Romana Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 (edited) Hello, I hope someone can give fast advice: A friend just called me - her White Shepherd girl is just in the process of giving birth to her first puppies. The first one was born fully developed but dead, last night short after 9pm. Between midnight and noon, three healthy living puppies were born, plus 3 dead ones, who were obviously not fully developed and were covered in a black substance, especially their mouths and tongues were totally black (not light pink as it should be) and the black colour was inside the gums and flesh, couldn't be washed off like from the coat. Does anyone have an idea what that could be? My friend doesn't want to call the vet yet, as there may be some more pups to come and she doesn't want to interrupt the natural process. It is their first litter. I hope that someone may have a quick answer!? Edited August 14, 2012 by Romana Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 (edited) Your friend really needs vet advice ASAP .... at least a phone call . It seems to me that whelping has gone on for a very long time ..... sad outcome Edited August 14, 2012 by persephone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetson Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 Sorry can't help but how horrible for her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rozzie Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 (edited) Obviously the natural procees is not happening as it should. I hope she has already got the dog to the vet. Edited August 14, 2012 by Rozzie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SparkyTansy Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 She should definitely be calling a vet for advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dame Aussie Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 Vet!!!! Now! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
k9angel Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 I hope your friend got her to a vet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romana Posted August 14, 2012 Author Share Posted August 14, 2012 The problem has been resolved, thank you for your answers - I actually just called my own vet (I am a breeder and have faster and cheaper access to vets than my mentoree) and my vet said that it can be quite 'normal' especially in large breeds that they have one or a few stillborn puppies in their litters, and also that birth giving can take quite a long time. (As far as I know the young mother hasn't had any contractions any more for the last two+ hours, so it seems to be over). "As long as the bitch behaves normally and does not show any signs of distress and will eat well and not have any unusual discharge from her vulva in the next few days, which needs to be monitored carefully," the vet says, "there is no need for medical action." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 "As long as the bitch behaves normally and does not show any signs of distress and will eat well and not have any unusual discharge from her vulva in the next few days, which needs to be monitored carefully," the vet says, "there is no need for medical action." Oh ? So, no post whelping check of bitch & whelps is to be done at all ? I thought that was routine ..(or, it always used to be, )...especially after still births with an unknown cause , and a first litter . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minimax Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 The problem has been resolved, thank you for your answers - I actually just called my own vet (I am a breeder and have faster and cheaper access to vets than my mentoree) and my vet said that it can be quite 'normal' especially in large breeds that they have one or a few stillborn puppies in their litters, and also that birth giving can take quite a long time. (As far as I know the young mother hasn't had any contractions any more for the last two+ hours, so it seems to be over). "As long as the bitch behaves normally and does not show any signs of distress and will eat well and not have any unusual discharge from her vulva in the next few days, which needs to be monitored carefully," the vet says, "there is no need for medical action." She's been birthing since 9.30pm in her first litter and the vet doesn't even want to look at her? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SparkyTansy Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 I'd definitely be getting a post whelping check plus with so many stillborns I'd want to have the live ones checked for any signs of chest issues/infections etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bjelkier Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 I'd definitely be getting a post whelping check plus with so many stillborns I'd want to have the live ones checked for any signs of chest issues/infections etc. So would I. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smisch Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 I'd be getting them checked out as well.. Not to be negative but if your mentoree hadn't got the money for a vet check she probably shouldn't be breeding period.. It's important for the bitch and pups to have access to vetinary care.. I just hope for her sake it's nothing too major Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romana Posted August 14, 2012 Author Share Posted August 14, 2012 I hope so, too. I will definitely recommend a vet check in the next few days. Better once too many than one too few. Thanks once again for all your concern and your advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 I will definitely recommend a vet check in the next few days. Better once too many than one too few. Not meaning to sound smart .. but today would be a more appropriate time for a post whelp check ..to palpate the abdomen, and check for retained foetuses/placentas ..to see the discharge , to check bitch's general health , to examine a stillborn and make a tentative diagnosis, and to examine thoroughly the babies to rule out any deformities/inhaled fluid etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nekhbet Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 half the litter born dead and the vet doesnt see it as an issue? I would be finding another vet. Something is not right between the length of whelping and the amount of stillborn is a bad sign right there. Just remember to let your mentoree know that the natural process has some nasty outcomes, and if you want live healthy dogs you need to intervene. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 half the litter born dead and the vet doesnt see it as an issue? I would be finding another vet. *nods* that's a bit scary, actually ........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minimax Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 half the litter born dead and the vet doesnt see it as an issue? I would be finding another vet. *nods* that's a bit scary, actually ........ And the supposedly experienced breeder also doesn't see an issue with it??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minimax Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 Uhm, was this the bitch with the weird heat cycles from this thread - http://www.dolforums.com.au/topic/238028-heat-cycles-only-1-month-apart/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 Uhm, was this the bitch with the weird heat cycles from this thread - http://www.dolforums...-1-month-apart/ Oh * goes to read* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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