Incident With Loose Dog Last Night

[megan_]

I must be missing something Isn't the dog in her front yard? Why should it be on leash if it is in her yard? I am guessing that the yard is unfenced and you are worried about it rushing on to the footpath?

Sorry it sounds if your approach was confrontational and she has responded in kind. I don't think you have anything to report really.

Dogs are not allowed on your property unless adequately secured - ie either there is suitable fencing that they can't jump over or they are physically restrained. Why should fuzzy need to see this woman's perspective? She was breaking the law, fuzzy was following it.

You obviously don't have a DA dog - taking your dog out is like walking a minefield. If everyone just obeyed the law it would be a stress free experience. I always leash my reactive dog and it has been over a year since she has even growled at a dog because I take steps to control her. However, numpties who think their dog is allowed to do anything make this very, very hard.

Fuzzy - Report her to the council. She has done this twice. I have no sympathy for people who don't make any effort to secure their dogs....and find another walking route.

[Salukifan]

Next time cross the road. If the dog stays on her property, problem solved. If it doesn't, it becomes her problem to deal with.

[fuzzy82]

Could you see another possible perspective on this: a woman was outside with her little dog and a couple walking their reactive dogs approached the house, the little dog displayed a typical territorial response and the reactive dogs started growling and lunging, little dog's owner chased her dog and restrained it whilst the reactive dogs were not removed but instead held on-leash continuing to lunge and growl. The reactive dog's owner then had the audacity to complain that the little dog was not on leash on its own property.

I'm not faulting you and I understand it is difficult to walk reactive dogs but I just wanted to provide another viewpoint that might help you understand the other dog owner's response.

I see what you're trying to say, but it didn't unfold that way. We didn't see the dog as we were walking along. As soon as we noticed it when it stopped and growled and bark at us, we stopped. One of my dogs went over the top and barked several times, so I picked her up to keep her quiet. My other dog then sat quietly and watched as my hubby went up to the woman with the dog. The dog I left on the ground is the reactive one, so he's been taught to do an auto-sit whenever he sees something. We then stayed in that spot with my dogs quiet until the woman had caught her dog and hubby signalled that it was ok to proceed. I carried one dog past, while keeping the one on the ground on a short leash, and he walked reasonably calmly, until we were past the house.

[fuzzy82]

Next time cross the road. If the dog stays on her property, problem solved. If it doesn't, it becomes her problem to deal with.

We were across the road.

[mixeduppup]

Next time cross the road. If the dog stays on her property, problem solved. If it doesn't, it becomes her problem to deal with.

We were across the road.

And the dog was that far away and barking and still didn't leave its yard? What's the problem?

[megan_]

Could you see another possible perspective on this: a woman was outside with her little dog and a couple walking their reactive dogs approached the house, the little dog displayed a typical territorial response and the reactive dogs started growling and lunging, little dog's owner chased her dog and restrained it whilst the reactive dogs were not removed but instead held on-leash continuing to lunge and growl. The reactive dog's owner then had the audacity to complain that the little dog was not on leash on its own property.

I'm not faulting you and I understand it is difficult to walk reactive dogs but I just wanted to provide another viewpoint that might help you understand the other dog owner's response.

Sorry but this post makes me want to cry - because it is the way that most people with friendly dogs think. Fuzzy was obeying the law, the other owner wasn't. Why do people think it is okay for their friendly dogs to do as they please?

[Dame Aussie]

Next time cross the road. If the dog stays on her property, problem solved. If it doesn't, it becomes her problem to deal with.

We were across the road.

And the dog was that far away and barking and still didn't leave its yard? What's the problem?

I think, and I could be wrong, that fuzzy was worried the dog WOULD leave it's yard and so didn't want to walk past until it was secured.

[fuzzy82]

I must be missing something Isn't the dog in her front yard? Why should it be on leash if it is in her yard? I am guessing that the yard is unfenced and you are worried about it rushing on to the footpath?

Sorry it sounds if your approach was confrontational and she has responded in kind. I don't think you have anything to report really.

Dogs are not allowed on your property unless adequately secured - ie either there is suitable fencing that they can't jump over or they are physically restrained. Why should fuzzy need to see this woman's perspective? She was breaking the law, fuzzy was following it.

You obviously don't have a DA dog - taking your dog out is like walking a minefield. If everyone just obeyed the law it would be a stress free experience. I always leash my reactive dog and it has been over a year since she has even growled at a dog because I take steps to control her. However, numpties who think their dog is allowed to do anything make this very, very hard.

Fuzzy - Report her to the council. She has done this twice. I have no sympathy for people who don't make any effort to secure their dogs....and find another walking route.

Thanks. My reactive dog is pretty good these days, 99% of the time on walks he's better behaved than most other dogs we encounter. The only time he reacts is when idiots let their off leash dogs run right up to him on walks, which happened a couple of weeks ago. We were out walking in a bush area, they were off leash, and I saw a guy with 2 dogs approaching. I immediately called my dogs back and put them on leash, then went about 5 metres off the path. The guy only put one of his dogs back on leash, leaving the other one off leash and free to approach us, which it did. I called out to him to call his dog back, he ignored me. So I called out again, and at this point I was holding my reactive dog back to stop him from starting a fight, he was growling and trying to lunge. The guy did nothing, except told me to "just keep walking". So once again I told him to call his dog back, he ignored me. I then called out that he should be able to call his dog back if he's gonna have it off leash, but he just kept walking and ignored me and eventually the dog followed him.

So yeah, very little tolerance for idiots these days.

[Salukifan]

Next time cross the road. If the dog stays on her property, problem solved. If it doesn't, it becomes her problem to deal with.

We were across the road.

And the dog was that far away and barking and still didn't leave its yard? What's the problem?

I agree. If you have issues controlling dogs reacting from that distance, I think it's unreasonable to expect other people to solve the problem. Time for some desenstisatuon training.

[fuzzy82]

Next time cross the road. If the dog stays on her property, problem solved. If it doesn't, it becomes her problem to deal with.

We were across the road.

And the dog was that far away and barking and still didn't leave its yard? What's the problem?

I think, and I could be wrong, that fuzzy was worried the dog WOULD leave it's yard and so didn't want to walk past until it was secured.

That's right, we're not gonna just stroll past a dog that has barked and growled at us, and which the owner has no control over. That's like asking for trouble. How could anyone even think that we would do that?

We were still about 30 metres away and across the road when the dog stopped and growled at us. How is it a good idea to keep walking at that point?

[fuzzy82]

Next time cross the road. If the dog stays on her property, problem solved. If it doesn't, it becomes her problem to deal with.

We were across the road.

And the dog was that far away and barking and still didn't leave its yard? What's the problem?

I agree. If you have issues controlling dogs reacting from that distance, I think it's unreasonable to expect other people to solve the problem. Time for some desenstisatuon training.

If you read my post above, you will see that my dogs are pretty good. They don't react to people or dogs on walks unless they're in our face. This situation was something out of the ordinary, and I controlled my dogs. They lunged and barked a few times because there was something unusual happening, so I picked one up and kept the other on a short leash and in a sit until the woman had her dog under control.

Why aren't you suggesting that the woman with the untrained off leash dog does some recall training?

Edited July 2, 2012 by fuzzy82

[megan_]

Dogs are allowed to be offleash in their own property.

Not true - only if it is adequately fenced.

Not having a go at you but seriously - how many dog owners here don't know the laws that apply to them? It is very easy for a dog to cross a road to have a go/say hello to another one. It has happened to me a few times.

This is the very reason why dogs get more and more reactive. With every incident the behavior becomes more ingrained. Sure, you can work on making things better, but in order to do that you need to keep your dog below the threshold. With the "don't worry he's friendly" crowd letting their dogs do whatever they want, this is very hard to achieve.

Haredown Whippets - I'm genuinely surprised at the position you've taken. I've always thought you were a stickler for the law.

[Atanquin]

I don't think you hv e anything to report sorry I have had alot of dogs rush out and growl bark and act aggressive to wards me in the middle of the street, but they were off their property so that is able to be reported.

But as the dog was still on its property I'm sure nothing would come of it as she may have a invisible fence.

[RallyValley]

If I had my reactive dog in this situation I would have kept walking better to get past the reacting dog as quickly as possible, especially if there were two adults, I would give one my friendly dog ask them to block or grab the little dog should it leave it's property.

Edited July 2, 2012 by RallyValley

[Salukifan]

That's right, we're not gonna just stroll past a dog that has barked and growled at us, and which the owner has no control over. That's like asking for trouble. How could anyone even think that we would do that?

We were still about 30 metres away and across the road when the dog stopped and growled at us. How is it a good idea to keep walking at that point?

Well, from a behavioural standpoint, you're already within the threshold distance that's triggered the other dog and your dog's reaction. How is remaining within that threshold distance helping?

If you want to difuse the situation, get beyond that distance - for both the other dog and yours. I never understand why people think the best solution to these situations is to stop and THEN place their dog's in a more vulnerable position by asking them to sit or drop.

Why aren't you suggesting that the woman with the untrained off leash dog does some recall training?

I would have thought that was blindingly obvious. The woman with the untrained offleash dog isn't the one posting. She doesn't think she has a problem. You can't control her behaviour or that of her dog. That leaves it up to you.

Next time keep going. If the dog comes across the road, my guess is you're going to see a lot more interest and motivtion to do something by the other dog's owner. Then if it comes one of you takes both dogs and the other gets between the oncoming dog and yours... I'd be prepared to put the boot in and you'd be legally justified in doing so. THEN you'll have someting to report. Right now, you've got zip.

Edited July 2, 2012 by Haredown Whippets

[fuzzy82]

I don't think you hv e anything to report sorry I have had alot of dogs rush out and growl bark and act aggressive to wards me in the middle of the street, but they were off their property so that is able to be reported.

But as the dog was still on its property I'm sure nothing would come of it as she may have a invisible fence.

Yeah, I'm thinking there's no point reporting it. Doubt that there's an invisible fence though, it seemed more like the woman had taken the dog out the front to let it run around for a bit. Why else would she be hanging out with it out the front? And if there was a fence and the woman knew the dog wouldn't run up to us, why did she try to grab it?

[MishB]

I'd just keep walking with my own dogs & ignore her & her dog unless it comes over the road towards you now.

It sounds like you stopped because you didn't want either a doggy confrontation or her dog running across the road, if she is confident her dog won't leave her property then there's nothing you can do, well intentioned or not.

My dog will bark & growl at ppl walking past, but if he is out the front he is on a long line & can't get loose. Some ppl do get a bit scared when they see him, obviously thinking he is off lead so I can understand how you would stop & wait while her dog was contained to avoid a possible catastrophe.

On the flip side, I can see how she could have misread the situation and perhaps thought you were being rude or confrontational. If someone came in to my front yard & told me how to handle my dog I'd react badly, regardless of how my dog was behaving. It's like critising someone's parenting in their own house IMO. Even if they are crap I wouldn't say a word unless I had no choice!

Edited July 2, 2012 by Nariko

[fuzzy82]

That's right, we're not gonna just stroll past a dog that has barked and growled at us, and which the owner has no control over. That's like asking for trouble. How could anyone even think that we would do that?

We were still about 30 metres away and across the road when the dog stopped and growled at us. How is it a good idea to keep walking at that point?

Well, from a behavioural standpoint, you're already within the threshold distance that's triggered the other dog and your dog's reaction. How is remaining within that threshold distance helping?

If you want to difuse the situation, get beyond that distance - for both the other dog and yours. I never understand why people think the best solution to these situations is to stop and THEN place their dog's in a more vulnerable position by asking them to sit or drop.

I didn't ask him to sit, he does an auto-sit due to the training he's had. He was sitting quietly, he chose to sit on his own, and we just waited for the woman to grab her dog. I could have tried to drag him away to help get the other dog below threshold, but as he was sitting quietly and the leash was loose, it would have caused more stress to try to drag him. I was carrying my other dog, so I wasn't in a position to get down and entice him to follow me.

And if the other dog hadn't been off leash it wouldn't have happened anyway. My dogs don't really care about other dogs that are on leash. The only reason they cared was because it was running around.

[megan_]

I wouldn't have kept moving forward (moving your dog closer to hers). Rather I would have turned around and walked the other way. It would have made for a shorter, more boring walk, but it is safer.

FWIW I'd report someone with an uncontained dog. She obviously isn't going to stop.

[Dxenion]

I'd be really interested to hear what the ranger thinks regarding the dog rushing at you while it was on it's property and you were passing across the road. You could pose it to them as a hypothetical question if you don't want to make an actual report yet.

I have two reactive dogs that have been attacked. One has been attacked on two occassions by dogs running off the property onto the road so I understand your response to stop and wait until the situation is safe before continuing. That's what we do too.

Desensitising training and working within the dog's threshold takes backwards steps if another dog not under your control enters that space when your own dog is not ready for it. Crossing the road shows an attempt by the OP to keep the reactive dog within it's threshold.

I expect that when I take my reactive dogs for a walk down the street, people in the street will have their dogs on a leash as required by law and that dogs on a property will stay there. Sadly time and time again this is not the case and when I remind these offenders of the law, I'm the one that gets the dirty looks.