Jozlyn Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 Hi, I've finally found the way to train my puppy FOOD! In only a few days she's learnt to sit, drop, fetch & give, I'm SO proud of her. BUT when she is in the drop position, how do I get her to stand back up again? I've tried telling her to "sit" again, but she just looks at me like I'm some sort of crazy woman :laugh: I've tried to manually stand her back up, but all she does is mauls my hands. Any ideas? Cheers, Jozlyn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weasels Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 Can you lure her back up by holding the food by her nose and pulling it diagonally up & back towards you? Are you using a clicker? :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tlc Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 Food is a great motivator for some dogs just use the food to lure puppy into the position you want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weasels Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 *ahem* also Jozlyn, feel free to add many many pics of your girl to the kelpie thread at any time :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jozlyn Posted August 24, 2012 Author Share Posted August 24, 2012 No I'm not using a clicker, she's our first dog and I don't want to take the chance of getting it wrong, I also don't think my Obedience Club thinks very highly of them lol. I tried to lure her back up with the food, but she just gave me a WTF look I KNOW that the Club will tell me to pull her up by her correction chain, but I don't do static (ummmm not sure if that's the right word, but non-movement based) training with her with the lead on, as the minute I bend over her to go for the clip (which is where we're told to grab it) all she wants to do is bite/mouth me and then she rolls over and generally acts the fool, I've had much more sucess with her off lead, using treats. But, given that today is the first day I've tried luring her back up with food, I'll give it another go during tomorrow's sessions and see if she gets the idea. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jozlyn Posted August 24, 2012 Author Share Posted August 24, 2012 *ahem* also Jozlyn, feel free to add many many pics of your girl to the kelpie thread at any time :D LMAO I actually only have 2 really, the one I'm using for my Avatar and one of her at 6 weeks old. But I'll definately take some more as IMHO she's adorable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ptolomy Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 Going from a down to a stand is way too advanced for a puppy and at this stage it sounds like you haven't taught the puppy to stand yet - so teach a stand before trying to combine it with another position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tazar Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 Teach her to stand first, capture the behaviour i.e when she is standing, say stand and reward with food (as you have been doing) then release her. Sounds like you are doing really well :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jozlyn Posted August 24, 2012 Author Share Posted August 24, 2012 Going from a down to a stand is way too advanced for a puppy and at this stage it sounds like you haven't taught the puppy to stand yet - so teach a stand before trying to combine it with another position. Noooo I haven't taught her to stand, I didn't know I was supposed to. How do I do that? Now I feel like a bit of an idiot, so much to learn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jozlyn Posted August 24, 2012 Author Share Posted August 24, 2012 Teach her to stand first, capture the behaviour i.e when she is standing, say stand and reward with food (as you have been doing) then release her. Sounds like you are doing really well :) Thanks, now I've found the "key" to training her she's learning so fast it's amazing. But what does "release" mean? I'm a total newbie, but doing EVERYTHING I can to learn as much as possible as quickly as possible to avoid making too many mistakes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J... Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 https://www.facebook.com/SusanGarrettDogAgility/app_102515556471926 There is an awesome video of Susan teaching the stand if you like the page. Just noticed you are in Western Vic, I'm in Western Vic as well - whereabouts are you? You can PM me that if you like :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weasels Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 (edited) No I'm not using a clicker, she's our first dog and I don't want to take the chance of getting it wrong, I also don't think my Obedience Club thinks very highly of them lol. I tried to lure her back up with the food, but she just gave me a WTF look I KNOW that the Club will tell me to pull her up by her correction chain, but I don't do static (ummmm not sure if that's the right word, but non-movement based) training with her with the lead on, as the minute I bend over her to go for the clip (which is where we're told to grab it) all she wants to do is bite/mouth me and then she rolls over and generally acts the fool, I've had much more sucess with her off lead, using treats. But, given that today is the first day I've tried luring her back up with food, I'll give it another go during tomorrow's sessions and see if she gets the idea. Thanks It sounds like she has done amazing in a few days, I'm sure she'll get it! I was going to suggest 'capturing' if you were using a clicker: when she gets up from lying down or a sit naturally, you could click and treat and then add the cue "stand" until she associates "stand" with the behaviour. It can be slower though, I find luring to be much quicker :) On a side note, some people look down on luring because they think it doesn't teach the dog to think as much as shaping but I find, with my kelps, they so desparately want to know what you want and want to do it, the luring is the shortest path to communication :) I'm not a big fan of checks on motivated keen dogs, because: a) kelpies are "soft" dogs, they will quite happily shut down if they think you are being unfair or inconsistent and b) they are such good dogs at working at a distance, training with a check and lead seems so limited! Once you can "down", "walk/steady", "left", "right" etc. your dogs from across a paddock or oval, training with a check collar makes no sense! :) LMAO I actually only have 2 really, the one I'm using for my Avatar and one of her at 6 weeks old. But I'll definately take some more as IMHO she's adorable. LOVE red and tans! looking forward to more pics :) Edit - sorry I didn't mean to come across as anti-shaping above, I use it a lot! But more for multi-element behaviours like putting away toys or closing the fridge. For the simpler behaviours I'm a luring fan :) Edited August 24, 2012 by Weasels Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tazar Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 If you ask her to sit or drop, how do you tell her that she can move from the sit or drop? She should remain in the commanded position until you release or free her from the position. A common release word is free. IMHO you should refrain from using food after 10 repetitions i.e. you lure her into a position by showing her the food and bring your hand up or down for a sit or drop. Once she knows it which is after about 10 repetitions you should do it with your hand only, using the same action as if food was still in your hand. Once she has given the correct behaviour then you can reward her with the food. You don't want to bribe her with the food, i.e. show her the food then move you hand where you want her to go, otherwise she may not respond unless you have the food in your hand. You can then reduce your food rewards to every 2nd or 5th or 12th etc repetition of the requested behaviour. That way it is truely a reward. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tlc Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 Your not anywhere near Warrnambool are you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jozlyn Posted August 24, 2012 Author Share Posted August 24, 2012 a) kelpies are "soft" dogs, they will quite happily shut down if they think you are being unfair or inconsistent Her intelligence is just overwhelming me, I knew Kelpies were clever but I had no idea how clever. That statement is SO true! She get's so p'd off at me when I stop her while walking to say "steady", that she will purposely grab the lead and dance around my feet, or turn around and give me a "look", if it wasn't so frustrating trying to train her to walk on a loose lead, it would be hysterical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jozlyn Posted August 24, 2012 Author Share Posted August 24, 2012 Your not anywhere near Warrnambool are you? No Near Horsham. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weasels Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 Her intelligence is just overwhelming me, I knew Kelpies were clever but I had no idea how clever. It's awesome though, just keep training and soon you will have her doing basic household chores! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tazar Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 Forget the chores, teach her to get a beer or soft drink out of the fridge! My old pooch mastered getting the wine and then the glass but I just couldn't get him to pour it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jozlyn Posted August 24, 2012 Author Share Posted August 24, 2012 (edited) [ Edited August 24, 2012 by Jozlyn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weasels Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 Forget the chores, teach her to get a beer or soft drink out of the fridge! My old pooch mastered getting the wine and then the glass but I just couldn't get him to pour it Even better - I just got a weekend project! :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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