Snooker In Agility

[Kavik]

I haven't yet attempted to do Snooker, as I find it confusing, and worry about confusing myself and my dog :laugh: but there is a trial coming up next month which offers it and I am considering entering.

Any hints or tips on how to understand it better/how to run it? We had a mock run through at training, and I stuffed up :laugh: My aim for the first one will probably be to make it as flowing as possible rather than go for maximum points.

[Sayreovi]

Sorry no help from me, but I will be watching this with interest!

I am yet to enter any of the games as I haven't had much of a chance to watch them being done so still find all of them confusing!

[pie]

Games hurt my head a lot - I couldn't do them with my older dog because my lack of confidence made him shut down, now I'm getting the hang of them and managed to get a snooker title with the younger one somehow :laugh:

Basically - just go bar, obstacle/tyre/tunnel, bar, obstacle/tyre/tunnel, bar, obstacle/tyre/tunnel then do the closing sequence (2-7). You can't do the same bar twice, and if you knock a bar you have to do another one (if there are only 3 red bars then you are out if you knock one because there is no spare one to get)

The obstacles in the closing sequence have numbers 2-7 which says how many points each is worth if you do them in the opening sequence.

If you want to go for "Suicide 7s" which is for top score you will alternate a bar and the number seven obstacle and repeat three times (different bars obviously) (Number 7 is generally hard to get to, but not always)

ETA: usually it all goes well but if something gets taken out of turn or messed up then everyone gets confused :laugh:

Also read up on the rules Here: http://ankc.org.au/Rules.aspx

Edited September 10, 2012 by amypie

[Mrs Rusty Bucket]

Sorry, I thought snooker would be easy because you choose your own course... but it's hard to get a flow and if you knock one bar - then it's hard to make enough points to qualify. Especially if your dog expects you to babysit over the obstacles and won't "go out". My dog could do the "number 7" obstacles but not and make time... argh.

I like strategic pairs a little better - it works for us because the sequences are usually in a straight line (in novice), and my dog has a good drop and if my partner muffs something - my dog loves chasing me to the other obstacle - though if this happens - very very hard to make time.

[Kavik]

Thanks Amypie!

I had a read through the rules right before starting the topic, and tried to find out what happened in my mock run through - he back jumped a red jump after doing it properly, and whistle was blown, and I didn't realise I was supposed to go straight to closing sequence :laugh:

[pie]

:laugh: Yeah all fun and games until the wheels fall off and you have NFI what you are supposed to be doing :laugh:

[pie]

MRB are you talking about Gamblers? With Gamblers you makes your own course for the opening sequence and then do the Gamble to close, which is a distance challenge?

[Chezy]

if u knock a red bar , do another red bar before attepmting a colur , you must attempt 3 reds no more , so ie Ricki's run sunday

she knocked the 1st red, I went to another red, then did the 6th colour=7pts , then she did another red and the 6th again = 14pts , we than did the close , got through clear and quallied , she is novice so only needed 10 pts

hope u understand that

a BIG booboo I noticed in that course that with the jumps being so close many attempted colour 4 which was the spread and the dog knocked the bar, leaving them with no possiblility of getting the closing sequence and a quallie ,

I avoid barts with my girl til the closing sequence as she knocks

[pie]

Wait does that mean you don't have to do three reds and I've had it wrong this whole time? :laugh:

[FHRP]

My aim for the first one will probably be to make it as flowing as possible rather than go for maximum points.

I think this is a good aim for your first go at Snooker. Another consideration is trying to end your opening sequence near the start of the closing sequence so that you're not trying to get your dog past heaps of off course obstacles to get to the closing sequence.

If you've read the rules and still have any questions before the start of a course ask the judge at briefing. I like all the games in agility, they all have their own different challenges :)

[FHRP]

Wait does that mean you don't have to do three reds and I've had it wrong this whole time? :laugh:

You have to attempt three reds. You can only do a colour if you succesfully complete a red. In Novice and Excellent you can still get sufficient points in the opening with just two colours (high scoring). In Masters if you knock a red or fault a colour, you're stuffed, can't get enough points from two colours no matter what you do :)

I remember going to Victoria for a trial when the games were new and people were doing two reds which gave them sufficient points then going to the closing. The 2011 rules do say that the opening sequence end when the Team has performed or attempted 3 reds, so I read it as they must attempt 3.

[pie]

Oh okay that makes more sense - cheers FHRP!

[DeltaCharlie]

It took me a while to get my head around snooker but love it now :) Delta is a really good snooker dog for me as she rarely knocks bars, has reliable contacts and weaves, and calls off things easily LOL So I rarely need to think on my feet, I just run the course I planned :D We actually managed to place 2nd in the 500 final for masters at the Nationals.

My advice is to actually have someone experienced plan a course for you the first few times and talk you through their decision making so you learn it for yourself too. Have them run through the contigency plans too so that you know where to head if something does happen.

Most judges in novice will actually tell you anyway LOL In my 1st run with Charlie he backjumped the 3rd red and I just stood there looking confused :laugh: The judge had to tell me to go to the closing sequence and he still got a qually out of it. Even in excellent one time I stopped mid-course and asked for clarification when he diagonally jumped the spread (through the side and over the rear jump) and I didn't know if it was a refusal under normal rules (therefore timewasting in games) or if I had to go to another colour or a red.

Another thing many people forget is that there are no refusals in games so if they miss a weave entry you can put them back in and still qualify. If they get the entry and pop then you are gone though and need to go to another red.

[Kavik]

It took me a while to get my head around snooker but love it now :) Delta is a really good snooker dog for me as she rarely knocks bars, has reliable contacts and weaves, and calls off things easily LOL So I rarely need to think on my feet, I just run the course I planned :D We actually managed to place 2nd in the 500 final for masters at the Nationals.

My advice is to actually have someone experienced plan a course for you the first few times and talk you through their decision making so you learn it for yourself too. Have them run through the contigency plans too so that you know where to head if something does happen.

Most judges in novice will actually tell you anyway LOL In my 1st run with Charlie he backjumped the 3rd red and I just stood there looking confused :laugh: The judge had to tell me to go to the closing sequence and he still got a qually out of it. Even in excellent one time I stopped mid-course and asked for clarification when he diagonally jumped the spread (through the side and over the rear jump) and I didn't know if it was a refusal under normal rules (therefore timewasting in games) or if I had to go to another colour or a red.

Another thing many people forget is that there are no refusals in games so if they miss a weave entry you can put them back in and still qualify. If they get the entry and pop then you are gone though and need to go to another red.

Thanks DeltaCharlie that is good advice to have someone plan a course for me for the first time :) If I am unsure about a course I ask for help when possible even in normal classes. I watched some of the snooker at the FOA on the weekend as well to see what people were doing.

[Mrs Rusty Bucket]

I meant snooker - you can choose which red you do when... ie make up your own course.

Gamblers and no "go out" - we're so not ready for that either.

[sheena]

In snooker, I found the hardest part was getting the dog to actually run past obstacles which would normally be taken, so she wouldn't accidently take the same red twice, for example. So I taught my girl "side" so now in the middle of a game, I can call her "to side" & tap my leg which side & she will come into me & run close, ignoring all obstacles & focusing on me, till I tell her to take the right obstacle. It has helped heaps. I love all the games, now that I understand them...you just have to train your dog accordingly :)

[RubyStar]

Even in excellent one time I stopped mid-course and asked for clarification when he diagonally jumped the spread (through the side and over the rear jump) and I didn't know if it was a refusal under normal rules (therefore timewasting in games) or if I had to go to another colour or a red.

Another thing many people forget is that there are no refusals in games so if they miss a weave entry you can put them back in and still qualify. If they get the entry and pop then you are gone though and need to go to another red.

Did the judge tell you to re-attempt the spread? I got DQ'd in Snooker once when I was running to a tunnel for my last colour (which also happened to be the first obstacle in the closing sequence) and Millie took the broad jump next to it by accident, but did it diagonally. As I hadn't planned on doing the broad as my last colour but the tunnel, after she did it wrong, I ran to the tunnel and did that, then started the closing sequence. Judge had to pull rule book out to see if she could pass us or not. Turns out had I just reattempted the broad then did the closing sequence, we would have been fine! D'oh! At least I know for next time.

Also, I know there are no refusals or anything when doing colours as long as you go back and correct it, but what about in the closing sequence? I am guessing you need to complete that correctly the first time?

[pie]

No RS Trixie's first snooker pass had about 3 refusals in the closing sequence lol

[RubyStar]

It's been almost a year since I've done any games, hope there are some coming up as now I have the urge to have another go Actually, just want to be trialling again as I haven't in ages. Hurry up night time trials! I'll have time for you then!

[DeltaCharlie]

Even in excellent one time I stopped mid-course and asked for clarification when he diagonally jumped the spread (through the side and over the rear jump) and I didn't know if it was a refusal under normal rules (therefore timewasting in games) or if I had to go to another colour or a red.

Another thing many people forget is that there are no refusals in games so if they miss a weave entry you can put them back in and still qualify. If they get the entry and pop then you are gone though and need to go to another red.

Did the judge tell you to re-attempt the spread? I got DQ'd in Snooker once when I was running to a tunnel for my last colour (which also happened to be the first obstacle in the closing sequence) and Millie took the broad jump next to it by accident, but did it diagonally. As I hadn't planned on doing the broad as my last colour but the tunnel, after she did it wrong, I ran to the tunnel and did that, then started the closing sequence. Judge had to pull rule book out to see if she could pass us or not. Turns out had I just reattempted the broad then did the closing sequence, we would have been fine! D'oh! At least I know for next time.

Also, I know there are no refusals or anything when doing colours as long as you go back and correct it, but what about in the closing sequence? I am guessing you need to complete that correctly the first time?

Yep reattempted the spread correctly and got a card out of it in the end.

Sometimes the judges confuse themselves too. Delta was doing a snooker run recently and there was a combination obstacle for the 7 (tyre and weaves). She missed her weave entry and I put her back into them but the judge didn't score it as a 7. I was told I needed to go back and redo the tyre and then the weaves to get the 7 There were about half a dozen judges watching the run and they all said that it should have been scored, and in fact they would have DQed me if I redid the tyre. That particular judge just had a very different interpretation of the rules to most judges (or she had forgotten them as she hadn't judged snooker in a long time). Unfortunately I didn't get a Q out of it Shame as it was a beautiful run.