fish head) small offal, yoghurt, etc. This is usually about 3-5 meals in a week when they're a puppy, the rest are raw meaty bones, as varied as I can get them. Mine is a giant breed, Dogue de Bordeaux, and he flourished as a puppy being fed raw. He loved it. I am getting another puppy in 2 months and will be feeding the exact same way :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SparkyTansy Posted October 2, 2012 Share Posted October 2, 2012 I am currently feeding a couple of mine Earthborn Holistic grainfree and they are doing wonderfully well on it. I raised my Weimaraner pup on Raw and had no growth issues at all... but I did havea good grasp on the concept. I would highly recommend the book "Real Food for Dogs and CAts" as well as the BARF books. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wabbit Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 We feed Ziwipeak and very highly recommend it, together with raw/meaty bones diet. Our dogs get approx 1/3 of the recommended daily portion as breakfast, and then raw for dinner. We transitioned from Holistic Select 12 months ago and have been so much happier with coats, energy levels, stools, etc since feeding ZP. Our 10 week old pup will gradually be started on ZP (when his growth rate slows down) but for now is being continued on his breeder's kibble (again Holistic Select) together with a raw/meaty bones diet. Like all foods and kibbles, different things work for different dogs. ZP has been particularly good for our old girl, as she finds it much easier to eat than dry kibble. Good luck with your research! :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sail_Away Posted October 3, 2012 Author Share Posted October 3, 2012 Would just like to say thank you for all the comments, I have enjoyed reading everyone's opinions! I do have a lot of books here "Real food for dogs & cats", "Grow your pup with bones" & "Give your dog a bone" and used these concepts for my previous dog during her earlier years but slacked off from complete raw/dry in her older years... I must sit down and read through them again though for good recipes. I think I will make up some 'slop' which I read from another DOLer - basically veg mix and portion that off for each day + raw bones/meat + 0.5 meal supplemented with dry food (still haven't decided which one! but I will try a few to see what works best for my pup)... Hopefully I don't have a fussy eater and all this research wasn't a waste of time!! :doh:hehe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inka3095 Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 I wandered into a petshop today and had a chat to the owner who said the 'Earthborn Puppy" was pretty good (does contain grains) or the Canidae PureOcean (?) which is grain-free and will probably tempt my exceptionally fussy little 3 month old shiba pup who turns her little black nose up at most food I offer her. I thought I'd come to DOL to check which would be best for a pup before I spent the $$ on a bag - my pup eats food so slowly we'll probably have this same bag for about 6 months lol Thanks guys Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
megan_ Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 you should be able to get samples of the Candidae stuff. They used to sell sample bags of Eartborn for $3 - maybe ask the shop if they still have some. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esky the husky Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 Spoke to an Earthborn rep the other day and they're fazing out the trial pack size, since it isn't very cost effective for them. You might get lucky and find a petstock that still has them in :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sail_Away Posted October 5, 2012 Author Share Posted October 5, 2012 I emailed The Natural Pet Store today because I was about to purchase TOTW for my pup but soon realised the one's available are not tailored for puppies... they said the 'puppy formulas' for TOTW have not been introduced in Aus. yet... but apparently all there kibbles were ALS previously so would be OK, but best to go with lamb variety... back to square one again.. what are your thoughts on the % of protein found in some of these dry foods - for a pup it should be lower is that right? I also read that 'fat' should not be amongst the first 5 ingredients in dry food for large breeds as it can be a factor associated with bloat! (I have had a dog bloat twice before, def not taking risks with that).. I heard some breeders talking about Vets All Natural added to raw diet but I'm not so keen that it needs to be hydrated first & contains a lot of grain... thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
megan_ Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 VAN is a great quality diet. I don't feed wheat but I do feed some grains. There seems to be a big of misinformation about grains - not all are bad. You can make abig batch of VAN and freeze it or keep it in the fridge for up to three days. I'd feed VAN over the vast majority of dry food. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sail_Away Posted October 5, 2012 Author Share Posted October 5, 2012 VAN is a great quality diet. I don't feed wheat but I do feed some grains. There seems to be a big of misinformation about grains - not all are bad. You can make abig batch of VAN and freeze it or keep it in the fridge for up to three days. I'd feed VAN over the vast majority of dry food. That's interesting Megan.... so would you use it as the 10-20% portion of their diet.. basically I am committed to raw meat/bones/veg diet - I have all the right books re; what to include however, thought occassionaly may use dry but would you recommend VAN instead and would it do the same as what I am expecting dry to do... like a filler...? Sorry - I kind of dismissed it because of 'grain' but maybe I should read more... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minimax Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 I dismissed VAN because he recommends roo as the main protein for a pup, which just isn't nutritional enough for a baby. It made me really question his feeding theories. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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