Rspca Denies Adoption To Non-pr

[Greytmate]

The CEO of Animal Welfare managed to take dogs from Korea and heaps of US and Aus citizens bring "strays from india and bali back here. I can see why you are peed off.

Really, they pay the many thousands required and put the dogs into quarantine as required? well good on them. Pleased to read it.

I've never heard of anyone importing a dog like that into Australia, let alone heaps of people.

It is very expensive to export dogs to other countries from Australia and extremely expensive to import them. The cost is prohibitive for many people.

It isn't racist to enquire whether a young person who doesn't have an Australian accent is a permanent resident, and if it is part of a conversation about the dog's future it is the type of information that is essential that this be communicated.

[Brucebriz]

I agree Rebanne it is great but a bit of a double standard that we can help ourslves to dogs OS but not the other way around. I don't think the RSPCA worker was being racist but there is an argument that the system has perhaps unintentional racist outcomes.

I would like to suggest also that I think/believe very strongly that we should outlaw the euthanising of dumped dogs and cats etc,. completely. It is a barbaric practice and just engenders more irresponsible treatment of dogs. It allows us at a societal level to keep acquiring and discarding dogs etc like they don't matter. If government had to do the humane thing and look after all dumped dogs then policy makers (and voters) would be forced to come up with a much greater level of accountability for owners and there would be far less "out fo sight, out of mind" that I think operates too much here in Australia to the detriment of our society.

Of course serious suffering and health and serious aggression would have to be exceptions on a case by case basis.

Edited September 1, 2012 by Brucebriz

[Guest Willow]

.I would like to suggest also that I think/believe very strongly that we should outlaw the euthanising of dumped dogs and cats etc,. completely. It is a barbaric practice and just engenders more irresponsible treatment of dogs. .

It wouldn't stop people dumping them. If the government were to look after them, as you suggested, then people would still dump them, because "someone else will deal with them" whilst in the meantime the numbers in shelters and pound builds and builds an builds, because some dogs will never be rehomed, but neither can they be PTS, so they live in a hrrible state of limbo for years and years until they die of old age......

Sometimes euthanasia is not the worst thing that can happen to a dog.

It's not the governments fault people dump dogs.

[Brucebriz]

.I would like to suggest also that I think/believe very strongly that we should outlaw the euthanising of dumped dogs and cats etc,. completely. It is a barbaric practice and just engenders more irresponsible treatment of dogs. .

It wouldn't stop people dumping them. If the government were to look after them, as you suggested, then people would still dump them, because "someone else will deal with them" whilst in the meantime the numbers in shelters and pound builds and builds an builds, because some dogs will never be rehomed, but neither can they be PTS, so they live in a hrrible state of limbo for years and years until they die of old age......

Sometimes euthanasia is not the worst thing that can happen to a dog.

It's not the governments fault people dump dogs.

I think that removing the euthanasia option would make a big difference to what we have now " If government had to do the humane thing and look after all dumped dogs then policy makers (and voters) would be forced to come up with a much greater level of accountability for owners" especially if a system was introduced to regulate ownership and the companion animals act was given more teeth and dog owners were made to be accountable for their dogs welfare. A bit of a pipe dream at this stage but death rowing healthy animals sickens me and there are much better options available as dogs on death row is as bad as it gets IMO.

[schnauzer]

I have lost count of the Schnauzers we have rescued or had surrendered by people moving back overseas. Two in the last few weeks alone.

I can understand why the RSPCA adheres to their policy.

[Guest donatella]

I'm presuming the laws may be similar in Singapore and that rescue organisations may not allow me to adopt a dog without being a permanent citizen.

[Dame Aussie]

.I've also known them to turn away people who are trying to adopt one of their dogs - who haven't brought the whole family (including pets) with them. Some of the staff get a bit rigid in their attempts to make sure dogs get forever homes. .

That policy is in place to ensure everyone in the family likes the dog, and the dog likes everyone in the family. Would be a bit sad if the dog was returned after a few days because Dad didn't meet the dog and they hate each other! The pets rule only applies to other dogs, which is for a fairly obvious reason.

Yep, we used to have dogs returned all the time because some of the family or other pets didn't like them. Also had a lot returned when people went back home so I can see why she said that. She may have been rude but until you've worked somewhere like that you just dont know how hopeless the general public are with things like this.

Obviously you're different but as usual some ruin it for the rest.

[Wobbly]

I guess a large organisation like the RSPCA might not have the time and resources to make absolutely sure an non-citizen will look after the dog forever and take it overseas with them when they return home. Perhaps they have had bad experiences in the past and developed this policy in response to it.

I doubt very much it's racism, a massive amount of Australians have Asian backgrounds, the vast majority of the population is profoundly grateful for the richness of culture the ethnic diversity here gives us. I'd say she's just being very careful for the dog's future welfare and doesn't want to take chances. The RSPCA are on the frontline, dealing with heartbreak on a daily basis - people betray their commitments to dogs with depressing regularity so it's no wonder staff are very, very cautious.

Andrew, if I were you I'd contact rescue groups, you can speak to some here on DOL in this sub forum:

http://www.dolforums.com.au/forum/13-dog-rescue-general-rescue-discussion/

Perhaps it might be more appropriate for you to temporarily foster a dog or dogs, train them up and get them ready for their forever homes, that way you get canine company, an abandoned dog gets to live in a home environment while it waits for permanent adoption and if you have to leave Australia suddenly or some other unforseen problem that makes transporting a dog back to Singapore too difficult to do, it won't matter.

I've been looking at bringing my dog overseas at some point in the future, it's a total PITA, you might be better to just get a dog in Singapore and foster for rescues while you are here?

[Sheridan]

There are plenty of permanent residents in Australia who are not and who will never be an Australian citizen. Leaving aside the issue of someone taking a dog overseas, are only citizens to be granted a dog by the RSPCA? What about people with dual citizenship? Might not the RSPCA get a trifle confused over that one?

This doesn't sound like an actual RSPCA policy as such, more that someone reached above their pay grade.

Edited September 1, 2012 by Sheridan

[andrewang]

Like I said, racism is never an issue to me. Unless someone comes up to me and say he or she doesn't like my colour/race, I couldn't care less.

The main issue here is why can't I adopt? Let's do the math here, by allowing me to adopt, I reduce the amount of animal they have to care for and therefore reducing their financial strain.

By not allowing adoptions, more animals will be PTS which also lead to more cost. As a not-for-profit organisation, shouldn't one of their main concerns be cutting cost?

I can save a dog's life why don't they allow it? Even if let's say something bad happens to me and I have to give up the dog again, wouldn't it be better for the dog that he at least get to enjoy my company then no one adopts him and he's PTS?

And saying that, how many abandoned animals in RSPCA are abandoned by overseas students? I'm sure there are way more Aussies who abandon their pets just because they don't like them anymore.

[espinay2]

Seridan, it is about NON-permanent residency status, not someone who is a PR. In other words, someone who is in Australia on a TEMPORARY visa such as a student visa, which usually is for a few years only.

While the woman does sound rude, I can understand why they may want to make a rule for adoptes that they be in this country long term. Exporting a dog IS a very expensive exercise, particularly for someone who is a student (and may potentially need to rely on family overseas to agree to pay for the dogs transport). That said I don't doubt there are those that WILL take their dog with them. But the RSPCA is not the only place to get a dog and if you want to go the rescue route, perhaps talking to some other smaller rescue organisations who have a more 'personal' approach may be worthwhile.

Regarding not being able to play with the dog. The issue maybe as simple as insurance. It can be a liability issue if someone handles the dog and something happens (e.g. they happen to get bitten or injured). Employees and official volunteers are covered by insurance. Potential adoptees who are there with the specific purpose of assessing the dog for adoption are also likely covered. Liability cover for others who 'just want to play with the dog' is likely a lot more tenuous so policies on who can handle the dogs would be put in place to reduce their insurance liability and risk.

In regards to 'strays from India and Bali' etc I am guessing in most cases it would be people living over there for a period of time, adopting a street dog as a pet (likely NOT from a welfare organisation so no comparison to this situation really) and then deciding to bring them back when they return. As the quarantine requirements may take 12 months or more to complete before the dog comes back the dog is likely to have been in the persons posession for a while. And yes, to my knowledge just as many, if not many more, are left behind then are ever brought back into Australia.

[Brucebriz]

Like I said, racism is never an issue to me. Unless someone comes up to me and say he or she doesn't like my colour/race, I couldn't care less.

The main issue here is why can't I adopt? Let's do the math here, by allowing me to adopt, I reduce the amount of animal they have to care for and therefore reducing their financial strain.

By not allowing adoptions, more animals will be PTS which also lead to more cost. As a not-for-profit organisation, shouldn't one of their main concerns be cutting cost?

I can save a dog's life why don't they allow it? Even if let's say something bad happens to me and I have to give up the dog again, wouldn't it be better for the dog that he at least get to enjoy my company then no one adopts him and he's PTS?

And saying that, how many abandoned animals in RSPCA are abandoned by overseas students? I'm sure there are way more Aussies who abandon their pets just because they don't like them anymore.

I reckon you would be right mate. Too many consumer Aussies getting dogs as a form of retail therapy then throwing them away like the wrapping paper their other material conquests come in. Don't give up just because of your bad experience, like I said earlier and others have, get involved in fostering and look into the adoption to go over seas option. There is always a need for foster carers and you sound like you would do a good job.

[*kirty*]

Sorry but I agree with them. Have seen it happen way too many times. Students come to Australia to study, get an animal and then dump it when they go back home. OK you might be different, but the rules are there for a reason.

[JulesP]

Yeah I agree too. I wouldn't sell you a dog either. I wouldn't sell any student a dog though. OK I said no to my brother once so I am pretty picky about who I would sell a dog to. So picky I don't breed anymore!

My family did bring our dog with us when we moved here from the UK too. So it is more the student thing that bothers me.

The lady at the shelter could probably been politer about it but she might have had a shitty day as I imagine would happen working there.

[twodoggies2001]

I have lost count of the Schnauzers we have rescued or had surrendered by people moving back overseas. Two in the last few weeks alone.

I can understand why the RSPCA adheres to their policy.

Funny you should say that. Around 5 years ago, when we lost our standard schnauzer at 14.5 I was walking my mini to the vet when I was approached by a Malayasian student who asked if I would like a beautiful female mini who was supposed to be 2 years old. He was going back home in 3 weeks. To cut to the chase, we went and picked her up because we were actually looking for a companion for our mini. I was told she was great with people and other dogs. When we picked her up, she was in a home made 'playpen' and was cowering. She cost $2000 and I got her for nothing. I learned that she was kept in that pen all day and put out on the back porch when someone came home. Where was the interaction? No bedding was sent home with her just an old towel. No niceties. We took her just to get her out of that place. She was not speyed and we had her booked in with the vet, but because we couldn't cope with her and she needed more one on one attention she was given up to schnauzer rescue and found a suitable home for which I am grateful. My heart really ached for that little girl.

Admittedly, we can't say all overseas students are in the mould but it is a sad fact that pups are brought and then 'discarded' when time is up. Perhaps it is a fashionable thing to do.

[mita]

I spoke to the staff about an adoption, she glanced at me from head to toe (i'm a student from singapore btw) and asked if I'm a citizen of Australia. I said no and she replied "No citizenship, no adoption, sorry". I asked why and she said I'll probably just hand the dog back to them when I return to my country. I told her I intend to bring him home with me back to singapore and she said "RSPCA policy" and walked away.

I stormed off the RSPCA and vowed never to return again.

The RSPCA did the right thing, in my opinion. It has nothing to do with discrimination nor any personal antagonism towards you and your girlfriend. You are not permanent residents in Australia and, while you may say that one day you intend to take an adopted dog back to Singapore, there's no guarantee of that... in the present moment.

I adopted our cat from the adoption program at a leading university. Students who were not permanent residents of Australia could not adopt in that program, either.

From experience, there'd been many problems flowing from overseas students adopting pets (from various sources)... most of which were dumped when they returned to their countries of origin. Of course, you might say that you would not do that... and that you'd take your dog to your country of origin. But that's something that can only be proven, or not, in the future.

The risk factor has been gauged as 'high'.

By the way, in the same adoption screening, there were many searching questions about if a potential owner & home would be suitable.

Even tho' I'm an Australian citizen, my application for adoption could've been turned down on lots of other grounds. It's the right and requirement of those overseeing pet adoptions to make their own call. If I'd been turned down, I would've accepted that. The adoption is about the best interests of the pet... not of me. Same when I've adopted from registered breeders.... I've accepted their call, too.

There's no entitlement when it comes to adopting a pet.... and that includes me and others as well.

I can understand your love and need to enjoy the company of a dog. When I'd take our dogs across the campus to the university vet clinic, they'd soon be surrounded by overseas students who'd tell me about their families' dogs back home. So I've met enthusiastic and experienced dog lovers among the overseas students. It was great to see them interacting with the dogs.

Is there another way of doing that while you're in Australia? Dog walking for a rescue? Foster-caring? Making contact with a registered breeder who has links with the Singapore Kennel Club? Doing some pet-sitting?

Edited September 1, 2012 by mita

[mixeduppup]

On the Bali subject, my friend was recently working with Bali Dogs and wanted to bring one home, policy has changed due to rabies and even vaccinated dogs are now not allowed to leave the island.

As a student I can understand how much you want a pet, but if I didn't live at my mum's I would never be able to afford to keep a dog. Your financial situation may be different but it costs so much to do it properly and there is also working out time with work and study, it just would not be feasible for me personally.

[mita]

Gorgeous pups and dogs for adoption from Action for Singapore Dogs (ASD) rescue (just for starters, Conrad, Caspar & Chris...).

As you'll be returning to Singapore... some lovely doggies there! And that is the place of your permanent residency. So no problems on that score.

http://www.asdsingapore.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=blogsection&id=8&Itemid=108

Also a particular dog in Singapore can be sponsored to save its life. You've said saving a life is one of your intentions. So you could start here:

http://www.asdsingapore.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=246&Itemid=69

Edited September 1, 2012 by mita

[FalconRange]

Like I said, racism is never an issue to me. Unless someone comes up to me and say he or she doesn't like my colour/race, I couldn't care less.

The main issue here is why can't I adopt? Let's do the math here, by allowing me to adopt, I reduce the amount of animal they have to care for and therefore reducing their financial strain.

By not allowing adoptions, more animals will be PTS which also lead to more cost. As a not-for-profit organisation, shouldn't one of their main concerns be cutting cost?

I can save a dog's life why don't they allow it? Even if let's say something bad happens to me and I have to give up the dog again, wouldn't it be better for the dog that he at least get to enjoy my company then no one adopts him and he's PTS?

And saying that, how many abandoned animals in RSPCA are abandoned by overseas students? I'm sure there are way more Aussies who abandon their pets just because they don't like them anymore.

By not letting a non-permanent resident adopt, the RSPCA is making sure that they know where the animal will end up, hopefully for the rest of its life.

Had they let someone adopt without permanent residency, that dog will likely need to find a new home in the not-too-distant future, and this new home may not be up to the standards that the RSPCA or other rescues/shelters demand. If the adopter was also not genuine, the dog may also potentially end up being passed from place to place, on the street or worse.

Dogs are pack animals, and whilst most dogs are able to cope when ownership changes or when placed into a foster to forever home situation, dogs that come back into rescue again after being adopted out may find it difficult to adjust or cope without their families. They have no comprehension of visas and limited time visits, and in some cases breaking that bond with their owner when they go back overseas can affect the dogs quite a bit.

Not allowing you to adopt, even temporarily to get them out of the shelter for a while, is less about a financial decision or a judgement of your capabilities as an owner, and more about ensuring this dog has the best chance of finding a permanent home.

In saying that, if you really want this dog, either to take home when you have finished your course or just temporarily while you're here, perhaps if you made some connections with a local rescue organisation and drew up some paperwork, you might be able to have a chat to an RSPCA manager and organise to pay for and adopt the dog from them and then foster it for the rescue organisation. Over a fostering or trial period, if the dog is one you wish to keep, great - foster failures are always celebrated! But if you aren't compatible, you can always foster it until it finds a permanent home.

This option does involve a lot of organisation and dedication, but I would think that if you're willing to do that and develop a relationship with a rescue organisation, this would demonstrate to the RSPCA at the very least that you are interested, involved and reliable, hopefully enough to let them give you a try.

[sas]

I completely understand the RSPCA's criteria in this instance - it's probably a criteria that has been implemented due to past experience. You can adopt a dog in your home country when you return though yeah?