Plan B Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 (edited) I'm not entirely sure if this is the right section for this but here goes. Horse, the dog, is currently at Renbury. He is a Great Dane cross and, as you can imagine, quite huge. This boy was tagged for Rescue but that Rescue has since taken their tag off of him as he did not pass their Behaviourist's assessment today. I'm not entirely sure of what that assessment involved, only that there were apparent negative results. Considering that feedback, Horse is now reclaim/rescue only. We got our Behaviourist out to the farm. He spent about 40 minutes with him, assessing him in a variety of different ways. The feedback he has given us is that, at that time, Horse displayed no negative reactions - even when confronted with a smaller dog, which had been a concern beforehand. This isn't to say that Horse doesn't have negative behaviours at all - only that he did not display any during the assessment. One thing that was recommend, and it's quite an obvious thing, is that due to his sheer size, he will need someone experienced and capable of handling him. Our Behaviourist has said that he is definitely workable but needs to be in a home that can handle this kind of dog. While we would love to take him on and assess him further, we do not have the experienced carers available. We would welcome anyone who does have that experience to contact us if they are not attached to a Rescue Group already who can help and are interested in possibly fostering this boy. For any groups out there that may be able to consider this boy, as a favor to us our Behaviourist has offered his ongoing help with Horse at a reduced Rescue rate, if that is needed. The option is available for Horse to go to his place for two weeks, as a sort of Bootcamp, and somewhere he can fully assess and work with this boy - or the other option is, if someone takes Horse into their home, and provided they do not live too far away, our Behaviourist can visit them about three times a week to assist them in his training and handling. I do have to point out that although our Behaviourist assessed him, and he found no negative behaviours, that doesn't mean they are not there. This is why further assessments would be recommended. Horse is due on Tuesday. From what we have been able to gather, the only thing holding him back is his size. If anyone can accommodate that, whether with us or another group, please do see if you can help. We will help in any way we can. If you need to email us, our address is [email protected]. Cheers. EDIT: The Renbury team will know a lot more about his behaviour over the past week so anyone interested should definitely get in touch with them also. Edited July 27, 2012 by Plan B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frenzied1 Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 He is so handsome. We were looking at him as he is the dead ringer for a dog ARF rehomed recently, the only difference was that the pigment around the nose was different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sas Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 He was dumped at our Behaviourists that has advised he is highly dog aggressive, extremely strong who pays no attention to correction. He would only be 'safe' with a trained professional imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WreckitWhippet Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 If there are any doubts, the dog should not be released to the public, be it "rescue or other wise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plan B Posted July 27, 2012 Author Share Posted July 27, 2012 At present, everyone who has come to us with information about Horse, that have been around him and/or assessed him, hasn't displayed any doubts. Sas, would you be able to message or email me with your Behaviourists details so we can contact them? Any further information would be much appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Her Majesty Dogmad Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 He was dumped at our Behaviourists that has advised he is highly dog aggressive, extremely strong who pays no attention to correction. He would only be 'safe' with a trained professional imo. That is extremely concerning. I've been pulled over by a strong kelpie when working at the AWL and dragged some distance. With a dog this size, many people could end up in the same position and if he's trying to get to another dog, anything could happen. He looks very similar to another dog I've come across that is also extremely dog aggressive. You have to think if anyone takes this dog on that they could be liable in the future should they rehome him and something happens. You can pay someone's vet bills if their dog survives an attack by one so huge but how do you amend the psychological damage, especially if their dog doesn't survive which would be highly likely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plan B Posted July 27, 2012 Author Share Posted July 27, 2012 I think it's important to mention that several people watched our Behaviourist with Horse today at the farm and saw how well he was responding to corrections and commands. There's absolutely no need to be speculating about this boy based on him being similar to an aggressive dog you once knew. It is reckless and unfair to this individual dog. Comments like these help nobody. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sas Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 At present, everyone who has come to us with information about Horse, that have been around him and/or assessed him, hasn't displayed any doubts. Sas, would you be able to message or email me with your Behaviourists details so we can contact them? Any further information would be much appreciated. Not really any further information available. Dog was dumped at the Behaviourist property, it was taken to Rossmore Vets and then transferred to Renbury. During the short time it was on the property it showed to be highly dog aggressive going from zero to hero very quickly and showed to be extremely strong paying no attention to correction. Sorry, can't really assist you anymore than that. Normally in these situations I would reccomend for a Professional Behaviourist to assess the dog if a person was looking at taking it, you've already had your Behaviourist assess the dog. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melzawelza Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 (edited) I think it's important to mention that several people watched our Behaviourist with Horse today at the farm and saw how well he was responding to corrections and commands. There's absolutely no need to be speculating about this boy based on him being similar to an aggressive dog you once knew. It is reckless and unfair to this individual dog. Comments like these help nobody. This. Also, I'm 4 foot 11 high and 56 kilos and have never, ever been pulled over by a dog, let alone something as small as a Kelpie. Big dogs can be managed well with the correct training and tools (if needed), and staying tuned in to their behaviour so they don't catch you by surprise, to ensure they aren't pulling anyone over. Edited July 27, 2012 by melzawelza Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sas Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 I think it's important to mention that several people watched our Behaviourist with Horse today at the farm and saw how well he was responding to corrections and commands. I'm not touching him or reccomending any of my Dane folk take him, I have a responsibility to the general public and don't believe dog aggressive dogs should be rehomed. Sorry to sound harsh but we're not talking about chihuahuas and given we have a Professional Behaviouruist that has worked with Dane Rescue for years tell us the dog is highly dog aggressive we'll take his word. If you believe the dog to be safe and work-able then all I can hope is that he is put with suitably experienced people so he is not a danger to the general public's dogs whilst he is undergoing re-training. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Her Majesty Dogmad Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 Sorry I can't be positive about an enormously strong dog that is dog aggressive according to SAS's post above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sas Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 I think it's important to mention that several people watched our Behaviourist with Horse today at the farm and saw how well he was responding to corrections and commands. There's absolutely no need to be speculating about this boy based on him being similar to an aggressive dog you once knew. It is reckless and unfair to this individual dog. Comments like these help nobody. This. Also, I'm 4 foot 11 high and 56 kilos and have never, ever been pulled over by a dog, let alone something as small as a Kelpie. Big dogs can be managed well with the correct training and tools (if needed), and staying tuned in to their behaviour so they don't catch you by surprise, to ensure they aren't pulling anyone over. Knock the personal insults off, that's just rude and unneccessary. You do realise this dog is probably around 70 kilos right? I'm signing out of this thread because it's going to get nasty like others in rescue when people go on with emotion over logic. My last word is a I hope this dog doesn't get into the wrong hands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melzawelza Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 (edited) Nah. Not worth it. Edited July 27, 2012 by melzawelza Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gillbear Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 Did this assessment include interaction with other dogs or was it just the behaviourist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plan B Posted July 27, 2012 Author Share Posted July 27, 2012 I'm not touching him or reccomending any of my Dane folk take him, I have a responsibility to the general public and don't believe dog aggressive dogs should be rehomed. Sorry to sound harsh but we're not talking about chihuahuas and given we have a Professional Behaviouruist that has worked with Dane Rescue for years tell us the dog is highly dog aggressive we'll take his word. If you believe the dog to be safe and work-able then all I can hope is that he is put with suitably experienced people so he is not a danger to the general public's dogs whilst he is undergoing re-training. This is why I asked for further information. As, all I have right now is, this dog was dumped at your Behaviourists', taken to Rossmore, then to Renbury. And there were issues. Whereas, our Behaviourist did assess him and found none of these issues. Not to say they're not there - but people can only go off the information provided and it helps to have a clearer picture of that information to make an informed decision. But right now, nobody's talking about rehoming an unknown dog. People are talking about giving a dog a chance to prove he is rehomable, if those resources are available to do so. And if he is not rehomable, then he should be humanely put to sleep. Whether or not people personally think others should bother is of no concern to me. We were asked if we could and we're asking if others can also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Her Majesty Dogmad Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 (edited) Sorry I can't be positive about an enormously strong dog that is dog aggressive according to SAS's post above. You don't have to be. But the fact that you once knew a dog that looked like this dog that was dog aggressive, and Kelpies can pull you over doesn't really have anything to do with this dog. I "didn't once know" a dog that looked like this and was dog aggressive, I know the dog NOW. Not sure where you presumed it was a long time ago. Just to clarify, I saw the wounds that this particular dog caused to a very solid staffy. It dragged it's handler over to the innocent, nice natured dog walking by and then it was a hell of a job to get this monster off. Many, many stitches and much pain suffered by the solid staffy (weighing in around 25 kilos). A smaller dog would have probably died. My point about a kelpie being able to pull a person over (he wasn't dog aggressive by the way) is that you lose a moment's concentration with a determined dog and you can have a disaster. At the same shelter I also walked Dobermans, Rottweilers, Bull Terriers and other large, strong breeds and never got pulled over but you are right, you must have your wits about you. Should you choose to rescue, rehabilitate and rehome a dog like this, you will be looking for a most incredible owner in every way - right home, right attitude, right ability and so on. They aren't that easy to find. Edited July 27, 2012 by dogmad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plan B Posted July 27, 2012 Author Share Posted July 27, 2012 Did this assessment include interaction with other dogs or was it just the behaviourist. I will find out the specifics for you as I've been a bit rushed tonight and my partner has all the details but yes, there was a small dog test. I just need to clarify what that entailed, as he could only spend a certain amount of time there today. We're hoping he may be able to return tomorrow for a further assessment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plan B Posted July 27, 2012 Author Share Posted July 27, 2012 Should you choose to rescue, rehabilitate and rehome a dog like this, you will be looking for a most incredible owner in every way - right home, right attitude, right ability and so on. They aren't that easy to find. It's even harder to find that exact foster home too. But if you don't ask, you don't get. And if there's a chance that person or Rescue Group is out there, then it may just help a dog. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melzawelza Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 Should you choose to rescue, rehabilitate and rehome a dog like this, you will be looking for a most incredible owner in every way - right home, right attitude, right ability and so on. They aren't that easy to find. It's even harder to find that exact foster home too. But if you don't ask, you don't get. And if there's a chance that person or Rescue Group is out there, then it may just help a dog. I think it's worth realising what Plan B is actually saying here. He's not talking about rehoming the dog or even taking the dog on at this point. He is cautiously listening to what his behaviourist has told him and what others have said and enquiring as to whether there is anywhere suitable for this dog to go to be further assessed and/or retrained. If none of those things line up he will not be rescued and/or rehomed. I don't think there is a big problem here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdierikx Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 Maybe Plan B's behaviourist can be put in touch with sas's behaviourist - then they can discuss together what they each assessed in this dog... and why... Much as I love the big boofers, if there is any worry at all about his predictability or nature, I'd be very leery about taking him on... T. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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