Ayen Chen - Dog Owner Fined

[Cat]

Oh dear....M-sass...you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. I would strongly suggest you do more research on Training, breeds and breeding before you come here and spout garbage.

And congratulations on once again missing the point.

I know I don't have to worry about my dogs being scooped up by the ranger mis-identified as Pitbulls so that bit of research I did right :D

Nice. Way to dodge the real issues. I think I'll leave this thread before I call someone something that will get me banned.

Edited August 6, 2012 by Cat

[TheCheekyMonster]

Oh dear....M-sass...you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. I would strongly suggest you do more research on Training, breeds and breeding before you come here and spout garbage.

And congratulations on once again missing the point.

I know I don't have to worry about my dogs being scooped up by the ranger mis-identified as Pitbulls so that bit of research I did right :D

Nice. Way to dodge the real issues. I think I'll leave this thread before I call someone something that will get me banned.

:laugh:

[moosmum]

Oh dear....M-sass...you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. I would strongly suggest you do more research on Training, breeds and breeding before you come here and spout garbage.

And congratulations on once again missing the point.

m-mass what expertise/qualification do you have to be making such comments about dog behaviour, aggression and training?

The only valid qualifications I am aware of is a veterinary behaviourist, that's not me, experience training 38 years........what comments are you referring to here??

M-Sass might have 38 yrs experience training their own dogs.

[moosmum]

I am speaking "aggression" in my comment of stable dogs not needing socialisation, do you think the default behaviour of all unsocialised dogs is aggression...........it's not trust me??

GSD, Rott's, Dobe's etc are not hunting dogs with blinding aggression, the reason they don't use them for those roles, big difference between guarding instinct and killing machines. Morons won't use herders to provide the aggression they are looking for because they have to train them or find fear biters and what breeders of constantly hard herders trainable in defence and attack will sell to morons??.

Pure breeds have a recognised standard..........unstable aggression is a breed fault in the major working breeds, there is a defence to their existance if the odd one does bite someone, but what's the standard for a Bully crossbreed which may be killing machine who knows, where is the defence in the standards of a crossbreed??

Default beahvior..? it depends on the situation, you can't say that a dog that has never done anything wrong or displayed aggression has a default behavior, if it did then it would've shown it many times!!

Hunting dogs do not have blinding aggression, i have no idea where you get your ideas from from?!

Unbalanced dogs of any breed are a problem. not just bull breeds, you need to get your head around that.

My reference to default behaviour is aggression of unsocialised dogs which some seem to think is the case, nothing to do with situations either all unsocialised dogs are aggressive or they are not??

Yes, unbalanced dogs of any breed are a potential problem in the community I agree, but there is difference, unbalanced pure breeds by the standard are duds, unbalanced dogs with no standard to follow as in cross breeds could be just that, a poor genetic combination of breed mixtures.

So,your solution is to ban cross breds.Any bites after that are o.k 'cos they are just boo boos.Ooops!

No one here has said all unsocialised dogs are aggressive.

Given the lack of skill the average person has in interpreting dog behaviour,I think your assertion that well bred,sound dogs don't need socialisation is irresponsible and dangerous.

Edited August 6, 2012 by moosmum

[Sheridan]

The essential problem with threads like this is that every single one of them becomes about m-sass not about the issue. It's all about the audience m-sass can get and it seems the more abusive, the better m-sass likes it. I suggest we all deprive m-sass of the audience fix and put m-sass on ignore.

[moosmum]

Its the wise move. :laugh:

[sandgrubber]

My reference to default behaviour is aggression of unsocialised dogs which some seem to think is the case, nothing to do with situations either all unsocialised dogs are aggressive or they are not??

Yes, unbalanced dogs of any breed are a potential problem in the community I agree, but there is difference, unbalanced pure breeds by the standard are duds, unbalanced dogs with no standard to follow as in cross breeds could be just that, a poor genetic combination of breed mixtures.

I disagree. If I decide to, say, put my Labbie bitch to a kelpie dog, knowing that the F1 cross of Lab and kelpie are generally good dogs, more placid than kelpies, but better in hot weather than Labbies (they were preferred dogs for scent work in Vietnam), I would not have a written, exterior standard, but I'd have a clear set of expectations and I'd know which dogs were duds. (I wouldn't do this cross, but in my time in Australia, I had several requests for pups of this cross). Likewise, those crossing pit bulls to mastiffs to get greater gameness in the mastiff have a very clear standard they are looking for . . . a pretty dangerous one in my books.

With respect to purebred dogs, far too few cull the temperament duds. Not hard to find a titled Lab who doesn't retrieve and doesn't like water.

Nor do I believe all attacking dogs are unbalanced. Some are steady dogs, bred to attack and sent into attack mode by some signal . . . perhaps an unintended signal. A friend of mine rescued a schutz trained guard dog. They had to confine it when people came to the house cause it interpreted some specific hand gesture as a command to attack . . . and it would do so if someone unintentionally made that gesture. This dog wasn't unstable. It was trained to a dangerous behaviour.

[sandgrubber]

The essential problem with threads like this is that every single one of them becomes about m-sass not about the issue. It's all about the audience m-sass can get and it seems the more abusive, the better m-sass likes it. I suggest we all deprive m-sass of the audience fix and put m-sass on ignore.

I think the problem is reactive and unstable people misreading nuance -- or deliberately doing so -- and other people using provocative language. If everyone stuck to the real issues and didn't get roused by phrases like 'crap dog', the discussion would become relatively dull and academic. I suspect that the human equivalent of a dog fight often occurs cause people just like to argue.

[m-sass]

The essential problem with threads like this is that every single one of them becomes about m-sass not about the issue. It's all about the audience m-sass can get and it seems the more abusive, the better m-sass likes it. I suggest we all deprive m-sass of the audience fix and put m-sass on ignore.

I am merely sharing my opinion on the situation........should I just agree with what other's are saying.......sorry I don't

[geo]

I am merely sharing my opinion on the situation........should I just agree with what other's are saying.......sorry I don't

You're entitled to your opinion, most people disagree with it and you do not seem to learn anything from their posts.

What I am worried about though is when there are all these people out there with similar notions as yourself who will tell anyone who will listen and count themselves as knowledgeable in that area.

This only serves to confuse the public on dangerous dog issues, perpetuate myths about pitbulls or hunting dogs and doesn't go anywhere to solving the real issues.

[sandgrubber]

The essential problem with threads like this is that every single one of them becomes about m-sass not about the issue. It's all about the audience m-sass can get and it seems the more abusive, the better m-sass likes it. I suggest we all deprive m-sass of the audience fix and put m-sass on ignore.

I am merely sharing my opinion on the situation........should I just agree with what other's are saying.......sorry I don't

You need not agree . . . I agree with some of the directions you are coming from. But more thoughtful and civil language would result in a more productive -- and less inflamed -- discussion. Don't bait 'em and they won't rise to the bait.

Edited August 7, 2012 by sandgrubber