MontyMonster Posted August 16, 2012 Share Posted August 16, 2012 Hi, Advice needed please - I have a beautiful male lab pup, 6 months old, who is showing some signs of stiffness in front legs when 1st getting up from a sleep. Of course this has made me extremly anxious, he is now on 'light duties' so to speak and is also having a course of anti inflamm to see if there is an improvment - as we are unsure if this is due to an injury he may have sustained whilst playing with our other dog. I would like advice on what you think the best food to feed him would be and if i should start with some supplements in case this problem is something more sinister....I have had a search thru the forum and am a bit worried with some of the things i have read. Oh Im a newbie to posting, so I hope I have put this in the most relevant section. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
espinay2 Posted August 16, 2012 Share Posted August 16, 2012 (edited) 1. Rest. 2.Rough play can be damaging to growing bones and joints so be sure to limit and restrict play with your older dog. See the recent thread in the General forum on exercise and how much is too much. 3. What are you feeding now? What makes you think the current diet is inappropriate? (before you change, first understand why change may be needed). 4. Supplement with what? DEFINTELY NOT CALCIUM! I would perhaps add 900 to 1000 mg Vit C (as sodium ascorbate - NOT other forms) per day if you are not doing this already (continue to do it till the dog is at least 18 months old). Edited August 16, 2012 by espinay2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted August 16, 2012 Share Posted August 16, 2012 What did your vet suggest , other than an injury? There is one condition I thought of which can present as stiffness in the front legs after sleeping .... If it continues , I suggest you ask your vet about Elbow Dysplasia If it is a possibility , get a referral to a specialist . "Light Duties" LOL good luck with that one ! There is a lot of training you can do without running/jumping/long walks .... maybe train your pup to lie still, roll over, give you his paws to do nails, etc , 'crawl', and , the best one ..to go happily to his bed/in his crate /basket , and enjoy being calm :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tara8430 Posted August 16, 2012 Share Posted August 16, 2012 Is he sleeping with his legs straight or curled up? The reason i ask is sometimes my Lab pup tucks her legs up underneath her when shes sleeping, like a little lamb hehe but obviously thats not good for growing bones. She stretches more when shes growing, stretchs her legs out and moans, does like a bow with her legs out the front bum up in the air and stretches her back then shes good to go, this doesnt happen as much when she isnt having a growth spirt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MontyMonster Posted August 17, 2012 Author Share Posted August 17, 2012 Hi, Thank you for your reply's. And yes we are thinking it could be OCD/ED, which was also mentioned by the vet, but are just hoping that it could be growing pains or the result of rough play with our other dog.... currently we are feeding him Advance puppy for large breeds, and lamb flanks + chicken necks. I guess I am asking if you think that this is suitable or if there is something else that can be suggested that may be more suitable with joint/muscle development. Also does anyone have know if this condition always results in surgery, is it possible to be mild and be able to be managed through rest or medication? He sleeps on his back most of the time with his legs up in the air, lol! or layed out flat on the ground. His 'light duties' are taking a bit of adjusting too, for both of us, he does not really understand the concept of quiet time although he is learning quickly. thanks for your help :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tara8430 Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 My labs 10 & 1/2 months and she gets Pro plan pup large breed plus homemade raw pattys and homemade biscuits,I like to know what she's getting. Abbey also has chicken frames and the large beef bones cut in half from the butchers every now and then. I would deffinately ask your vet before giving your pup any joint or muscle products as they can effect there development, from what I've heard giving pups products such as joint guard at a young age isn't recommended. Make sure you pop over the the breed sub forums and come over to topic those crazy labradors, would love to see pics of your pup Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldenWei Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 If it is OCD/ED the first option would be to put him on a course of Caprofen injections, this helps supply blood to the cartilage(?) that is breaking off and it CAN repair itself. Very strict rest is also needed, and I believe a course of anti-inflams as well. After that surgery is probably the best option. X-rays would probably be required atleast prior to he surgery. It could also be panosteosis which usually resolves itself in time. Does he stand with his feet straight or does he stand with his feet outward? Does he put an even amount of weight on both feet? I have goldens and I take mine off puppy food at about 3 months. I feed Advance usually. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salukifan Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 No one else has mentioned this but getting your pup lean will also help him. Lab pups should not be 'roly poly'. You should be able to see a hint of rib. There is a link between excess weight and joint issues so trim him down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nekhbet Posted August 18, 2012 Share Posted August 18, 2012 unless you have had proper x-rays done don't go panicking. Puppies are rough and can hurt themselves, rest him for quite a while, keep him thing and no acting like a lunatic for quite a few weeks. ED/HD is banded about a bit too often these days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MontyMonster Posted August 18, 2012 Author Share Posted August 18, 2012 unless you have had proper x-rays done don't go panicking. Puppies are rough and can hurt themselves, rest him for quite a while, keep him thing and no acting like a lunatic for quite a few weeks. ED/HD is banded about a bit too often these days. Hi Nekhbet, We have not done xrays yet as we only 1st discovered this problem developing last weekend, he is now on restricted duties and rest, and you are not the 1st person to say dont panic. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MontyMonster Posted August 18, 2012 Author Share Posted August 18, 2012 No one else has mentioned this but getting your pup lean will also help him. Lab pups should not be 'roly poly'. You should be able to see a hint of rib. There is a link between excess weight and joint issues so trim him down. Yep I know I have got to watch his weight, he has even gained a little this week due to not having his daily walk and play, i do find it hard to find a balance of getting enough food to support muscle growth and development but not to much to make him look 'Roly Poly'lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MontyMonster Posted August 18, 2012 Author Share Posted August 18, 2012 If it is OCD/ED the first option would be to put him on a course of Caprofen injections, this helps supply blood to the cartilage(?) that is breaking off and it CAN repair itself. Very strict rest is also needed, and I believe a course of anti-inflams as well. After that surgery is probably the best option. X-rays would probably be required atleast prior to he surgery. It could also be panosteosis which usually resolves itself in time. Does he stand with his feet straight or does he stand with his feet outward? Does he put an even amount of weight on both feet? I have goldens and I take mine off puppy food at about 3 months. I feed Advance usually. Do you mind if i ask what you think the correct amount of food should be for a 6 month lab with this issue, Ive been giving him some lamb flanks/chicken necks as well as a cup of advance morning and night as well. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebanne Posted August 18, 2012 Share Posted August 18, 2012 If it is OCD/ED the first option would be to put him on a course of Caprofen injections, this helps supply blood to the cartilage(?) that is breaking off and it CAN repair itself. Very strict rest is also needed, and I believe a course of anti-inflams as well. After that surgery is probably the best option. X-rays would probably be required atleast prior to he surgery. It could also be panosteosis which usually resolves itself in time. Does he stand with his feet straight or does he stand with his feet outward? Does he put an even amount of weight on both feet? I have goldens and I take mine off puppy food at about 3 months. I feed Advance usually. Do you mind if i ask what you think the correct amount of food should be for a 6 month lab with this issue, Ive been giving him some lamb flanks/chicken necks as well as a cup of advance morning and night as well. Thanks I find lamb flanks very fattening, I give them to dogs to put weight on. Maybe feed some vegies with his dry food to make him think he is getting heaps, or put the dry food in a kong or similar and pop them both in a crate so he has to work for his food but is restricted on how far he can move it around? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salukifan Posted August 18, 2012 Share Posted August 18, 2012 No one else has mentioned this but getting your pup lean will also help him. Lab pups should not be 'roly poly'. You should be able to see a hint of rib. There is a link between excess weight and joint issues so trim him down. Yep I know I have got to watch his weight, he has even gained a little this week due to not having his daily walk and play, i do find it hard to find a balance of getting enough food to support muscle growth and development but not to much to make him look 'Roly Poly'lol If he's getting Advance there's a surplus of nutrition in that. He gains weight from excess calories in the food, not nutrients. Trust me, cutting his food back will not give him malnutrion. If you cannot put your hands flat on his sides and feel rib without pressure, get the weight off. As Rebanne suggests, veggies like mashed or baked pumpkin (no butter :laugh:) will keep him feeling full. If he's a yellow Lab, pumpkin is also meant to help with gold colouring. :) A lean Lab will live longer and remain sounder. Fat labs are also prone to ACL rupture. Keep him lean and you'll have longer with him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted August 18, 2012 Share Posted August 18, 2012 Whatever you are feeding... cut back by 1/4 ..or a half , while he's sedentary . Too easy :) Put kibble in a Kong, or a 600 ml soft drink bottle ..he will enjoy getting it out ..and be satisfied with less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldenWei Posted August 18, 2012 Share Posted August 18, 2012 I don't usually feed anything else other than Advance. Every dog is different and every cup measurement is different. I go by look/feel alone, if they start looking podgy I drop their food back a bit, too thin, and I up it. Mine usually need more during winter as well. I wouldn't be feeding the lamb flaps, a couple of chicken necks should be ok. Approx how much does he weigh? A male golden should put on a maximum of 1kg per week up to the age of about 20 weeks, and then I think its about 3/4 kilo per week for the next 6 weeks, and then it drops down to half a kilo. I expect a lab would be similar. As others have said, don't panic yet, it could just be an injury, but do be mindful of excessive weight gain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MontyMonster Posted August 19, 2012 Author Share Posted August 19, 2012 I don't usually feed anything else other than Advance. Every dog is different and every cup measurement is different. I go by look/feel alone, if they start looking podgy I drop their food back a bit, too thin, and I up it. Mine usually need more during winter as well. I wouldn't be feeding the lamb flaps, a couple of chicken necks should be ok. Approx how much does he weigh? A male golden should put on a maximum of 1kg per week up to the age of about 20 weeks, and then I think its about 3/4 kilo per week for the next 6 weeks, and then it drops down to half a kilo. I expect a lab would be similar. As others have said, don't panic yet, it could just be an injury, but do be mindful of excessive weight gain. He is 6 months old, about 53 cm heigh and weighs 25 kg, so I'm thinking that's about right, I think I read a male lab will average about 30-32 kg when fully grown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MontyMonster Posted August 19, 2012 Author Share Posted August 19, 2012 Oh and I'm also thinking about getting him desexed soon, will that make a difference to his weight /condition - is it true that that can make them gain weight more easy ( or is that an ol wives tale) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 Oh and I'm also thinking about getting him desexed soon, will that make a difference to his weight /condition - is it true that that can make them gain weight more easy ( or is that an ol wives tale) he WILL put on weight , yes. IF you feed him more food than he needs :) Simple. If he is stopped growing and is less active, then he needs less food ... hang off castration for a while, until you are sure what is happening with his front end .IF he needs an anaesthetic ,for xrays or treatment , perhaps a couple of things can be done at the same time .. the less anaesthetic the better . (I had Hamlet done when he had a foreign body removed from his gut) ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salukifan Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 Oh and I'm also thinking about getting him desexed soon, will that make a difference to his weight /condition - is it true that that can make them gain weight more easy ( or is that an ol wives tale) If you have concerns about his joints then I strongly recommend you hold off on desexing until he is a little more physically mature. 12-14 months would be good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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