Puppy Schools ..

[persephone]

I was talking about this today ..and, never having been to one - I only had a couple of ideas..one was watching that small/shy puppies don't get bounced on/bullied by larger/more outgoing ones .

the other was vacc's and cleanliness.

What do you look for /expect ?

[Pretty Miss Emma]

I like one that is run by someone who is a trainer (ie has experience in dog training and has had some training in how to run such classes - usually formal training but not a necessity) not by whoever was asked within a vet clinic to do it. I also like to know the structure of the classes (what exercises will be practised, will there be play time, if there is play time how is it managed). I prefer to know a bit about the trainers training philosophy (positive, corrective, etc), but at the same time I'll do what fits in with my own philosophy - but it's a bit of a waste of time if what they do completely contradicts what I do. And do they try to have class sizes that are not too big and not too small with a mixture of different sized puppies. But I view puppy school mainly as an exercise in socialisation to people, puppies and places for me it is not about formal training so maybe that changes my view of what I'm looking for. Agree with the cleanliness and vaccinations.

And as per most things like this, recommendation from others was really important to me.

[LizT]

I like one that is run by someone who is a trainer (ie has experience in dog training and has had some training in how to run such classes - usually formal training but not a necessity) not by whoever was asked within a vet clinic to do it. I also like to know the structure of the classes (what exercises will be practised, will there be play time, if there is play time how is it managed). I prefer to know a bit about the trainers training philosophy (positive, corrective, etc), but at the same time I'll do what fits in with my own philosophy - but it's a bit of a waste of time if what they do completely contradicts what I do. And do they try to have class sizes that are not too big and not too small with a mixture of different sized puppies. But I view puppy school mainly as an exercise in socialisation to people, puppies and places for me it is not about formal training so maybe that changes my view of what I'm looking for. Agree with the cleanliness and vaccinations.

And as per most things like this, recommendation from others was really important to me.

I agree, sometimes I almost feel like experienced dog owners need a "Puppy Play Group" rather than Pre-school. Kind of less formal and with less emphansis on the training side and more about social skills. :laugh:

I guess the problem is at that age it really IS all about the training. Also how does one really decide who is experienced enough? Some could have high opinions of their expereience and abilities and other be quite competent but modest.

It certainly is a huge benefit to families with new puppies.

[fuzzy82]

When I got Obi I went to 3 different puppy classes with him. The one I liked the most was one where the puppies are off leash, but taught to focus on the owner and do as they are told, inbetween play break. Occasionally they get to run around with the other puppies, but most of it was about focusing on the owner.

The other had some play time, then obedience stuff the rest of the time. It was alright, nothing special, focused a bit too much on obedience and very little on socialisation.

Then the last one was so bad that I only went twice and got a refund for the remaining two sessions. It was bascially a free for all playgroup where we didn't interact with our puppies at all, they ran around and did whatever they wanted (= the big puppies ran around, the small ones stayed on their owners' laps because they were too scared to play) and the instructor held a monologue about really basic stuff. The first hour he talked about housetraining, the next he talked about diet. I didn't stick around for more.

I have since visited, not attended, one where there is no off leash play, and there is a LOT of focus on general manners and habituation. They expose the puppies to different noises and sights, and when the puppies do meet they are on leash and the owner is actively supervising and teaching them to be polite. There is very little actual obedience, they do recalls and sits, but I think that's about it. It's also a drop in class, which I think is awesome. You pay a set fee and then attend as many classes as you want until your puppy is 5 months old.

[LizT]

When I got Obi I went to 3 different puppy classes with him. The one I liked the most was one where the puppies are off leash, but taught to focus on the owner and do as they are told, inbetween play break. Occasionally they get to run around with the other puppies, but most of it was about focusing on the owner.

The other had some play time, then obedience stuff the rest of the time. It was alright, nothing special, focused a bit too much on obedience and very little on socialisation.

Then the last one was so bad that I only went twice and got a refund for the remaining two sessions. It was bascially a free for all playgroup where we didn't interact with our puppies at all, they ran around and did whatever they wanted (= the big puppies ran around, the small ones stayed on their owners' laps because they were too scared to play) and the instructor held a monologue about really basic stuff. The first hour he talked about housetraining, the next he talked about diet. I didn't stick around for more.

I have since visited, not attended, one where there is no off leash play, and there is a LOT of focus on general manners and habituation. They expose the puppies to different noises and sights, and when the puppies do meet they are on leash and the owner is actively supervising and teaching them to be polite. There is very little actual obedience, they do recalls and sits, but I think that's about it. It's also a drop in class, which I think is awesome. You pay a set fee and then attend as many classes as you want until your puppy is 5 months old.

Such diversity.

I also found the schools that finish after 4 weeks a bit dissapointing. Usually your pup was just getting into things.

I know it's only supposed to be an introduction.

[persephone]

I have since visited, not attended, one where there is no off leash play, and there is a LOT of focus on general manners and habituation. They expose the puppies to different noises and sights, and when the puppies do meet they are on leash and the owner is actively supervising and teaching them to be polite. There is very little actual obedience, they do recalls and sits, but I think that's about it. It's also a drop in class, which I think is awesome. You pay a set fee and then attend as many classes as you want until your puppy is 5 months old.

:) I quite like that sort of idea. Thanks for the input ..there are often posts on here , and I do wonder what sort of things are available ... I guess, too, that different formats suit different owners/dogs?

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[mumof4girls]

Agree Lizt , I would have liked to attend one that went longer and next time wasn't at a vet clinic , for a few reasons but mainly because I am still getting letters telling me i need to desex Rogue .. I also had to edure being told this at every lesson even though I explained I wasn't interested until at least 12mths if at all..

When I got Obi I went to 3 different puppy classes with him. The one I liked the most was one where the puppies are off leash, but taught to focus on the owner and do as they are told, inbetween play break. Occasionally they get to run around with the other puppies, but most of it was about focusing on the owner.

The other had some play time, then obedience stuff the rest of the time. It was alright, nothing special, focused a bit too much on obedience and very little on socialisation.

Then the last one was so bad that I only went twice and got a refund for the remaining two sessions. It was bascially a free for all playgroup where we didn't interact with our puppies at all, they ran around and did whatever they wanted (= the big puppies ran around, the small ones stayed on their owners' laps because they were too scared to play) and the instructor held a monologue about really basic stuff. The first hour he talked about housetraining, the next he talked about diet. I didn't stick around for more.

I have since visited, not attended, one where there is no off leash play, and there is a LOT of focus on general manners and habituation. They expose the puppies to different noises and sights, and when the puppies do meet they are on leash and the owner is actively supervising and teaching them to be polite. There is very little actual obedience, they do recalls and sits, but I think that's about it. It's also a drop in class, which I think is awesome. You pay a set fee and then attend as many classes as you want until your puppy is 5 months old.

Such diversity.

I also found the schools that finish after 4 weeks a bit dissapointing. Usually your pup was just getting into things.

I know it's only supposed to be an introduction.

[braeleighgirl]

I have attended 2 different ones and the one I liked the best was the mixture of basic obedience training as well as supervised and carefully selected off leash play.

We has two trained (not sure how much or what training they had) nureses with us and all puppies were supervised when in off leash play who they played with during off leash play was also selected eg big dogs with big dogs or quieter dogs with a dog who wasn't so excited.

I compared this with the one i did most recently where we rocked up the first time and told there would be no socialization and it was all basic obedience tasks, was boring for me given I had trained most of the basics at home having already done puppy pre school 12 months previously.

I think it was also a waste of time given that the class has 5 dogs in it and 3 of them were from the same family.

I have to agree I would prefer that it goes on longer than 4 weeks as I don't want to have to wait until they have had all their immunisations before they can start dog obedience and that they have just gotten into the swing of things and then it's over!

Also I have found prices vary greatly the two I did were $45 and $140

[Remarkabull]

I recently completed a 4 week puppy pre school. It was ok, mostly they promoted Science Diet and gave some pretty dodgy advice regarding behavior. I really only went for the socialisation and nothing else. I knew I would not take on board anything that I didn't agree with but it was scary how much some of the other owners did not know and were willing to believe anything that the 2 nurses said, even if most of it was crap!

I very quietly mentioned DOL to a couple of the owners as a great place to learn about dogs and I gave all my free samples (food, Frontline etc) to some of the other people there.

[espinay2]

For new puppy owners - something with a little structure, but also time for CONTROLLED play. One of the biggest issues I see with dogs who have been to puppy classes (and then go on to other obedience/training classes) is that they have often learnt to rush up and try and play with every dog they meet and consider class time to be free for all play time. Owners find it hard to keep their pups attention as all they want to do is drag their owners to the other puppies to play and their attention is on the other dogs and not their owners. Some owners often have a hard time as the pups have to unlearn what they learnt at puppy class and learn to focus on their owners more and wait for permission before approaching another dog. Learning to play and interact with other dogs is important, but it shouldnt be a free for all.

More informal groups for experienced owners are good too. Locally we have an informal 'breeders group' that meets to do just this. Basically just a group of people who know each other who meet up on a semi-regular basis for the mutual benefit of themselves and their dogs/puppies.

[Esky the husky]

The only reason I'm glad I went to puppy class was that Esky now LOVES visits to the vets.

[LizT]

Agree Lizt , I would have liked to attend one that went longer and next time wasn't at a vet clinic , for a few reasons but mainly because I am still getting letters telling me i need to desex Rogue .. I also had to edure being told this at every lesson even though I explained I wasn't interested until at least 12mths if at all..

When I got Obi I went to 3 different puppy classes with him. The one I liked the most was one where the puppies are off leash, but taught to focus on the owner and do as they are told, inbetween play break. Occasionally they get to run around with the other puppies, but most of it was about focusing on the owner.

The other had some play time, then obedience stuff the rest of the time. It was alright, nothing special, focused a bit too much on obedience and very little on socialisation.

Then the last one was so bad that I only went twice and got a refund for the remaining two sessions. It was bascially a free for all playgroup where we didn't interact with our puppies at all, they ran around and did whatever they wanted (= the big puppies ran around, the small ones stayed on their owners' laps because they were too scared to play) and the instructor held a monologue about really basic stuff. The first hour he talked about housetraining, the next he talked about diet. I didn't stick around for more.

I have since visited, not attended, one where there is no off leash play, and there is a LOT of focus on general manners and habituation. They expose the puppies to different noises and sights, and when the puppies do meet they are on leash and the owner is actively supervising and teaching them to be polite. There is very little actual obedience, they do recalls and sits, but I think that's about it. It's also a drop in class, which I think is awesome. You pay a set fee and then attend as many classes as you want until your puppy is 5 months old.

Such diversity.

I also found the schools that finish after 4 weeks a bit dissapointing. Usually your pup was just getting into things.

I know it's only supposed to be an introduction.

Don't let it worry you, it's probably just their data base. I got letters when my girls turned six months telling me it was a good time to desex them and why, despite the vets there knowing I show and breed.

[LizT]

The only reason I'm glad I went to puppy class was that Esky now LOVES visits to the vets.

Funny how some dogs get all anxious. All of my dogs love going to the vets and rush through the doors "singing out their arrival loudly". :D

[WeimMe]

I guess that you need to do some research first and find one that is in line with your beliefs about positive/negative reinforcement etc.

The one that I went to was good in terms of watching how the dogs interacted (we had a boisterous Bull Arab cross and a tiny fragile Italian Greyhound in together!) and very strict with vaccinations. The only thing that I felt could be improved would perhaps be an outline of class etiquette for dogs and owners at the first lesson. I would have loved for the first thing we learned how to have been how to train our dogs to sit quietly without bothering people/dogs/barking etc so that we could focus on what was being said. This wasn't covered at all - consequently spent about 80% of the class trying to get my dog under some semblance of control while neighboring pups were on long leashes jumping all over him and me with no attempt to stop them by their owners. I missed a lot of info that way and found it incredibly annoying.

There was also a lot of very obvious promotion for products sold at their store as well.

The course was good though, and I'll be taking my dog back for the next level soon.

[dancinbcs]

The one I use and recommend has no offlead time and no playtime. The owners are there to learn the basics of how to train a dog and the puppies are there to learn how to behave in the presence of other dogs and people. The last thing you want a potential show or obedience dog to do is want to play with every dog it sees. Learning to calmly accept the presence of other dogs is vital as is making sure the puppies are never frightened by another dog. At the end of 6 weeks the puppies can watch, come, sit, drop, heel, go to heel, put paws up on an object, get brushed, lie quietly on their side and bow.

[alpha bet]

We run puppy classes, have been for 16 years, but we do things quite differently than at most of the vets.

We have a private lesson first where we can talk one on one about any problems like toilet training etc plus we talk about techniques of living with dogs also how the classes operate and etiquette. We also then introduce their pup with my dogs/pups so we can have a chance to allow the pup to blend into social work.

Classes then are ongoing for as long as they feel the need and if they want they can move into an older class when they are ready.

We have dogs with different ages and size, sometimes shy older dogs find adult classes too much but can relax in a softer environment. We aim to show people how to enjoy working their pup but also how to reduce pups excitement energy when meeting new dogs. It is really important to allow new families plenty of time to ask questions as well as show them how they can even teach pups some tricks, this encourages them to keep working. We have 12 week old pups who can sit, drop, go to the mark, run thru a tunnel, walk on a see-saw. It is soo much fun I love teaching families.

[Mac's mum]

When I got Obi I went to 3 different puppy classes with him. The one I liked the most was one where the puppies are off leash, but taught to focus on the owner and do as they are told, inbetween play break. Occasionally they get to run around with the other puppies, but most of it was about focusing on the owner.

The other had some play time, then obedience stuff the rest of the time. It was alright, nothing special, focused a bit too much on obedience and very little on socialisation.

Then the last one was so bad that I only went twice and got a refund for the remaining two sessions. It was bascially a free for all playgroup where we didn't interact with our puppies at all, they ran around and did whatever they wanted (= the big puppies ran around, the small ones stayed on their owners' laps because they were too scared to play) and the instructor held a monologue about really basic stuff. The first hour he talked about housetraining, the next he talked about diet. I didn't stick around for more.

I have since visited, not attended, one where there is no off leash play, and there is a LOT of focus on general manners and habituation. They expose the puppies to different noises and sights, and when the puppies do meet they are on leash and the owner is actively supervising and teaching them to be polite. There is very little actual obedience, they do recalls and sits, but I think that's about it. It's also a drop in class, which I think is awesome. You pay a set fee and then attend as many classes as you want until your puppy is 5 months old.

Fuzzy82: this last one sounds great and I like the drop in idea. Do you remember the name of it? Or where it was?

Thanks!

[fuzzy82]

When I got Obi I went to 3 different puppy classes with him. The one I liked the most was one where the puppies are off leash, but taught to focus on the owner and do as they are told, inbetween play break. Occasionally they get to run around with the other puppies, but most of it was about focusing on the owner.

The other had some play time, then obedience stuff the rest of the time. It was alright, nothing special, focused a bit too much on obedience and very little on socialisation.

Then the last one was so bad that I only went twice and got a refund for the remaining two sessions. It was bascially a free for all playgroup where we didn't interact with our puppies at all, they ran around and did whatever they wanted (= the big puppies ran around, the small ones stayed on their owners' laps because they were too scared to play) and the instructor held a monologue about really basic stuff. The first hour he talked about housetraining, the next he talked about diet. I didn't stick around for more.

I have since visited, not attended, one where there is no off leash play, and there is a LOT of focus on general manners and habituation. They expose the puppies to different noises and sights, and when the puppies do meet they are on leash and the owner is actively supervising and teaching them to be polite. There is very little actual obedience, they do recalls and sits, but I think that's about it. It's also a drop in class, which I think is awesome. You pay a set fee and then attend as many classes as you want until your puppy is 5 months old.

Fuzzy82: this last one sounds great and I like the drop in idea. Do you remember the name of it? Or where it was?

Thanks!

Yep, it's the Canine Classroom, and they are based in Caloundra. They do use corrections for their obedience classes though. I think they only use verbal corrections for puppies and a lot of rewards, but the obedience classes are definitely not "reward based", and they use guiding/compulsion to get the dogs into position.

That being said, I've met a few of the dogs that have been through the classes, and they are very stable, friendly and well mannered. For a class that uses a lot of corrections they are good, and they do know what they're doing as all the trainers are certified.

[emgem]

The one I use and recommend has no offlead time and no playtime. The owners are there to learn the basics of how to train a dog and the puppies are there to learn how to behave in the presence of other dogs and people. The last thing you want a potential show or obedience dog to do is want to play with every dog it sees. Learning to calmly accept the presence of other dogs is vital as is making sure the puppies are never frightened by another dog. At the end of 6 weeks the puppies can watch, come, sit, drop, heel, go to heel, put paws up on an object, get brushed, lie quietly on their side and bow.

The one I went to sounds much the same. It was run by trainers and is really for novice owners with the main emphasis on training the trainers rather than training the dogs. My puppy was terrible because he was so unfocused in an environment where there were other dogs but the info and handouts enabled me to take the lessons home. They also had a vet come one day to give a basic health spiel on weight control, vaccination and parasite control.

They did have a short 10 minute play session at the end of each session. The dogs were separated by a combination of size and play style. They used the play session to talk about the importance of choosing your dogs play companions properly, how to supervise off lead play properly and the body language of dogs in play. This was probably one of the most useful things in the sessions. I live in inner city Sydney where there are lots of off-lead parks and lots of situations where my pup meets other off lead dogs.