Was He Protecting His Brother?

[hortfurball]

I don't think that he was protecting him, I think that's humanising what happened. We all like to believe our dogs would protect us and our other dogs in a situation where we were threatened but that's unrealistic.

So what DO you think happened then? How would you describe what happened if not protecting/diffusing the situation?

I've seen confident, good-tempered dogs break up potentially hostile interactions like that, including two I've owned who would shoulder trouble makers apart with no fuss and in a way the other dogs just accepted.

It's a good skill for a dog to have, I think it speaks of excellent social skills and a sound temperament.

See, now THIS is why we need a 'like' button :)

Somebody said that Roscoe might be 'quick to anger' but I fail to see how that could be the case when he showed no signs of anger/aggression. To me he showed leadership skills (pack not human.) I think a natural ability to assess and diffuse is one of many qualities that make up an alpha (as I understand it.) I have been discussing pack structure and alpha recognition a lot with a group of dane owners lately. One trait that we agreed on is that an alpha doesn't seek out the other dogs, it tends to just do its own thing and the others then seek it out, which sounds like it fits Roscoe.

Anyway, sounds like you have two lovely natured dogs and should be proud of them both. :)

[Simply Grand]

I refer to my 3 as each others brothers/sister although of course they aren't, it's just easier than saying male/female fellow pack member :)

I'm sure mine attempt to defend each other in some situations especially with Quinn, the youngest. She's usually full of confidence and happy to barrel around with most dogs but occasionally she'll be wary of one, seems to be youngish large males. She makes this obvious (well to me) with her body language and if that dog comes and jumps on her to play both Riley and Saxon will run over and intervene, seemingly trying to get the other dog to move away from Quinn.

Saxon is good at diffusing, and uses different approaches, sometimes barking and chasing off the other dog amd other times being gentle and standing up to lick it's muzzle to try and calm things. Riley tends to stir things up by barking and going on the attack *eye roll* so I always keep a close eye on him.

I think the way I talk/write about the makes it sound like I'm anthropomorphising but I also think it makes sense for pack members to defend each other, or at least those ranked higher than them (Quinn is the boss of my boys - sorry my male pack members ;) )

[Simply Grand]

Hmm, horts just read your post. So is the Alpha more likely to protect to others? Or the rest to protect the Alpha?

Probably depends on the situation, maybe an alpha is more likely to diffuse, whereas in a full fight the others will try to defend the alpha? (just speculating)

[Cosmolo]

Just to add- my dogs have done this a few times, moreso since the addition of a small dog pack member. I do refer to mine as brothers too.. Calling them brothers is anthropomorphic but let's not throw the baby out with the bathwater and suggest that it's impossible that one dog was not acting in order to protect another.

[W Sibs]

My 3 are called the Sibs (short for siblings)...

Emmy is the diffuser in my pack. We call her the peacemaker. Charlie just makes an unhappy sound and Emmy is between Charlie and the other dog, and she either bumps the other dog away or turns to Charlie and starts licking his face.

[hortfurball]

Sorry, long post!

Saxonpup, if my understanding is correct, there should never be a need for others to protect their alpha. Alphas usually have the ability to diffuse the situation so they don't need protection, but they will step in and protect their pack. There would be people here with a much better understanding than myself so I won't go further into my suppositions but can tell you my experiences.

The reason the alpha discussion came up was that somebody suggested my Ella is an alpha because she won't tolerate bad manners. She doesn't seek any other dogs but they seek her. She'll play if she's in the mood but she doesn't initiate it.

With her history I had thought she was just reactive and so for years she hasn't been off leash in public, but since Rolf arrived she's been getting 'dane therapy' and running with multiple big dogs at the dane playdates and is not only holding her own but they seem to listen to her and respect her when she tells them off for being too rough.

The penny dropped a few months ago when, after a young dane jumped on her trying to play and Ella told her off, later that day the same dane pup had been knocked down by a larger dane and was just lying there too tired to bother getting up and Ella ran up and licked her nose. Light bulb moment for me.

Funny because she's no good at diffusing situations at all. She may be the alpha among our small group (she's certainly the grumpy nana!) but there are certain types of dogs that I'd rather avoid because Ella won't tolerate a challenge and won't back down.

One young crossbreed got protective of his very old dane 'brother' who was lying down having a rest and had a go at Ella when she came near and she was DETERMINED to discipline him! I was trying to grab her but she wasn't going to give up until she'd told him off. Thankfully he was a little more agile and I managed to catch her but he ended up with tail between legs and I'm sure he learned his lesson without her teeth connecting and won't make the same mistake again.

With my new understanding of her I am now able to take her to the dog beach and let her have a run and socialise with about 90% of dogs, but I leash her if an unknown dog approaches of the 'sort' I think she might have an issue with and if they don't also leash their dog we get out of there.

Had a great situation on Sunday night - saw a dog coming and doing the 'stalking' thing and thought "uh-oh" so leashed both dogs, when the owners saw this, they leashed their dog too. We chatted and ended up letting all three dogs have an awesome playdate!

I also call them brother and sister, my babies etc but I try not to attribute their behaviour to human traits. :)

[Weasels]

The term "Alpha" refers to a breeding male or female in a cohesive or semi-cohesive social group, it isn't technically a description of temperament. Horty it sounds like what you are describing is a confident dog with good social skills :)

--

I wish my dogs would even pretend to care enough about each other to show protectiveness, frankly some days I think Chessy would be happier if Weez got carried away by the ants :laugh:

Edited August 28, 2012 by Weasels

[Dame Aussie]

The term "Alpha" refers to a breeding male or female in a cohesive or semi-cohesive social group, it isn't technically a description of temperament. Horty it sounds like what you are describing is a confident dog with good social skills :)

--

I wish my dogs would even pretend to care enough about each other to show protectiveness, frankly some days I think Chessy would be happier if Weez got carried away by the ants :laugh:

:laugh: I swear sometimes Lili looks at me as if to say "Why? Why did you bring this goon into the house?!"