Help What Would U Do Here?

[tamamala]

Hello All,

Just wondering what direction I should take on this problem?

I have had wolfhounds for years and my brother has always admired them but never had the land/time for one about 6 months ago he purchased a 3 month old female for 1200$ with vet check and microchipping included he has loved her since ! Then last week kill joy little sister (me) comes for a visit and takes one look at the lovely girls schnoz and lower jaw is about a cm back from where it should be!! had a look at the vet papers and theres no mention of this, surley they would have to put a defect as bad as this in there somewhere?

what should we do about this? he would never give her back now, help!

[Mim]

Was she purchased as a show dog or for breeding? If she is just a pet I see no reason to be concerned. I had a dog with a significantly overshot jaw and it didn't affect her.

Also, the dog is still growing, so the jaw could correct itself.

[Greytmate]

Hello All,

Just wondering what direction I should take on this problem?

I have had wolfhounds for years and my brother has always admired them but never had the land/time for one about 6 months ago he purchased a 3 month old female for 1200$ with vet check and microchipping included he has loved her since ! Then last week kill joy little sister (me) comes for a visit and takes one look at the lovely girls schnoz and lower jaw is about a cm back from where it should be!! had a look at the vet papers and theres no mention of this, surley they would have to put a defect as bad as this in there somewhere?

what should we do about this? he would never give her back now, help!

What are the vet papers? It is a conformation fault, and can lead to health problems, but it isn't always a health problem.

You need to make sure the lower canines are not damaging the palate behind the upper canines. Take the dog to your vet to check that if you are not sure.

Do you still have the receipt for the dog? You might have a claim against the breeder if there are health problems as a result of this, but no claim if there are no actual health problems and the dog is just a pet.

Lots of dogs are like this and it doesn't always cause problems.

[Dogsfevr]

Did the pup have a good mouth to start of with??

Mouths can go with age ,they can also return with age & when there head finishes growing.

A cm isn't anything to get excited over & infact is most likely a nice gap on a giant breed where there head doesn't mature until 2/3 yrs .

If its a concern then call the breeder first after all its the polite thing to do.

[BC Crazy]

Both of my Border Collies are overshots. I purchased both mine as pets & the breeder informed me of the comformation error. That is why they were for sale as pets otherwise they would of been kept for show dogs. They suffer no

issues with it apart from the fact my girl dribbles a bit & drinks lots cause of that. My boy wasn't as overshot as my girl & his almost corrected itself. There jaw continues to grow till about 11 months or so.My girls didn't

improved at all.

Did your brother buy his dog as a showdog? Cause you can't show a dog for confirmation with an over shot jaw. I know nothing about giant breeds but if they do take 2 to 3 years to mature it may correct itself, I don't know.

Bottom line though is if this dog was brought from a reputable breeder, firstly this problem should have been brought to his attention by the breeder prior to purchase. Secondly, the vet should have picked this up I would have

thought.

Edited March 18, 2012 by BC Crazy

[Christina]

Let the breeder know.

It may be a new mating for them so they need to know.

Also the vet should have picked this up & the breeder should have told him, unless it has gone like this as the pup has grown, which can happen.

Hopefully its merely cosmetic, which is the usual. Shouldn't be a health issue unless it goes extreme.

[BC Crazy]

Did the pup have a good mouth to start of with??

Mouths can go with age ,they can also return with age & when there head finishes growing.

A cm isn't anything to get excited over & infact is most likely a nice gap on a giant breed where there head doesn't mature until 2/3 yrs .

If its a concern then call the breeder first after all its the polite thing to do.

Interesting Showdog. Didn't know that. Love this forum. You can learn lots :)

[dancinbcs]

In some dogs the jaws grow at different rates, so a perfect bite at 8 weeks can be 1cm over at 3-4 months as the top jaw grows first, then the bottom jaw catches up by about 6-7 months. I have seen it happen in quite a few dogs.

Get your brother to call the breeder and ask if this tends to happen with their line. If it does it is probably nothing to worrry about. In a lot of breeds the mouth cannot be guaranteed. Quite a few show dogs of various breeds, run on by breeders, end up in pet homes because the bites go off as they grow. A lot depends on the breed and the lines so check with the breeder if it may or may not be a problem.

[helen]

I agree with showdog, and maybe it was fine when the pups were vaccinated. About vet checks - I attend what is known as the best veterinary clinic in the area, and when I asked about documentation for a vet check he said they dont do it, and said that if there is anything wrong with the puppy it would not be vaccinated as they would not be able to vaccinate a sick puppy, they would have to wait

[canine fun sports]

The two jaws have growth spurts at different ages, so there is often a gap between the front teeth of the upper and lower jaw in a growing pup.

If the lower jaw protrudes beyond the the upper jaw it is an inherited trait. This is a concern for breeders in most breeds, unless you breed one of the brachycephalic breeds eg boxer, bulldog etc.

If the upper teeth protrude over the lower teeth (aka "parrot mouth") this is an accident of growth, and not considered to be an inherited trait. In most cases in a puppy, the lower jaw will catch up, unless it is so exaggerated that the lower canines are caught behand the upper canines. The important thing, if this is detected in young puppies you should have the upper canines extracted as soon as possible (prefer 6 weeks) otherwise the the lower canine get "caught behind" restricting the growth of the lower jaw and the lower jaw cannot grow enough to catch up. Then, when the mature teeth errupt, the lower canines are often forced to bite into the hard palate which is painful and can cause probems in the older dog. If this is detected in an older dog, it can be corrected using an orthodontic plate, if you want to preserve the teeth (which lend strenth to the bone in the jaw).

So, if you have the upper teeth well in front of the lower teeth, just check to be sure the lower canines are still in front of the upper canines, otherwise veterinary attention may be warranted.

Cheers,

[ellz]

It happens is my first response.

What you should do depends upon a) the severity and b) the purpose for which your brother purchased the puppy.

If it was purely as a pet/companion then provided the issue doesn't affect her health, ie eating, then I probably wouldn't do anything.

As to whether a vet would pick this up. Some would, some wouldn't. For example, some vets do a cursory check of teeth, testicles, ears, eyes, heart and temperature with possibly a quick check of the mouth. If something is obviously wrong there might be a comment or a question as to whether this is a show or companion puppy with follow-up suggestions if necessary. For my part, to counteract this, I book an extra-long consult with the litter and have the vet complete a homemade health check questionnaire which I photocopy (keep myself) and put the original into the puppy folder so that the new owner can take it with them to the recommended visit with their own vet shortly after purchase (or for next needles whichever is first).

And yes, I agree with the others, a mouth anomaly in a youngster doesn't mean it will stay that way. Development can do funny things to bites. I have had puppies with beautiful scissor bites which have gone undershot or overshot at 18 months of age and I've had puppies with inverted canines or overshot bites come back to beautiful scissor bites after teething has finished.

[Greytmate]

If the upper teeth protrude over the lower teeth (aka "parrot mouth") this is an accident of growth, and not considered to be an inherited trait. In most cases in a puppy, the lower jaw will catch up, unless it is so exaggerated that the lower canines are caught behand the upper canines. The important thing, if this is detected in young puppies you should have the upper canines extracted as soon as possible (prefer 6 weeks) otherwise the the lower canine get "caught behind" restricting the growth of the lower jaw and the lower jaw cannot grow enough to catch up.

I think it is a genetic trait, and it is fairly common in greyhounds. I wouldn't have a dog's canines extracted at 6 weeks, that sounds very drastic for what may end up a very minor fault. How many people do that and what breed do they do it to?

I don't see how the lower teeth are 'caught behind' either. They sit behind the upper teeth in this fault, but I can't see how that would retard the growth of the jaw.

Do you have any references?

[canine fun sports]

If the upper teeth protrude over the lower teeth (aka "parrot mouth") this is an accident of growth, and not considered to be an inherited trait. In most cases in a puppy, the lower jaw will catch up, unless it is so exaggerated that the lower canines are caught behand the upper canines. The important thing, if this is detected in young puppies you should have the upper canines extracted as soon as possible (prefer 6 weeks) otherwise the the lower canine get "caught behind" restricting the growth of the lower jaw and the lower jaw cannot grow enough to catch up.

I think it is a genetic trait, and it is fairly common in greyhounds. I wouldn't have a dog's canines extracted at 6 weeks, that sounds very drastic for what may end up a very minor fault. How many people do that and what breed do they do it to?

I don't see how the lower teeth are 'caught behind' either. They sit behind the upper teeth in this fault, but I can't see how that would retard the growth of the jaw.

Do you have any references?

My reference is personal communication with David Clarke - Veterinary Dental Specialist, during my own consultations with him with one of my own dogs.

Cheers, Le Hammer BVSc

Edited March 19, 2012 by canine fun sports

[Heisspur love]

If the upper teeth protrude over the lower teeth (aka "parrot mouth") this is an accident of growth, and not considered to be an inherited trait. In most cases in a puppy, the lower jaw will catch up, unless it is so exaggerated that the lower canines are caught behand the upper canines. The important thing, if this is detected in young puppies you should have the upper canines extracted as soon as possible (prefer 6 weeks) otherwise the the lower canine get "caught behind" restricting the growth of the lower jaw and the lower jaw cannot grow enough to catch up.

I think it is a genetic trait, and it is fairly common in greyhounds. I wouldn't have a dog's canines extracted at 6 weeks, that sounds very drastic for what may end up a very minor fault. How many people do that and what breed do they do it to?

I don't see how the lower teeth are 'caught behind' either. They sit behind the upper teeth in this fault, but I can't see how that would retard the growth of the jaw.

Do you have any references?

My reference is personal communication with David Clarke - Veterinary Dental Specialist, during my own consultations with him with one of my own dogs.

Cheers, Le Hammer BVSc

I agree with showdog also. Is interesting to read canine fun sports comments also, as I didn't realise undershot jaw in canines was similar to parrot mouth in horses, which is not a directly heritable defect.