Crate Or Crate + Pen

[bigbadwolf]

hello guys

im getting my puppy in the coming week and i am in dilemma. i am quite lost as to how crates and crates in a pen work. i scoured various dog forums and the pictures dog owners share tell me that some only have a crate, some put their crates in the pen.

i understand dogs dont soil their den when you pick an appropriate sized crate.

then i thought what if i were to be nice and give the puppy more space by putting the crate in a pen, will he take the pen area as his backyard and decide to take a leak there. preferably i'll like his area to be as small as possible while not being cruel but would it be too small for a puppy to play or chew his chew toys inside? the puppy will definitely have space to sleep but not sure about other activities.

what do you guys do for your new puppies?

[Sandra777]

To me it would depend on what sized pup, how long it's going to be confined and what other arrangements you can make for it's toileting.

If you have a small breed puppy you need to leave alone for 8-10 hours while you work then a crate is obviously out of the question and the pen would be it

s back yard as you mentioned with the crate providing a separate space for it's bed. In these circumstances I think most people would provide an alternative to just paper or tiles for toileting such as a piece of turf in a tray or artifical turf or a indoor dog toilet.

Me, my pups are outside in a fenced area with their toys and kennel so they never get in the habit of thinking toileting inside is OK. When we're home they're out and not crated, they are confined to their puppy run if we need to put them somewhere out of the way while we're home. Obviously this isn't going to suit everyone. They are crated later in life, 4 or so months old onwards, at night but when we're away from home our dogs are in runs with kennels.

[persephone]

Hi .. getting a pup is exciting, and also means lots of learning for YOU :)

crates can be useful overnight , and for short periods during the day , but are not a good idea as a long term thing puppies need to run & play & be outside and learn quickly to toilet outdoors .

There are puppy pens which are great - and a crate should be a puppy's 'den'/bed .

There is lots of discussion on using crates . (I have never used a crate , and have had quite a few pups inside), but I can see how they would be very useful in some situations :)

The following LINKS have much info for you ... What sort of pup are you getting? How old? Where has it been living/toileting at the breeders?

LINK

LINK

LINK

[bigbadwolf]

i am a student so im home most of the week. lessons would take me away for about 3-4 hours, 2 - 3 times a week depending.

im mostly home but i have work to do every now and then. i thought he can occupy himself with toys when im busy, we'll be in the same room so he can see me. when im not busy i'll play and train him.

he'll be 8 weeks when he comes, would a total of 4 hours/day of play be too exhausting? im always reminding myself its still a baby so nothing too vigorous. i might be being over cautious here for no reason.

since im always home and he will be following me about the house supervised i thought a pen would be redundant. correct me if i am wrong, sometimes what i think is ok isnt exactly right.

cheers

[erinonthefarm]

I'm getting a puppy this week too,

I use a crate and a puppy pen, I'm home most of the time so I crate at night, in the morning straight out to the toilet, play, breakfast, toilet then rest in the crate and follow that cycle all day.

Crate's make housetraining easier and quicker, as long as you don't leave the pup in for too long and it learns to soil the crate.

The only time I use a pen is for if I'm going to be away for longer than the pup can hold on and then the puppy is given a bone to chew on and some toys stuffed with food in the pen, and also with the crate in the pen so they have somewhere familiar to sleep.

I used this method with my last dog, with dogs before that no crate but I used the laundry like a pen. My current dog only had 2 accidents in the house, and that was when he hit adolescence and started marking!

As far as exercise, gentle play for as long as the pup is interested or better yet training which is much more tiring for a puppy, is fine and makes for a happier puppy! Just don't do long walks, play excessive retrieval games or rough tugging as that might hurt the puppy's back and ligaments. A bone to chew on is good exercise for a puppy too

Good luck, put some photos up of your puppy too please

[Christina]

If you can pop pup in a fair size laundry or safe uncarpeted room when you are out I would forget crates & pens.

Main purpose or pens/crates to me is for safety if I can't watch them.

The theory of crate for toilet use is that the pup can only lie down/stand up/turn & thats it. The theory being they won't soil their bed & will cry to go out.

I think pup may soil bed, especially if you don't hear it & let it out instantly. Not the way I would want to keep my pup but thats the theory.

Little babes need to pee a lot, especially small breeds. Fake grass, puppy training pads & newspaper are all aids to teaching the smaller ones that can help.

Enjoy your pup & use methods that you feel comfortable with, one pup is easy

Multi dog places & breeders may have to do it differently.

[mumof4girls]

Crates are fantastic i would definitely say crate train and not just for toilet either..

Those links posted will explain a lot :-) we made a run for rogue we had left over fencing so made one using those and had crate inside also . We then moved him downstairs under our deck in a run ..

He sleeps upsatiars at night in his crate ( he loves his crate) and outside in run during the day..

He will sleep a lot during the day hopefully :-) I would put him if you can in a quiet room so he gets rest while your home if you can..

Good luck :-)

[Nadsi]

I did crate and pen until Maverick stopped going to the toilet at night for about a week. We had his crate with a cover, comfy blankets and soft toys, a chew like a bully stick or pig's ear, a fan on the crate if it was hot, a radio on in the room to keep him company and the pen was fairly small, just big enough to leave a metre between his crate and the newspaper toileting area (no room to play or run around, just enough to toddle out and pee/poop).

Giving puppy a chew at night is the best thing you can do in my opinion, it does magical things for settling them down! Without a chew, there would be hours of whining before they wore out, with a chew, there's a good while of munching away, then maybe a little whine for a minute, then sleep.

It took Maverick a few weeks to stop toileting during the night, which was expected, his bladder was only tiny! He hasn't had an accident in his crate ever. It's best to take them out for a toilet time right before you crate the puppy, as in go outside then IMMEDIATELY take him to bed once he's done his business, then get up early to take him out again.

EDIT: With my 5 month old puppy I brought home recently, similar deal, but I just used the crate after a night of discovering he was pretty well toilet trained. That first night in the crate I forgot a chew, so there was a very unhappy dog in his crate, but the second night I gave him a chew, and not a sound was to be heard, and it's been like that since. Chews = good night sleep.

TL;DR: Take them to the toilet immediately before bed, a chew will help them self-sooth, make the crate and pen area too small for play but big enough to keep sleep and toilet areas separate.

Edited May 25, 2012 by Nadsi

[Riddick]

We bought a crate when we had our last dog and decided to use it again.

What we were after was for him to be an inside dog, so a crate would give him his own place to be.

He was doing just so well then one night he decided he wanted nothing more to do with it.

Better say that the crate was for a medium dog and Murphy at that time had plenty of room.

We put up with his crying for 2 nights after the first 3 months of loving it.

One night I took him out to go to the toilet and called him after he had finished as I always did.

He just looked at me and really showed me that he didn't want to come back in.

So I went inside and I heard no running paw sounds on the veranda, so I knew this was his idea and not mine.

Yes I could have forced him in but I just thought he wants it this way.

He has been outside since this night.

He still comes inside during the day but a lot of his time is outside as he wished for.

Crates are a good thing to use and I know in America they use them more than we do.

I would have liked it to have been a place for him inside, but no.

So if you want to use it just make sure this is their safe place to be.

If you have kids make sure they leave the dog alone while in there.