Squidgy Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 (edited) you know you are members of a internet forum not royalty and i want nothing to do with online fights pointless. But i wont pretend i did something i havnt. the info on this forum is great but the attitude of some seems to be lacking. Sorry Ash1 it seems i have angered some on here not sure why but it partly my fault. You seem like a great person and wat you are doing in rescueing these dogs is incredible keep up the great work hope everything works out okay with you and little spud good luck, Oi! Mr little postcount man - YOU dont have an opinion. It's only Yes Sir and Yes Maam from you mister! :laugh: I just checked your post count Lili wow!! I might aswell only have 12 posts compared to you :) I bet you have given some fantastic advice since you have been here for 8 years!!! wow EDITED TO SAY : Persephone almost 32,000 posts!!!!! Edited September 30, 2012 by thundercat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BJean Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 you know you are members of a internet forum not royalty and i want nothing to do with online fights pointless. But i wont pretend i did something i havnt. the info on this forum is great but the attitude of some seems to be lacking. Sorry Ash1 it seems i have angered some on here not sure why but it partly my fault. You seem like a great person and wat you are doing in rescueing these dogs is incredible keep up the great work hope everything works out okay with you and little spud good luck, Oi! Mr little postcount man - YOU dont have an opinion. It's only Yes Sir and Yes Maam from you mister! :laugh: I just checked your post count Lili wow!! I might aswell only have 12 posts compared to you :) I bet you have given some fantastic advice since you have been here for 8 years!!! wow Regard Postcount as a barometer of procrastination expertise. When I am on DOL you know I am not doing what I should be doing. I have not given fantastic advice. But I have absconded a fantastic amount of time. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squidgy Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 you know you are members of a internet forum not royalty and i want nothing to do with online fights pointless. But i wont pretend i did something i havnt. the info on this forum is great but the attitude of some seems to be lacking. Sorry Ash1 it seems i have angered some on here not sure why but it partly my fault. You seem like a great person and wat you are doing in rescueing these dogs is incredible keep up the great work hope everything works out okay with you and little spud good luck, Oi! Mr little postcount man - YOU dont have an opinion. It's only Yes Sir and Yes Maam from you mister! :laugh: I just checked your post count Lili wow!! I might aswell only have 12 posts compared to you :) I bet you have given some fantastic advice since you have been here for 8 years!!! wow Regard Postcount as a barometer of procrastination expertise. When I am on DOL you know I am not doing what I should be doing. I have not given fantastic advice. But I have absconded a fantastic amount of time. :) :laugh: well considering I have only been a member for 4 months I think I have absconded a fair bit of time lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 Persephone almost 32,000 posts!!!!! and no life :p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
staffydave Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 Persephone almost 32,000 posts!!!!! and no life :p staffydave 12 no 13 posts got you coverd sunshine ha just being smart Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
staffydave Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 Persephone almost 32,000 posts!!!!! and no life :p staffydave 12 no 13 posts got you coverd sunshine ha just being smart wait seventeen got you all coverd just joking please dont yell at me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weasels Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 Sorry but I have no time for the attitude "I'm passionate about dogs so I don't have to be respectful to people". I've seen it emerge in the most unexpected of places, and it leaves me cold on every occasion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rebelsquest Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 To the OP, glad you got in touch with Jane. I know you said you wouldn't be back, but it would be great to hear how things go after Jane's visit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
k9angel Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 Sounds totally NORMAL: Spud sounds normal. Murphy sounds normal. They all just dont get along. <Big deal :) rehome Spud with disclosure and to a suitable home> Hardly a pts situation for two young upcoming males and not even blood drawn. Over the past two/three days our young Bull Arab (Spud, 10mths) has attacked our Dobie/Husky cross (Murphy, 12 mths old)a few times, with absolutely no provocation. The four young dogs spend most of the day running around our large fenced dog yard (about two acres fenced off for them) or sleeping. They play roughly, but well together, however now Spud has attacked Murphy with what looks like real intention. No blood has been drawn, but I am very fearful it may not be far off if we don't address the situation immediately. The OP is experiencing normal pack dynamics. Have dog owners become so removed from what is dog that a 10 month old upcoming male going for the 12 month old male, seems abnormal? OP: What you see and what the dog sees are not the same thing. So now you have learned that two young males which are friends as baby puppies, are often not friends as they become young adults. As an owner of large dogs where DA is not abnormal, I can tell you if there was no blood drawn or physical injury, then the fight was not far up the barometer of serious dog fight. If Spud had a high propensity for DA 1. you would have seen the behaviour earlier 2. the attack would have been more serious It is obvious that Spud and Murphy cannot coexist. It is no shortcoming on your behalf and there is nothing abnormal about the circumstance (okay upsetting yes, but this is what can happen when you have multiple dogs). If it gives you peace of mind, enlist the help of a behaviorist to help you reach a decision, and also to give you a better assessment of your pack dynamics, as it sounds like you would benefit from this also :) NB: Aggression is not a disease. It is not something that is 'fixed', but something that is managed. In your case, management is keeping the two dogs forever separated. I couldn't agree more I run one male separately to my other two boys and I've been doing it for six years, it's no big deal, you get used to it. People seem to forget that we are dealing with DOGS here and not all dogs get along, when you are running a pack these things happen. As lilli says, it's NORMAL! Great post Lilli. I agree 100%. Some dogs simply don't get along, simple as that. I run some of mine seperately and have been doing so for several years without drama. It all started when one of my younger girls began to mature and tried to take the spot of another one of my girls, a submissive older female who was already placed pretty low in the pack. (The younger one obviously sensed this). The older one wasn't going to let this new comer take her place though, so stood her ground firmly as did the younger one. Although they never caused serious injury (it was mostly noise), it got to the point they couldn't make eye contact without starting a fight and it was only a matter of time before one was seriously hurt or worse... Both were absolutely fine with the other members of the pack though and knew their place, they just disliked eachother and couldn't live together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
staffydave Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 you know you are members of a internet forum not royalty and i want nothing to do with online fights pointless. But i wont pretend i did something i havnt. the info on this forum is great but the attitude of some seems to be lacking. Sorry Ash1 it seems i have angered some on here not sure why but it partly my fault. You seem like a great person and wat you are doing in rescueing these dogs is incredible keep up the great work hope everything works out okay with you and little spud good luck, Oi! Mr little postcount man - YOU dont have an opinion. It's only Yes Sir and Yes Maam from you mister! :laugh: Thanks for lightening the mood a little lilli it was needed cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squidgy Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 Persephone almost 32,000 posts!!!!! and no life :p :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clyde Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 I don't see anything wrong with Staffydaves post. People are entitled to their opinion no matter how long they've been a forum member. Ash, wishing you luck with your boy. FWIW, I agree with Lilli's posts. Having multiple dogs of certain breeds can be a juggling act and a lot of hard work. I have to keep on top of my lot constantly and they are never left altogether unsupervised. When we're all indoors I am top bitch and they know it :cool: But outdoors, running around, anything can happen and I am acutely aware of this and take precautions to prevent any issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebanne Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 oops sorry forgot my place forgive sir and madams me ha ha you didn't upset me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maddy Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 I don't see anything wrong with Staffydaves post. People are entitled to their opinion no matter how long they've been a forum member. There is a difference between stating your opinion and attacking the opinion of another person based on assumptions about their personal biases. My opinion of the poster concerned had nothing to do with how long he's been around but the fact he made some very unfair judgements regarding the OP and when he was called on them, fell back to the "waaaaah, you just hate bull breeds" crap to defend himself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Little Gifts Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 Don't give up hope. We had a similar issue in a 3 dog household when the youngest decided at 6 months to keep challenging the oldest (13 - both SBT's) and they would go at it to the death but only ever when us humans were around. We got an Amichien Bonding person in and it changed our pack's behaviour immediately. We took back control and were able to remove things that triggered the younger dog's behavior to challenge. The oldest dog passed away last year at a very old age (still having never lost a fight with the younger one!). The younger one now helps us with fostering and does a great job of providing certain skills or natural behaviours she has that we have encouraged as part of the AB process so she has an important place in the pack whilst knowing that the Alpha role is never going to be available. This worked for us but is not for everyone. If it had not worked I would've sought further advice like from a good behaviourist before pts. I could never rehome a dog I knew was DA, especially knowing professional assistance did not work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mixeduppup Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 May I ask what Amichien Bonding is? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Little Gifts Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 Do a search pup - it is all about pack dynamics (going back to wolves) and it made sense to us and it was easy to make and keep the changes. It lets us still spoil the dogs but on our terms. The most important change for us was to give all our dogs a pack role and support them in that. Once they had a purpose, the fighting and competition between them stopped. It was all related to the youngest trying to find her place in the pack and all of them understanding that the Alphas control everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Willow Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 May I ask what Amichien Bonding is? The training method invented by Jan Fennel ("The Dog Listener"). It's based on the belief that dogs behave in the same way wolves do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mixeduppup Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 May I ask what Amichien Bonding is? The training method invented by Jan Fennel ("The Dog Listener"). It's based on the belief that dogs behave in the same way wolves do. but they don't... They have years/centuries of domestication Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weasels Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 (edited) May I ask what Amichien Bonding is? The training method invented by Jan Fennel ("The Dog Listener"). It's based on the belief that dogs behave in the same way wolves do. but they don't... They have years/centuries of domestication About 20,000 years, by most estimates. Also, how we *think* wolves behave has changed a lot in recent times. Edited October 1, 2012 by Weasels Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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